Micro(2nl-25nl) cash game thread-October (Strat only)

[baudib1]

I'd fold, having JsJx blocks a ton of his drawing range, and he looks aggressive so I'd expect him to bet or c/r his draws a decent portion of the time -- there are only 8 combos of JT and you'd expect him to cr some stuff like ATss/T9ss.

This is pretty important, imo, and it will probably help your game a lot if you think about the hands he could be bluffing with.
It's probably closer to a call with 9d9h because of the extra combos of draws that he might call flop and bluff river with -- twice as many combos of JT and a few more spade hands like J8s/J9s, etc. (essentially 99 = JJ here)

I'd expect him to have Kxs a lot.

Edit: You're better off putting in like 80 cents on the turn than calling this (Barring a more specific read than his stats).

 

[Stu_Ungar]

Let's get the strat going again!

Setmining/making-moves 140bb deep in 3bet pot vs showdown nit

No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (5 handed)

Button ($50)
SB ($97.28) - 19/16/14, 3bet = 5%, WTSD = 19%, W$SD = 82% - 350 hands.
BB ($60.45)
UTG ($21)
Hero (MP) ($71.91)

Preflop: Hero is MP with 6

, 6

1 fold, Hero bets $1.50, 1 fold, SB raises $4.75, 1 fold, Hero calls $3.50

Flop: ($10.50) 5

, 4

, 3

(2 players)
SB bets $6.25,

Spoiler

Hero raises $15, 1 fold

Total pot: $23

Results:
Hero had 6

, 6

(one pair, sixes).
Outcome: Hero won $30.27

Are my ideas are flawed?

Firstly, I felt as though I almost had implied odds to call this hand considering we were a little deeper than the usual 100bbs. However, when I made the call I was hoping to hit a flop that I could also bluff at if I missed my set, and man were the poker gods listening! I figured this guy was even capable of folding AA if I turned up the heat on the flop. Of course in this instance he prob only had AK or something.

Also bet sizing wise, how am I doing, is 15 about right? I'm pretty unsure in lots of spots about the sizing of my bets. I guess I should seek out some literature on the subject...

I really dont like the way this hand is played.

"I felt as though I almost had implied odds to call this hand"

then raising his flop bet makes no sense.

Against an opponent whose range is narrow weighted towards hands he wont fold postflop you are getting the majority of money in behind if it all goes in on this flop.

You are a huge underdog to 77 here.

Granted your play works when you consider fold equity but your preflop call was based on you having little FE postflop.

If you are against a guy who can easily lay down QQ+ on flops like these then you do not have implied odds.

Make your mind up, either your preflop assessment is wrong or your post flop play is wrong. You cant make a preflop call on the basis that this guy never folds and then raise over his bet knowing that if he calls you are behind.

 

[micromachine]

I'd fold, having JsJx blocks a ton of his drawing range, and he looks aggressive so I'd expect him to bet or c/r his draws a decent portion of the time -- there are only 8 combos of JT and you'd expect him to cr some stuff like ATss/T9ss.

This is pretty important, imo, and it will probably help your game a lot if you think about the hands he could be bluffing with.
It's probably closer to a call with 9d9h because of the extra combos of draws that he might call flop and bluff river with -- twice as many combos of JT and a few more spade hands like J8s/J9s, etc.

I'd expect him to have Kxs a lot.

Its true I didn't really consider that he was aggressive and might c/r his good flush draws (I have started doing this, it is great because it doesn't look like you are drawing to a flush and you can get paid when you hit).

I always consider that villain may have missed flushes or straights on a board like this but I probably wasn't thinking about my Jacks being blockers to the straights, so yeah I do need to think more about what they may be bluffing with.

As for him having a K, I think a player like this would surely bet the turn, which was one reason for calling, along with the missed draws reason.

In the end, I was right this time, no idea why he called the my flop bet though...probably trying to float.

pokerstars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (6 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($8.14) 28/25 (70 hands)
BB ($2.66)
UTG ($2.19)
MP ($8.08)
CO ($3.93)
Hero (Button) ($4.03)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J

, J

3 folds, Hero bets $0.15, SB calls $0.13, BB calls $0.10

Flop: ($0.45) K

, 4

, Q

(3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $0.32, SB calls $0.32, 1 fold

Turn: ($1.09) 6

(2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($1.09) 8

(2 players)
SB bets $1, Hero calls $1

Total pot: $3.09 | Rake: $0.15

Results:
Hero had J

, J

(one pair, Jacks).
SB had 5

, 5

(one pair, fives).
Outcome: Hero won $2.94

 

[WVHillbilly]

In the end, I was right this time, no idea why he called the my flop bet though...probably trying to float.

In the end, as long as you realize calling was still wrong, you'll be fine.

 

[Cafeman]

Make your mind up, either your preflop assessment is wrong or your post flop play is wrong. You cant make a preflop call on the basis that this guy never folds and then raise over his bet knowing that if he calls you are behind.

This is pretty much the response I expected.

Can we never have a situation where we think that we might have options on the flop. For example, I'm pretty sure he would bet more on the flop if he had an overpair, hence in this case I wasn't getting an overpair to fold but rather AK or some such to give up its equity. So because we're a little deeper than normal, can't I call and see a flop with this guy who plays pretty face up, or are we always folding pre here? That's why I put the title as "setmining/making moves".

I guess as WV says, it's a pretty thin call either way.

 

[Cafeman]

In the end, I was right this time, no idea why he called the my flop bet though...probably trying to float.

Wow, a delayed OOP float... well someone's gotta do it!

 

[baudib1]

I'm not sure someone that weak-tight is bluffing A-high there.

 

[baudib1]

People resist the idea of folding pairs preflop, so instead of playing set-or-forget, they turn them into bluffs.

To be fair it should have worked this time.

 

[Stu_Ungar]

This is pretty much the response I expected.

For example, I'm pretty sure he would bet more on the flop if he had an overpair, hence in this case I wasn't getting an overpair to fold but rather AK or some such to give up its equity. So because we're a little deeper than normal, can't I call and see a flop with this guy who plays pretty face up, or are we always folding pre here? That's why I put the title as "setmining/making moves".

I dont think you can make that read. His betsize is correct to get the money in over 3 streets. To get it in over 2 streets he has to overbet the pot or CR. A CR on a drawy board isnt a good idea as you might check through.

 

[micromachine]

Wow, a delayed OOP float... well someone's gotta do it!

Lol, is that even still called a float??

 

[baudib1]

it's just a regular OOP float.

 

[kainoel89]

Ok I'm in a moving from my journal to here. Hope we can get a lot of micro diary writting guys here. I'll be back with my intro thread.

 

[micromachine]

Ok I'm in a moving from my journal to here. Hope we can get a lot of micro diary writting guys here. I'll be back with my intro thread.

Welcome to the thread but...
Errr how can you have a journal with only 2 posts lol, and....isn't that the exact sentence Vlad wrote when he first posted ITT

 

[RVladimiro]

I guess that if the sentence was "I WANTZ FREEROLZ LOLZ!" would be too obvious.

 

[KerouacsDog]

what kind of volume has everybody had so far this month? Ive had a pitiful 3k of 2nl, sad really, but Ive been working lots of hours. thinking about moving some of my roll to PS from next month and grinding 5nl.

 

[micromachine]

18K, its a story of rags to riches...to rags

 

[JOEBOB69]

OK screw it i'll get back on the grind soon.

 

[micromachine]

So for on my HUD I have:

Line1: Name / hands / VPIP / PFR / AFQ
Line2: 3bet / Fold to 3bet / att to steal / Fold to steal / c-bet / Fold to c-bet

Now, this only gives me preflop and flop info, so I'm wondering what other stats I should add to get some info about later streets, and also how to use them?? I might not even add them to the HUD just look them up in the pop-up window. Was thinking WTSD and W$SD could be useful?

 

[taaron]

My volume is up a bit, as I just started doing 6 max, instead of FR.
In hindsight i am very glad that I started w/ FR becuz of my prior experience (MTTs/SnGs), however i also wish i would have read some of the study material and books sooner and moved to 6m a month ago. In 2 days I have 3k hands.

Am also making sure I am studying more than playing, atm.

The goal is still the same: to play @ least 25k+ hands at 2nl/4nl before considering a new level.

 

[orangepeeleo]

I don't use the WTSD type stats, i use the popup to have a look at the raise first in stats nearly every hand though, not a stats guru but i think you need these stats in your life if they're not already there!

Just noticed, I also have the turn cbet stat nowadays too, helps with quickly spotting who I can float.

 

[WVHillbilly]

I don't use the WTSD type stats, i use the popup to have a look at the raise first in stats nearly every hand though, not a stats guru but i think you need these stats in your life if they're not already there!

Just noticed, I also have the turn cbet stat nowadays too, helps with quickly spotting who I can float.

If that's the case why not just add it to your HUD??

Right now I have removed all stats from my HUD other than number of hands and I have it set color conditional. When it turns green (100+ hands) I'll take a peak at the basics if I need to but until then I just go with what I'm noticing from a player. Helps that I'm only playing 4 tables so I got lots of time to pay attention.

 

[orangepeeleo]

If that's the case why not just add it to your HUD??

I like having a small and neat HUD, i only have like 2 panels with a line in each of them, plus i've noticed that if i make myself hover over the stat i need for the RFI stats to appear then it gives me that 2 or 3 secs to think a bit more about the hand, kinda stops me making auto-decisions i guess.

EDIT: When i said popup in my original reply i meant the smaller popup that appears when you hover and not the big popup that you get when you click

 

[micromachine]

OK screw it i'll get back on the grind soon.

Good Where are you gonna play?

 

[micromachine]

Bit of a long post, sorry! This is not a bad beat post, it is partly about psychological effect of losing a stack and how it affects the next few hands for the winner and loser relationship and it's partly about how to play aces after the flop.

In the first hand I stack the guy (I shouldn't be calling 3bets with 77, I know). He basically should always fold to my flop bet right?

Anyway, he reloads and about 2 or three hands later I pick up AA and am thinking this could be a good opportunity to stack him again because he is probably tilting a bit (or a lot). I'm happy when he calls my massive 3-bet and I'm heads up against him. Here I should be happy to shove the flop?? Or was that totally reckless?? The fact that he may be tilting means he may call with something like K9 or TT or AK (I was hoping) but could also mean he called with air and may have the 6. So maybe I should have bet less and assessed the situation on later streets idk.

This brings up something i often wonder about. Is it better to always play aces hard and fast against a single villain, or does slow playing have any merit? I mean, you are happy to go all in preflop vs a single opponent so why wouldn't you be happy to put your stack in gradually over 3 streets? The outcome is the same and in fact you may be more likely to get his money by not scaring him off with a shove preflop.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($10.14)
SB ($10.05) 29/19, 8.3% 3bet, 70 hands
BB ($19.13)
Hero (UTG) ($12.85)
MP ($14.40)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 7

, 7

Hero bets $0.30, 1 fold, Button calls $0.30, SB raises to $1.20, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.90, Button calls $0.90

Flop: ($3.70) 10

, 7

, 5

(3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2.60, 1 fold, SB calls $2.60

Turn: ($8.90) 4

(2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $9.05 (All-In), SB calls $6.25 (All-In)

River: ($21.40) 8

(2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: $21.40 | Rake: $1.04

Results:
SB had K

, A

(high card, Ace).
Hero had 7

, 7

(three of a kind, sevens).
Outcome: Hero won $20.36


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG ($10.03)
MP ($10) 29/19, 8.3% 3bet, 70 hands
Button ($18.98)
Hero (SB) ($23.06)
BB ($13.45)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A

, A

1 fold, MP bets $0.30, 1 fold, Hero raises to $1.60, 1 fold, MP calls $1.30

Flop: ($3.30) 8

, 6

, 6

(2 players)
Hero bets $21.46 (All-In), MP calls $8.40 (All-In)

Turn: ($20.10) 4

(2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($20.10) 9

(2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: $20.10 | Rake: $0.99

Results:
Hero had A

, A

(two pair, Aces and sixes).
MP had 6

, 9

(full house, sixes over nines).
Outcome: MP won $19.11

 

[orangepeeleo]

In the 2nd hand the flop shove is bad, unless you know he'll call with any pair there, only because you lose value from hands that won't call a shove there but will probs be good for another street of value at least, drawing hands, 99 55 77 A8, they might call a shove, but theyre def more likely to call like a $2.70 cbet, plus all the broadway overs he might float you with too.

I might be wrong but it seems like you lose a lot of value from hands which may come along, hands he may try and bluff you with on later streets, given that he b/c pre this looks like a way to make sure your only called by any 6x or 88