Do you trust Bovada?

[cjmoles]

You know.....(This kills me!) ???? I've been playing at every possible network and network skin for many years (10+ years), for several hours every day (10+ hours). I am an EXTREME fan of online gaming and support it's fairness 100 percent. I've been playing bodog (Pre-Black Friday) then Bovada (Post-Black Friday) for as long as I've been playing online. However, I have seen some very questionable play at Bovada, especially in recent times, which has me very suspicious. I can't eloborate because I have no specific player statitics or hand history database due to the sites anonymity. I am, however, familiar with variance both mathemtically and practically and I do believe there is no rational explanation for some of the play I've witnessed at Bovada, especially in the most recent time.

If it were my decision to play there, I would look into OpenSSL (Bovada's Software), RSA (OpenSSL's developers connection), and Dual_EC_DRBG (random number generator backdoor secutity concerns). I would also look into Kahnawake Gaming's history and research the scandals relating to superuser acounts at UB and AP. I would connect all the possible dots and then decide whether or not I'd feel safe deposting my money there.

The decision is personal. Due to the anonymity policy at Bovada it is difficult to say whether or not they're a safe site to play. At best, the answer can only be "possibly" because there is no transparency nor statistical knowledge base to make that determination.

I support online gaming; however, part of that support includes the willingness and the ability of the gaming community to analyze statical data and then question, report, and expose behaviors which deviate from normal frequecy. Bovada does not provide a means to make that analysis possible so, as a community, all we can do is connect the dots around the history of its software devlopers and licenced contributers.

 

[cjmoles]

At this time, I would recommend playing at one of WPN's skins: America's Cardroom, Blackchip Poker or Poker Host (in that order). They cater to the US market and offer a wealth of promotions. The gameplay is soft and they provide some really cool features, such as "Spin to Get in." The software isn't the very best but it is good. They put a large portion of their profits back into the site and they are HUD friendly and table manager compatible.

I would try WPN out before depositing at Bovada as long as Bovada remains so greedy with their promotions and non-transparent with their statistical data. There was a time when I endorsed Bovada (Bodog) above all, but times have changed....they're too greedy and secretive which makes me suspicious of their integrity.

 

[donkcentralFF]

Not to mention the story I have told on here about how Bovada still hasn't made good on the $3000 payout they sent me

 

[SlicketySlim]

Bovada

I actually contacted them about the large number of bad beats I have taken there, I have lost over 4,000 dollars there on the worst beats I have ever taken.

 

[TianLong]

Speaking of bad beats

I have never had this many bad beats in my life playing online poker since the old days when pokerstars, Full Tilt, Ultimate Bet, etc. were legal. I primarily play at Americas Card Room, Bovada, Carbon, Full Flush, and juicy stakes. These are my top 5 until PokerStars. But Bovada has got to be where I've taken the most and worst bad beats I have ever seen.

What I found that has helped me to play hands is counting using the fibonacci sequence and retracement % by counting per hand and where I'm positioned. It has helped me avoid when and where the bad beats will occur at least very close to it. So either I bet big to get a fold if I get a good read or fold myself.

To be honest, based on this, I don't think the cards are completely randomized at Bovada. Otherwise it's just sheer dumb luck lol

 

[Poker Orifice]

I actually contacted them about the large number of bad beats I have taken there, I have lost over 4,000 dollars there on the worst beats I have ever taken.

What was their response?

 

[Poker Orifice]

Not to mention the story I have told on here about how Bovada still hasn't made good on the $3000 payout they sent me

& not to mention that it tends to favour the initial raiser

 

[ScooperNova]

Bovada is the worst. Do you think they strive to find collusion? Almost all collusion is spotted by players. Kinda hard with anonymity. Where do you think colluders flock to?

 

[GoldCaps]

The whole anonymous player thing is rediculous. Makes cash no fun at all.

 

[Poof]

What was their response?

noted...

 

[donkcentralFF]

& not to mention that it tends to favour the initial raiser

Nice troll job tool .. That was like 5 months ago still havent seen money..

 

[Jackyl2190]

Zone seems like they want huge pots to collect a big rake

I been playing a lot of zone poker on Bovada, it always seems like the site makes it so you can get the most possible money into the pot so the house can collect a rake. When you are heads up and you both flop a set time and time and time again, what are the odds in real life that 2 people and only 2 people playing a hand flop a set? I believe its something like 1 in 8.5 chances to flop a set, but what are the odds of 2 people to flop a set? I understand if this was once in awhile but I have only flopped 9 sets this week and every time I was beat by a bigger set. Am I doing something wrong? or is this just a bad run?... Last example I held 10c, 10s, flop came 10 J 8. minimum raising, turn comes 8 pot is building half pot raising again, last card 9. we end up with the last of our chips in. and again he has JJ. Am I just playing my hand wrong? Just seems like Bovada wants you to get the most of your money in on a hand so they can collect the rake.

 

[ShoTyme]

I think Bovada hates your haircut.

 

[ScooperNova]

Bovada is garbage.

 

[Teetah]

Bovada Win and then string of bad beats

I finished 5th in the 10,000 Guarantee at Bovada and won $704. After that, I have had a string of bad beats and pots called that should not have been called only for the river to bust me over and over. I don't know if they are cheating or I have just been donked out on and fished deep. I have never had that much bad luck of beats though before I cashed the $704 and I have been playing strong poker. Donkeys live on that site.

 

[Acehigh562]

I think all sites are program the same they are built to even out the playing field that's why u see so much suck out so beginners could keep up with the pros and in doing that they will attract new players that's just how I see it and I do see a lot of action flop everywhere I play bigger rake for the sites.

 

[mya name]

Do you trust Bovada

Bovada is the worst. Do you think they strive to find collusion? Almost all collusion is spotted by players. Kinda hard with anonymity. Where do you think colluders flock to?

collusion is a possible problem with ring cash and sit and go anywhere.
you cant be colluded against HU and zone or large tourneys.

 

[Poker247]

Well I play at Bovada, but a poker friend just send me the following info.... I'm quite worried now.

https://www.pokertube.com/poker-news/poker-gossip-opinion/bovada-poker-rigged-398

It sounds like collusion is happening definitely, and there is talk about a "back door" which to me is even scarier.

 

[Jguar]

Ill be honest. I reallllly realllly wanted to like bovada. I really need to be able to play mobile as im always on the move. It also seems as bovada has fairly quick cashouts. But ifeel ive been cheated there multiple times. Ic you just type rigged online poker or poker scam in google bovada comes up 20 to 1 vs anyother poker site. Worst thing that happened to me was at a cash table. Guy goes all in preflop. I look down everyone folds and somehow i insta called??? I was on my phone mind you so there's no "call any" button. And even if there was i would never hit call any preflop r u kidding. Needless to say this was bovadas excuse and when i said i wad on mobile they had no answrr except "what happens, happens." i was so furious ilogged riggt off and called customer service...that was over half my freakin bank roll. Worst part is i ha Ad/8h and he had Ah/9d....seemed extremely fishy to me. I was not accusing them of having employees that were "super users" like half the internet does. I was in the end begging them tho just investigate the individual which never happened. I don't know..the whole thing seemed absolutely insane. I could not believe it. Who would go all in on a cash table pre flop with a/9 off? Its just ridiculous. Let alone wtf would i call with a/8 off. Bovada really insulted my intelligence just insinuating that i did such a thing. I could see it being the end of a mtt and last 2 players making those moves but wtf. I've also seen a multitude of strange plays there. Tons of insane underdog stuff. Pocket anything,even a/a, hardly ever wins a hand...just strange. Mind you this is all in cash tables and zone poker. Tourneys ive had diff experiences. But I've also seen tons of complaints about them planting players in mtts to take 1st and keep the prize pool. This would be the biggest poker scandal ever if a whistle blower did uncover them. Its just wierd how many people complain about that site specifically....why don't they just take the anonymity thing away. .would make many people feel much better....

 

[Jguar]

I've also heard that when you cash out expect to have a horrible run afterwards until you lose almost an equal amount of $$$. Why would so many people be saying the exactv same things on soo many different sites and forums?

 

[Jguar]

I been playing a lot of zone poker on Bovada, it always seems like the site makes it so you can get the most possible money into the pot so the house can collect a rake. When you are heads up and you both flop a set time and time and time again, what are the odds in real life that 2 people and only 2 people playing a hand flop a set? I believe its something like 1 in 8.5 chances to flop a set, but what are the odds of 2 people to flop a set? I understand if this was once in awhile but I have only flopped 9 sets this week and every time I was beat by a bigger set. Am I doing something wrong? or is this just a bad run?... Last example I held 10c, 10s, flop came 10 J 8. minimum raising, turn comes 8 pot is building half pot raising again, last card 9. we end up with the last of our chips in. and again he has JJ. Am I just playing my hand wrong? Just seems like Bovada wants you to get the most of your money in on a hand so they can collect the rake.

To be
Honest man i woulda been outa there bc of the straight draw.i could see you were very pot committed by the end though so u gotta stay.. But that seems like a pot building technique bc its happened to me tons! I flop 2p or a set, then bby the river it ends up being 4 suited on the board due to turn and river....a suite of which i obviously don't have. Only chance at that point bc im so pot committed is to hope he has a low flush n try to bet him out. But why did he stay in the pot in the first place with just 3 suited cards on the flop n nothing else. Find that very often. Someone hits great on the flop but by the river their hand looks like shit. .ALL THE TIME.

This stuff doesn't happen to me on ACR..i mean yea youll get bad beats but not these crazy situations time and time again. Btw sorry if parts of my posts sound a lil screwy, im on my phone using swype..

 

[freestocks]

I trust Bovada and any site that pays and feels like I have an even chance.

 

[Jguar]

lol go play some cash rooms at bovada freestocks. mtt's are a different story (although i guarantee youll never get 1st or 2nd, maybe even 3rd)...they are hard to just get robbed in. In all honesty i will never deposit on bovada again. even their blackjack is a setup. everytime you see a face card, the other card is a 10 or a face card. ALWAYS!!! it's insane. I played probably 50 hands of blackjack on a bonus they gave me the one time...it was the most bs ive ever seen lol. I really think somethin fishy is up with bovada...they work through china or some shit so they'd probably never be able to be prosecuted if anything was ever recorded. But that's impossible due to the anonymity of the site. Answer this, what is the point of anonymity? Really. To me it seems like it could cause nothing but problems on the player side. Say a player really does hack the site or the game or whatever and can see everyone elses cards or some shit like that. How would anyone EVER figure it out. Most scandals and collusions are caught by players. I'd say 99%. I find the whole anonymity very unsettling.

 

[or3o1990]

Bovada's customer service has been excellent for me personally. I've never had a problem with a check arriving or cashing in the expected time and I like the anonymity honestly. I hope more sites move towards it. It protects the fish which is good for everyone and it forces regs to play dark against one another which I also don't mind. As the anonymous systems progress they should certainly be working harder to do something about the collusion though because it is more of a problem with anonymous play for sure.

As far as the abnormal play, I think that the anonymity should kind of speak for itself. Nobody knows anybody they're playing so naturally you're more able to make really out of line plays for a couple of reasons. One being that because no one knows who you are, so you can get mad or bored or just out of line for no reason without any repercussions. If you decide to go all monkey for a couple of hands on PS you have to face your opponents everytime you play still afterwards which I'd imagine is at least a slight deterrent. Also when players first sit they like to spazz. I see this all of the time. A lot of players who just sat in are more inclined to bluff you in a crazy aggro manner. I've then seen these players get called and loose a bunch then they immediately leave the table most times. I've also seen them double up quickly then rock up afterwards. I feel the anonymous nature creates a different style to the game where a lot of what happens isn't standard compared to non anonymous play.

 

[smallfrie]

If a game for money can be cheated it will be cheated. That goes for live or online. The best you can hope for is to play on the site with the best reputation for security/integrity or regulation in your jurisdiction or live at a legal regulated casino. Even the biggest casinos with all their security fall victim to cheats another problem is when the casino or site is the cheat but that is (I think and hope) much more rare than player cheats but it has happened before , I hope it isn't happening anywhere now but... "Caveat Emptor"