To limp or not to limp

[Ronaldo7]

And what when you get raised?? If you raise small pair you can put opponent on a hand after his move depending if he calls or reraises, this way you are folding to any c bet after miss floping set, and by betting you can easily win it with c bet against one caller... Initiative has its advantages after flop too...

 

[ByronP]

limping is for the non aggressive player or someone whom is relatively new to the game. when you limp in it gives better odds for marginal hands to call. giving them the opportunity to see the flop for cheap. you don't want people with those crappy connectors or suited cards to limp into the pot and then suck out on you. If it is worth the call it is worth the raise.

 

[Poker Orifice]

Limping can be good in some instances but not in the ones you've suggested.

You also put yourself in spots like this one

You can let BB get there with some 'BB Special' & get yourself into spots where you have no clue if you're ahead.
You also take away so many opportunities to 'represent' hands by C-betting certain boards that villain would assume to be hitting your open-raising range.

uke:

 

[gryphon3005]

Jankou I agree with your comments about limping and, I don't like the "rule" because there are too many ways to find an exception to the rule. Like you said, limping can make sense. When I am in a turbo mtt with a less than average stack the fast changing blinds often place me in a spot where raising 2.5 or 3BBs is too much when you risk an all-in response.

And, I've done exactly what you did with AK and lived to tell the tale while other big hands went bust when some guy with 5 7 off suit won the pot.

 

[Tylor Mendez]

limping in AK is a terrible play imo. It would be ok ish in later stages when you want to bait someone but still I consider it very weak.

By limping in you are giving other players a chance to cheaply see the flop. So many players with connector or suited cards would tag with you for the ride. So when they connect with the flop, your hand becomes worthless.

But if you did raise 2.5-4BBs they aren't likely to call because their chances preflop are not that good.

I'll give an example that happened to me. In the middle stage of a tournament about 20 players left. (40 player sit n go) I was like the least stack in the tournament. I was in the BB with 10,3 offsuit. Hi jack calls. others fold. I check. the flop comes 10,3,9. Me hitting a pair. He min raises. I call. Turn comes something like a 6. He goes all in. I don't have any other play than calling so I call. He show pocket aces. I win the pot with two pairs.
If he did raise preflop I would've probably folded without a second thought. He tried to slowroll me and paid the price.
Eventually I won the tournament.

They call that a big blind special.

 

[xbronk]

I think that pokerstars poker school rules do not apply to your website I've seen so many AKs die against marginal hands so many times that I play in that same way as you said it is not a premium hand until you hit a pair good luck greetingsuke::top:

 

[Jankou36]

Limping can be good in some instances but not in the ones you've suggested.

You also put yourself in spots like this one

You can let BB get there with some 'BB Special' & get yourself into spots where you have no clue if you're ahead.
You also take away so many opportunities to 'represent' hands by C-betting certain boards that villain would assume to be hitting your open-raising range.

uke:

Sorry 'bout that (I'm RomanKluska123 if someone don't know). I played in three tournaments then while writing with friends and didn't think too much about how i was playing.
That thread is old. I was playing poker for maybe few months then, and currently my strategy is much different, I even don't trying to write about this, cause every decision consists of so many factors, but still I think it should be more intuitive (not emotional), than strictly following rules, the experience gives that knowledge and... i'm still limping with suited connectors and pocket pairs. I don't like blind stealing, cause it's just too risky, often people losing half of their stacks or more with medium hands, cause they just want to make someone fold, maybe i should learn more about it, to do it safe and profitable, HUD here is probably crucial and can't find working one on the Ubuntu (don't have time to configure fpdb). Anyway I play only after work and I'm not pro or super profitable. Also I play micro stakes and freerolls, today played in $5,5 Christmas Freeze and I see it's completely different - I couldn't limp there, cause every hand was raised to at least 2BB. I was near paid places and lost in 3-way allin, I got AQs, 2nd guy A6o, and last 88 or something like that (we all had ~10BB left), so I don't feel it went wrong.
Under the line - I also don't agree with the most of mine posts from year ago, but limping in certain situation seems to be good, like with suited connectors and pocket pairs, but it is also determined by the stack size and opponents.

 

[Jankou36]

One more thing about the hand you showed, i should have fold after you go allin, but i didn't care too much about this tournament at that point, so i called for fun.
I have problem with hands like that, don't want to raise too high preflop in bad position, cause i'm scared that someone will raise much higher and i would fold, but is it better to limp and then raise on the flop? What do you think?

 

[playinggameswithu]

In MTT limping makes a lot of sense. Lower volatility,keeps weak hands in needed,no chance for 3 bets, plays the hand steady post flop, really cheap flops. Although I always raise AK just think about it for couple minutes never limping with that dominate Ace high and 65% of the time I avoid calling all in with it.

In Cash game limping is obvious mistake at the beginning that can be fixed. Do not limp select your pre-flop hands in cash game.

 

[ZenGreen]

DONT LIMP, DONT CALL LIMPS - RAISE THEM

Play poker not Bingo. Dont start limping just cause you lose a few pots.

JUST DONT LIMP

 

[UncleConRon]

My opinion

You actually never limp like that. You limp like this you have ace king hit the king ace and limp again hoping the other player will go all in.

 

[Poker Orifice]

One more thing about the hand you showed, i should have fold after you go allin, but i didn't care too much about this tournament at that point, so i called for fun.
I have problem with hands like that, don't want to raise too high preflop in bad position, cause i'm scared that someone will raise much higher and i would fold, but is it better to limp and then raise on the flop? What do you think?

Part of your opening range should also consist of hands you'll open-raise with & then fold to a 3bet (or allin shove). Just because they raise... you don't need to 'call' (unless you're getting such a good price you must call.... ie. you raise into some short stacks, 1 of them shoves & now you need to call because you're getting 'the right price'). There's times you need to reconsider opening into shortstacks... 'when you can't' (or don't want to) be faced with needing to call them.

Your strategy of 'limping suited connectors & small-medium pairs' isn't a good one in most instances for MTT play. Just one simple example:
players sitting with approx. 50bb stacks
You're dealt 87s in MP... you open'RAISE'...
BB calls.
Flop - A- 6-2 ... you C-bet (& chances are you are taking it down)... you 'Rep' the Ace (or can be many other flops that you can Rep after opening with a raise from say eMP, MP, HJ, etc.). If you're just limping.... unless you're 'balancing' that by limping your big pairs & say 88-JJ as well... and AJ-AK, your opponent will know "he's limping SC's & low-med. pairs... maybe some A-Xs stuff too". By limping & 'hoping you'll hit' (& if not, get away cheaply) you're basically playing a 'fit or fold' type of game postflop. << This is weak. It might be okay as a total beginner but it really won't give you any success as you move beyond playing in say the CC freeroll with many other new (& bad) players.

I would try to get into the habit of 'not limping'.

gl gl

 

[proud2Bwhack]

only limping with small pairs and suited connectors is such an obvious move, its terrible! your going to get three bet from position by smart players holding K-5o.

i think you can make limping work, it would take practice and great reads.

 

[proud2Bwhack]

and deception and aggression...

 

[liuouhgkres]

Good to see that in 2019 there are still people limping.

 

[Jankou36]

so why should i risk 4BB to get 2BB?
Now i had 25BB and get AK, player before me limped, I raised to 3BB, rest folded. JT6 on the board, he is going all-in... Maybe thanks to the raise i removed rest of the players, but still most of the time someone stays.
I will try to change my play strategy to don't limp and post result. In current tournament it didn't gave me much. Postflop raises in position seems to be more important and effective. Ofc when BB are small, 3xBB raise makes the pot more attractive.

 

[THEBLUEJAYY]

BETTING BIG WINS POT

BETTING LIKE 420 OFF THE FLOP WINS MOST TIMES

 

[anasslaaleg]

Limping the cards is very a good gun stratégie to play passive and late the other players raise but sometimes, limp is bad idea you must to choose betwin playing agressive or passive, some hands you must to defend or bluff .
Limp is retamble with aggressive player but if player in the table is Passif is bad play, to depend on situation.

 

[perrywh]

I limp some. Showing weakness wins me pots in tournaments. One of my favorite moves on the turn. Some tables you can only win playing aggressive aggressive. Every table I have found to be different. Playing millions of hands and you learn how to play different tables. Play Play Play and Play some more.

 

[TheDude6622]

I think your both right...
In your example above the other risk is that a players with small stack will 'always' take a chance of calling a 2x or 3x bet because they are desperate. In your example if the player had AK and shoved and you did to because your on BB and small stack you would have flopped a win.

AK is even weaker than say... pair 2s, it's a race which I usually lose.

Very true. It is always hard to make a pair in poker! If you have like 3 or 4 people in the pot, you have to think that some of your outs are gone.

 

[dimon4ik89]

Earlier during the game I limped on a good card too. Because of this, I often lost and could not understand the reason. After I began to raise on a good card, I began to win a lot more hands and my game changed for the better. I think PokerStars is taught right in school, you have to either raise or pass. Limpy can only go to the average card such as KJ KQ and so on.

 

[Jankou36]

Limping the cards is very a good gun stratégie to play passive and late the other players raise but sometimes, limp is bad idea you must to choose betwin playing agressive or passive, some hands you must to defend or bluff .
Limp is retamble with aggressive player but if player in the table is Passif is bad play, to depend on situation.

I agree with you. It should depend on the situation on the table, in some cases it will be more profitable to limp, in other you should raise. Stack, position and opponents strategy should be consider, I think it's more complex than just saying "never limp", cause with mediocre, or good hand under the gun in bubble phase, when most of the hands are preflop allin's, your raise would be wasted if you don't want to call allin. Of course those situation are rare, anyway few hands in the tournament can be limped, especially when the atmosphere is becoming tense (lot of allin's). I have bit different strategy than most of the players, that is an effect of my experience, however I don't play too much in stakes like more than $2.
When most of the players seems to fight for a few BBs, often risking half of their stacks, I'm on the other side of the table, waiting for opponents bluff and doubling my stack few times in the tournament, and it perfectly works in the most of micro stakes tournaments I play. If I see that someone is too aggresive it is easy to exploit.
Anyway in other cases i rather also raise, in early stage to force fold and get bigger pot, in medium stage to force fold. Don't like to bluff or play lottery and prefer raising high postflop.

 

[roterdama]

Limp!

Me somtimes limp and when i limp i get 3 bet , so i try no make limp calls. But somtimes limps works and its feels good when you cathc nuts, so good luck whith limps

 

[greatgame230]

Hi, I am in total agreement with you that many times doing limp is the right thing to do, I think that at school they teach it so that you can take the initiative and be aggressive, but sometimes this can be very expensive especially in the sit & go but to be fair they do not take into account all the factors that can be presented in a tournament like the opponents that we have to face many times if you know how the players who are at the table react so you can see very clearly if being aggressive is profitable or not

 

[Pete Ski]

sometimes

limping has it's place but like anything in poker there are a lot of factors. If you are short stacked then the only argument for limping would be a monster such as AA or KK. This move is pretty transparent and many players will see right through it. When you are deeper it makes sense to sometimes limp small pocket pairs or suited connectors that have the potential to flop huge.