Worak
Legend
Bronze Level
Annoying ? Yeah.
Unethical ? Yeah.
Effective ? Yeah.
You can call me any name if I make the money and you are out I don't care
- I made the +EV decision.
Stop whining, practice it yourselves whenever appropriate.
Annoying ? Yeah.
Unethical ? Yeah.
Effective ? Yeah.
You can call me any name if I make the money and you are out I don't care
- I made the +EV decision.
Stop whining, practice it yourselves whenever appropriate.
Dagon7
Rock Star
Silver Level
Just my 2 cents, but I do think it works, I would never do it but when it's done it put's me on tilt pretty quick. Personally I try to respond as quickly as possible to anything to avoid having a pattern and scrutiny, so call 67 as quickly as AA and fold just as fast. Keeps em guessing.
Lemlywinks
Legend
Silver Level
LOL
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smashbot
Rising Star
Bronze Level
i've experienced this in the ferg sat freeroll on the bubble.
i felt that it was necessary to run the clock since all the other tables were doing it. if i didnt do it, i would be at a faster pace compared to the other tables. this would cause the orbit to reach me first.
so in my short stack bubble situation, it was the optimal thing to do since top 100 is money/win.
i felt that it was necessary to run the clock since all the other tables were doing it. if i didnt do it, i would be at a faster pace compared to the other tables. this would cause the orbit to reach me first.
so in my short stack bubble situation, it was the optimal thing to do since top 100 is money/win.
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cAPSLOCK
Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
It was really quite funny.
dweezel
Rock Star
Silver Level
Two times in the past 6 mos., I was on the "bubble".If I busted everyone got paid. I stalled like crazy till the bubble burst , and then got on a heater and ended up winning the tourney. You do what you gotta do to get to the $$$.
Yes it may be rude but its a +EV
I owe nobody nothing at the poker table..... its war and you do what it takes.
And for the record I'm 52 yrs old and have no self esteem issues .....I think !:burnout:
Yes it may be rude but its a +EV
I owe nobody nothing at the poker table..... its war and you do what it takes.
And for the record I'm 52 yrs old and have no self esteem issues .....I think !:burnout:
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witl69
Rock Star
Silver Level
There are no sorrys in poker and I think that every person plays the game as they see fit and to benefit them the best...I find this perfectly acceptable I think that you have to do whatever you need to do in a given situation ...to advance your position in the game and potentially win if that means buying pots and stealing blinds when in position then so be it but also if it means takeing your time and advanceing into the money then so be that too ...to each his own I always say
Jillychemung
Stacks & Stacks
Loyaler
Amen brother :congrats: I will never apologize for a suckout or badbeat I give someone nor will I ever hesitate to to use all of the play clock that a site provides for me to use if I think it is to my advantage to do so.
dj11
Legend
Silver Level
The case for short stack stalling is made. Why might a big stack stall?
The big stack can actually counter (to a degree) the short stack stalling tactics, by also stalling. If the big stack stalls along with the shorties, then the effective blind time (hands per blind level), is reduced and the shorties have to abandon their stalls or risk getting only one or two hands per blind level (slightly exaggerated).
This tactic would require a pretty healthy stack but experience shows me it has an effect on short stack stalls. Shorties get a bit anxious, and go against their better interests and stop stalling, or speed up a bit. The faster you can make a shorty make decisions, the less smart those decisions will be.
It helps to comment about your big stack stall at the table making sure the shorties know what you are doing. Tell them you will be stealing their time.
You may not like stalling online, but it is a fact of life and online poker, and bringing in pride, dignity, poker ethics (HA!!!)etc. etc, is silly. It's about the game, in all its facets, and time is a big part of the game, and thus time management is a big part of the game, thus stalling or not stalling is your best weapon in this aspect of the game.
The big stack can actually counter (to a degree) the short stack stalling tactics, by also stalling. If the big stack stalls along with the shorties, then the effective blind time (hands per blind level), is reduced and the shorties have to abandon their stalls or risk getting only one or two hands per blind level (slightly exaggerated).
This tactic would require a pretty healthy stack but experience shows me it has an effect on short stack stalls. Shorties get a bit anxious, and go against their better interests and stop stalling, or speed up a bit. The faster you can make a shorty make decisions, the less smart those decisions will be.
It helps to comment about your big stack stall at the table making sure the shorties know what you are doing. Tell them you will be stealing their time.
You may not like stalling online, but it is a fact of life and online poker, and bringing in pride, dignity, poker ethics (HA!!!)etc. etc, is silly. It's about the game, in all its facets, and time is a big part of the game, and thus time management is a big part of the game, thus stalling or not stalling is your best weapon in this aspect of the game.
M
masiado
Rock Star
Silver Level
If I"m in a tournament and had a fairly secure chip, I would rather stall than fight it out with the other players. In a tourney specially when there are more than 500 entries, the first thing you have to do is to have a big chip lead. After you have done this, stall and let those small chip players fight out among themselves. When there are few players left in the tourney, that"s the time to play aggressively.
Velutha
Visionary
Silver Level
The Cobra Kai Test
As we all know, only a Cobra Kai would ignore the General Karate Rules:
1.) Attacking illegal targets.
2.) Using illegal techniques.
3.) Running out of bounds. <---- Translates to Stalling as a strategy....Wax on....
4.) Falling to the floor to avoid fighting. <---- Cleary he's not a staller though....Wax off....
5.) Continuing after being ordered to stop. "Can we please not cloud up the threads with personal attacks at other members" <---- Uh oh....Strike 1
6.) Pushing, cursing, or vindictive conduct. <---- ".....who are trying to get shit done." Strike 2!
7.) Gross disrespect to opponents or judges <----"Kids that have an over-inflated ego and self-worth when in fact they haven't done anything" Whammy! Strike 3!
Conclusion: SWEEP THE LEG!!! This is clearly a Cobra Kai representative!!! Bow to your Sensei!
As we all know, only a Cobra Kai would ignore the General Karate Rules:
1.) Attacking illegal targets.
2.) Using illegal techniques.
3.) Running out of bounds. <---- Translates to Stalling as a strategy....Wax on....
4.) Falling to the floor to avoid fighting. <---- Cleary he's not a staller though....Wax off....
5.) Continuing after being ordered to stop. "Can we please not cloud up the threads with personal attacks at other members" <---- Uh oh....Strike 1
6.) Pushing, cursing, or vindictive conduct. <---- ".....who are trying to get shit done." Strike 2!
7.) Gross disrespect to opponents or judges <----"Kids that have an over-inflated ego and self-worth when in fact they haven't done anything" Whammy! Strike 3!
Conclusion: SWEEP THE LEG!!! This is clearly a Cobra Kai representative!!! Bow to your Sensei!
wachinpntdry
Visionary
Silver Level
close to the bubble with a shortstack....
there is NOTHING unethical about stalling... the name of the game is to finish as high as you can.....pushing in pf with marginal cards when you know 100% you're gonna be called is just suicide bingo
it's actually a SMART stratgey to just let others bust out before you...
why should a player be in a hurry to pay more blinds and antes when he knows if he just hangs in there a few more minutes he will cash
yes it's annoying sometimes, but it's far less annoying than when the shortstack at the table is all in, and 2 or 3 or more players fatten the pot by calling with rags ...... all those chips, along with blinds and antes quintuple or more the shortstack allowing him to hang around
i see that happen so often it's sickening... bigstack plays 10, 4 off and figures no big deal cause if shortstack wins it only costs them a few chips....faulty tournament strategy IMO....
if shortstack is all in, near all in.....dont fatten the pot, if you got a good hand then take him out....but dont play rags
yer in SB and shortstak is BB and half his chips are in ...unless you got a decent hand...makes more sense to fold ..let him have your SB......makes more sense than double or tripling him
there is NOTHING unethical about stalling... the name of the game is to finish as high as you can.....pushing in pf with marginal cards when you know 100% you're gonna be called is just suicide bingo
it's actually a SMART stratgey to just let others bust out before you...
why should a player be in a hurry to pay more blinds and antes when he knows if he just hangs in there a few more minutes he will cash
yes it's annoying sometimes, but it's far less annoying than when the shortstack at the table is all in, and 2 or 3 or more players fatten the pot by calling with rags ...... all those chips, along with blinds and antes quintuple or more the shortstack allowing him to hang around
i see that happen so often it's sickening... bigstack plays 10, 4 off and figures no big deal cause if shortstack wins it only costs them a few chips....faulty tournament strategy IMO....
if shortstack is all in, near all in.....dont fatten the pot, if you got a good hand then take him out....but dont play rags
yer in SB and shortstak is BB and half his chips are in ...unless you got a decent hand...makes more sense to fold ..let him have your SB......makes more sense than double or tripling him
mjdavinci
Rock Star
Silver Level
It depends on why you are stalling. I think that if you are doing it to make a decision that is fine. But if you are doing it to just to make the other players mad I feel that is not right. You already know if you plan on playing the hand as soon as your cards are dealt play them. If you are doing it as ploy sometimes to throw off another player that is part of the game. But to just stall for time Imo is wrong.
nevadanick
Back to work ... zzzzz
Silver Level
It isn't shown very often on the wsop coverage, but stalling is used regularly by many WSOP players approaching the various payout levels. Using the clock for an advantage is a strategy, no matter how you view it.
There are also disadvantages to using up your available clock time, especially the extra time provided normally to allow reconnects online. If you use it all up, it isn't there when you might really need it.
All tools are there to use. Whether you utilize them or not is at the discretion of the player.
There are also disadvantages to using up your available clock time, especially the extra time provided normally to allow reconnects online. If you use it all up, it isn't there when you might really need it.
All tools are there to use. Whether you utilize them or not is at the discretion of the player.
frisellan
Rock Star
Silver Level
Stalling is lame fo-sho but sometimes you got to do what you got to do.
The more times I can see cards per blind level is to my advantage. If I am so short stacked that this becomes irrelevant and I am one away from the money I might just lag a bit. It is certainly annoying when others do it.
The more times I can see cards per blind level is to my advantage. If I am so short stacked that this becomes irrelevant and I am one away from the money I might just lag a bit. It is certainly annoying when others do it.
RogueRivered
Visionary
Silver Level
Time management is an important strategy in many types of games -- poker is no different. I won't go into any specific strategies, but there are good ways to play given your current situation that take time and the bubble into consideration, whether you are the big stack, the short stack, or somewhere in between. To play exactly the same way no matter the time or prize ladder situation doesn't make a lot of sense.
Edit: Being annoyed with other players for playing their time management strategies as they see fit doesn't make a lot of sense, either. You know what you're getting into before you sign up. Stalling isn't unique to online play. It's common in world-class live tournaments, too.
Edit: Being annoyed with other players for playing their time management strategies as they see fit doesn't make a lot of sense, either. You know what you're getting into before you sign up. Stalling isn't unique to online play. It's common in world-class live tournaments, too.
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Igrac
Enthusiast
Silver Level
This is really effective in Sit and Gos and maybe MTTs that are down to two tables. When you use it in the middle its really just annoying because while it will hurt short stacks people are often mixed around to difffernt tables
VerbalKint
Rock Star
Platinum Level
I agree with FatBasset that poker is about winning money. Its not about people playing the "wrong" or "right" way. If it helps you win then fine, do your thing. Nothing personal against GSpicoli but sometimes you come off with the attitude of picking on people becuse you don`t agree with how they do or see things, well that stinks in my book. I personally don`t have an issue with that strategy, I just deal with it.
wachinpntdry
Visionary
Silver Level
stalling with the chiplead makes no sense.....you want more hands to be played....more hands, more people bust...
stalling is for shortstack near the bubble or at any point where theres an increase in payout....
RogueRivered
Visionary
Silver Level
As chip leader, I think it's in your best interest not to have people bust out while on the bubble. Better to keep them there, making it easier to steal blinds from the mid-size stacks. Once the bubble is broken, you might want to sit back and watch them fall like dominoes, then get back to your aggressive ways once things start to calm down a little.
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BM0529
Enthusiast
Silver Level
I would try to avoid anything "unethical" I've seen it all and I haven't by any means played billions of tourneys...everything from a player who was just in the big blind, told to move to another table and upon seeing he was to be the BB again at the new table did a very bad job of pretending to "accidentally" drop all his chips on the floor and then take an insanely long time to pick them up....to a player requesting the floor to come over for a discussion on arguing where another player's beer was sitting in which was a glorified stall tactic.
silverslugger33
Rock Star
Silver Level
I'm pretty big on table etiquette and IMHO this is very unethical. Play poker. If you play the best poker and you don't get unlucky, you'll win. You shouldn't win by taking advantage of other people and stalling, for whichever reason it may be.