Fishmasterbaiter
Visionary
Silver Level
Yes
From what I understand of my own research this is spot on true. I agree with you 100%
From what I understand of my own research this is spot on true. I agree with you 100%
I
ifloldway2much
Rising Star
Bronze Level
what are you in highschool????
how in the world did you come to that conclusion.
real men play poker, not dumb conspiracy theorists
oh i told you so??
i guess you had a bad breakup recently.
was it her and not you???
and you believed her?
get out of here
Cajin007
Visionary
Silver Level
So, I was Correct!
Seems I was correct in my assessment of you being a BOTter.
Your anger betrays you.
And, yet it is you who throws insults with absolutely no clue.
Whats the matter, Truth hurt?
Btw, when you become a REAL MAN, let us know!
Oh, 14 days to respond. Pathetic, probably like your poker skills.
Seems I was correct in my assessment of you being a BOTter.
Your anger betrays you.
And, yet it is you who throws insults with absolutely no clue.
Whats the matter, Truth hurt?
Btw, when you become a REAL MAN, let us know!
Oh, 14 days to respond. Pathetic, probably like your poker skills.
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ironduke11
Rock Star
Silver Level
have seen too many cases especially on pokerstars where I couldn't be truly random....there has to be an element of design where the cards come out in favor of certain hands at certain times....case in point 62off open shoves just before the break I snap with aces and get done by two pair...
John_3_16
Legend
Silver Level
RNG's are just one area of distrust. Like all slot machines in use today have an RNG that can be changed to payout at different rates. Some casinos claim rates higher than 95% but almost none of them tell the customers when these rates are changed to pay out below the 95% norm. That "random" payout is controlled exactly to the percentage point. IMHO not random at all.
The real question is not the randomness but the control the site has over how that randomness performs. True randomness would mean unpredictable. Code & a machine prevents this. If a human writes the code & a human oversees the machine using it then the possibility always exists for interference leading to predictable outcomes.
Super Users seeing the hole cards is a huge advantage. But knowing the flop, turn & river is complete advantage. Super Users are a fact. They have existed, even been prosecuted, & could exist today. Any RNG physically available to humans is always questionable as to random outcomes. They could be honest but are they?
And I do believe that more than one RNG can be interchangeably used so everyone is affected as they are pulled or placed into play. The RNG algorithms could be placed into a subroutine where even which one was used would be randomly decided. Lot of options available to the honest & dishonest operators.
God bless.
The real question is not the randomness but the control the site has over how that randomness performs. True randomness would mean unpredictable. Code & a machine prevents this. If a human writes the code & a human oversees the machine using it then the possibility always exists for interference leading to predictable outcomes.
Super Users seeing the hole cards is a huge advantage. But knowing the flop, turn & river is complete advantage. Super Users are a fact. They have existed, even been prosecuted, & could exist today. Any RNG physically available to humans is always questionable as to random outcomes. They could be honest but are they?
And I do believe that more than one RNG can be interchangeably used so everyone is affected as they are pulled or placed into play. The RNG algorithms could be placed into a subroutine where even which one was used would be randomly decided. Lot of options available to the honest & dishonest operators.
God bless.
Q
Queenlimp
Rock Star
Silver Level
There is literally no way to answer the curiosity.
If the nerds have not figured it out yet, I doubt a recreational player will.
If it is or not, the most practical approach is to play a game your confident in.
There is a style played online to best suit each individual's expectation.
To mention non-randomness to another player will hurt the asker's game.
1. because they actually expect some type of scientific response
2. even if an answer was obtained, the average player would probably not be able to validate the proof
3. someone clearly must play often because someone is frustrated by losing and compelled to ask the question
4. the speculation only justifies losing, because a winner would not complain
5. the asker becomes focused on scandal, not improving
6. the majority of online players lose, so their opinion does not matter; they just keep playing and losing; but don't fail to offer an opinion, suggesting that they are smart and rationalizing long-term losses by offering every explanation other than themselves
Anything can happen on any hand. Professional Gus Hansen attests to this. I've also seen Phil Hellmuth crying about stupid-based winning hands often, yet continues to be one of the best in the long run. Not online poker, but poker in general.
The true answer does not matter. The most important consideration is: do you like to play poker online? If so, come up with a way to win because there is a style that will enable each desiring player to be a winner!
Be a winner and randomness will not be so important to create distraction.
I was heavily distracted by this subject at one time, only to realize I enjoy playing online poker. This is not an excuse for a rigged RNG; but the math guys, a BIG PLAYER, or politician will eventually bring it into correction, if in fact a crime has been committed.
Until then, enjoy your past-time or find something else to do! (like, spend quality time with your wife!) Shot out to Daniel Negreanu who is a masterful player and says balance and quality time with his family helps him play his best. That at one time it was important for him to take a sabbatical from poker and spend time with his family.
No disrespect, just a perspective I believe can help a lot of people who enjoy and will continue to play online poker regardless of their suspicions!
If the nerds have not figured it out yet, I doubt a recreational player will.
If it is or not, the most practical approach is to play a game your confident in.
There is a style played online to best suit each individual's expectation.
To mention non-randomness to another player will hurt the asker's game.
1. because they actually expect some type of scientific response
2. even if an answer was obtained, the average player would probably not be able to validate the proof
3. someone clearly must play often because someone is frustrated by losing and compelled to ask the question
4. the speculation only justifies losing, because a winner would not complain
5. the asker becomes focused on scandal, not improving
6. the majority of online players lose, so their opinion does not matter; they just keep playing and losing; but don't fail to offer an opinion, suggesting that they are smart and rationalizing long-term losses by offering every explanation other than themselves
Anything can happen on any hand. Professional Gus Hansen attests to this. I've also seen Phil Hellmuth crying about stupid-based winning hands often, yet continues to be one of the best in the long run. Not online poker, but poker in general.
The true answer does not matter. The most important consideration is: do you like to play poker online? If so, come up with a way to win because there is a style that will enable each desiring player to be a winner!
Be a winner and randomness will not be so important to create distraction.
I was heavily distracted by this subject at one time, only to realize I enjoy playing online poker. This is not an excuse for a rigged RNG; but the math guys, a BIG PLAYER, or politician will eventually bring it into correction, if in fact a crime has been committed.
Until then, enjoy your past-time or find something else to do! (like, spend quality time with your wife!) Shot out to Daniel Negreanu who is a masterful player and says balance and quality time with his family helps him play his best. That at one time it was important for him to take a sabbatical from poker and spend time with his family.
No disrespect, just a perspective I believe can help a lot of people who enjoy and will continue to play online poker regardless of their suspicions!
Cajin007
Visionary
Silver Level
I'm a winner, not a massive one, but I do ok.
I still believe it's possible to rig, and is done so to help sites combat collusion/BOTs.
If my play mirrors a BOTs, then getting taged means I need to work on my game.
In a way, looking to see if it's rigged, forces one to examine aspects that reveal flaws that are present.
As the saying goes, "trust no one, especially yourself!", after-all we are poker players.
I still believe it's possible to rig, and is done so to help sites combat collusion/BOTs.
If my play mirrors a BOTs, then getting taged means I need to work on my game.
In a way, looking to see if it's rigged, forces one to examine aspects that reveal flaws that are present.
As the saying goes, "trust no one, especially yourself!", after-all we are poker players.
Q
Queenlimp
Rock Star
Silver Level
I'm not suggesting the game is rigged or not.
My point is that if playing the game, a person should focus on what improves their game because even if the game is rigged, there is an approach that maximizes winning potential.
While there may be nothing wrong with asking the question or having curiosity, I question if certain mindsets would benefit from the preoccupation.
My point is that if playing the game, a person should focus on what improves their game because even if the game is rigged, there is an approach that maximizes winning potential.
While there may be nothing wrong with asking the question or having curiosity, I question if certain mindsets would benefit from the preoccupation.
malakata19
Visionary
Silver Level
malakata19
Visionary
Silver Level
Definitely the least random and most selective is pokerstars and 888 are still in order betonline, party poker and the best would be for my americas cardroom, all this I say based on my experience in those rooms.
Although pokerstars says that it handles the RNG with hardware as it shows a video from a few years ago, I do not agree with which is the best option, simply because the flaws in a software can be corrected and even more improve the same software but in hardware I understand this type of corrections is more complicated.
Although pokerstars says that it handles the RNG with hardware as it shows a video from a few years ago, I do not agree with which is the best option, simply because the flaws in a software can be corrected and even more improve the same software but in hardware I understand this type of corrections is more complicated.
C
chippyrob
Rock Star
Silver Level
that is a seriously good question because i often feel cheated by the so called random draws for instance when im all in with K10 against 2 players who both have JJ and lose because of runner runner runner spades or clubs or whatever suit i dont have when i flop 10 K and im well ahead... the reality is in real life this happens quite rarely but on pokerstars its literally every other hand... pokerstars for me is massibely untrue due to every hand almost being a showdown hand its unrealistic but i do play there for sports section mostly although i get enticed into poker every time :/ i ohnestly believe on that site it has nothing to do with skill because i watch youtube videos of profesional players who get screwed over by players hitting thier 1% ers every time almost .... just my opinion
...
is it random hell no
robert
...
is it random hell no
robert
ironduke11
Rock Star
Silver Level
nope I don't think it is, I've watched pokerstars video explaining their shuffling but id wager they have alternate systems and that they can intervene and deal specific hands for specific outcomes if they choose...
I remember watching a sunday million replay where the chip leader with 4 players left agreed to a chop but wanted an unreasonable amount of money
the players decided to play on and within three hands his chips stack was gone and he was out kk to aa
now could it have been random....sure
likely it was that he pissed everyone off including the dealer and his tournament was over there and then before he knew it...
I remember watching a sunday million replay where the chip leader with 4 players left agreed to a chop but wanted an unreasonable amount of money
the players decided to play on and within three hands his chips stack was gone and he was out kk to aa
now could it have been random....sure
likely it was that he pissed everyone off including the dealer and his tournament was over there and then before he knew it...
barbados
Legend
Platinum Level
Personally, I have doubts that the generation of cards in online poker is random. I often noticed that the loser comes across strong cards and a good deal. But not always - I will notice for the sake of justice.
F
fundiver199
Legend
Loyaler
Why would a poker room even care, if players in a tournament agree to a deal or not? Its a service offered, and the easiest for the pokerroom is, if no deal is made, because then its all just automatic. Of all the silly theories, I have heard about "rigged poker rooms", this one take the price
ironduke11
Rock Star
Silver Level
ill give you the benefit of not having seen the conversation between the dealer and the table...if you had seen it you wouldn't have been so quick to dismiss what I was saying...
but understanding is a thing that is clearly lacking in society....
but understanding is a thing that is clearly lacking in society....
Why would a poker room even care, if players in a tournament agree to a deal or not? Its a service offered, and the easiest for the pokerroom is, if no deal is made, because then its all just automatic. Of all the silly theories, I have heard about "rigged poker rooms", this one take the price
puzzlefish
student of the donk arts
Loyaler
Ask any poker room auditing company what they measure when it comes to the fairness and randomness of RNGs on a poker site. They will tell you: distribution of cards and the likelihood of any particular draw to be dealt (i.e. a flush, a straight, etc.). There are expected numbers for these measurements.
Then ask them if they spend any time at all seeing which players hit the draws and when. They will tell you they don't look at that.
So tell me then, how does one determine randomness of collision events (i.e. multi-player draws) taking place? It's not being measured, yet so many are convinced it is all random. What gives?
How do you measure how often the river card should complete both someone's two pairs and someone else's flush? How often should a straight flush complete for both the bottom and top straight flush? How is it that audit companies don't look at this at all and yet nobody cares?
View attachment 250528View attachment 250530
Then ask them if they spend any time at all seeing which players hit the draws and when. They will tell you they don't look at that.
So tell me then, how does one determine randomness of collision events (i.e. multi-player draws) taking place? It's not being measured, yet so many are convinced it is all random. What gives?
How do you measure how often the river card should complete both someone's two pairs and someone else's flush? How often should a straight flush complete for both the bottom and top straight flush? How is it that audit companies don't look at this at all and yet nobody cares?
View attachment 250528View attachment 250530
F
fundiver199
Legend
Loyaler
There is no human dealer in an online poker game. Its a computer shuffling the cards. The person, you are talking about, is a staff member not a dealer.