$2 NLHE Rebuy: Quadruple All-In

[nevadanick]

Your not delusional....just extremely stubbornly a winning pokahz player.

FYP ...

I am going to end myself right now.

promises... promises... promises...

Lol read my thread that just won thread of the month and come talk to me.

IF your thread was about MTT's ... I just might do that... but it is NOT. Ring games are NOT MTT's. Probably explains why so many ring nlhe players bring their ring game to an MTT event.

Lol I've come to realize it's an age thing...I think it's harder for young people to get a handle on the concept of EXPERIENCE. Not meant to be a shot just an observation. You obviously don't get even the most basic concept of MTT poker.... WE KEEP PLAYING IN MTT's WHEN WE DON'T MAKE MISTAKES ...

FYP ... again.

... REGARDLESS OF WHETHER WE WIN OR LOSE THE HAND. Like if we give this hand to any MTT pro they will all say the exact thing I'm saying.

I'm sure there might be some serious MTT players that would agree, but there are MANY that would not. I've played with them... and against them in my 45+ years at the tables. There might be even more (so-called) pros who would agree if it were ONLINE MTT's. Bust out... buy again... and again... and again... and again.

Me? I'll stick with I know is tried and true for me and keeps me playing.

BTW - congrats on the ring game thread of the month ...

 

[rileyl]

I'm sure there might be some serious MTT players that would agree, but there are MANY that would not. I've played with them... and against them in my 45+ years at the tables. There might be even more (so-called) pros who would agree if it were ONLINE MTT's. Bust out... buy again... and again... and again... and again.

Me? I'll stick with I know is tried and true for me and keeps me playing.

Um can someone clear this up for me...are we not talking about an ONLINE MTT?

Lol oldtimers

Also your edits just show your complete lack of knowledge when it comes to the way in which we should think about poker.

 

[GeoffLacey]

it's the thread that keeps on giving!

 

[SavagePenguin]

Fold.

For all the reasons stated in Harrington on Hold'em Volume II
Page 234, Example 4
(A/K vs a shove, with even smaller M's which makes you far less desperate)

Basically it's too much risk and not enough reward for that situation.

 

[rileyl]

Fold.

For all the reasons stated in Harrington on Hold'em Volume II
Page 234, Example 4
(A/K vs a shove, with even smaller M's which makes you far less desperate)

Basically it's too much risk and not enough reward for that situation.

It's a $2 Online MTT where people will stack all sorts of random crap. Harringtons book isn't written about this sort of game so using it as a reference is pretty dumb. I can't believe how something that can be explained so easily through math and logic causes some people so much problems.

 

[Snowmobiler]

It's a $2 Online MTT where people will stack all sorts of random crap. Harringtons book isn't written about this sort of game so using it as a reference is pretty dumb. I can't believe how something that can be explained so easily through math and logic causes some people so much problems.

[ ] provided math or logic to justify this bad play


Snow

 

[Marginal]

After everything against these particular hands, we have 48% equity in a 4 way pot. Based on the action of the hand, it is pretty hard for persons to have AA and KK because of cards being discounted. So we never end up bad and worse case senario we are still in a +ev place. Nuff said? It is so early on in the tournament that we need to be getting into these spots, later on in a tournament when the pay increases happen then it may become closer because of ICM but because it is this earlier and we are really far away from the money and we are looking to win this tournament which means we must accumulate a lot of chips then we have to get it in. Now, if you want to, at best, min cash and be like chainsaw then fine, fold but it is not a good move if you want to win.

The fact that this is a 2$ mtt is also something that needs to be considered. 2$ players are really bad and overplay crap hands. This is not the ftops/wcoop/scoop/wsop. These people suck.

 

[SavagePenguin]

It's a $2 Online MTT where people will stack all sorts of random crap. Harringtons book isn't written about this sort of game so using it as a reference is pretty dumb. I can't believe how something that can be explained so easily through math and logic causes some people so much problems.

TPC explained it pretty well, I just don't think you can grasp it.

A call (which is essentially a shove) here is usually a coin flip at best. They just so happened to have the bottom of their range there. If someone had 6/6 it's a bad call as it's an unnecessary risk for not enough reward.

I realize that people call with crap, but the rebuys are over and you are in the long stretch where you try to accumulate chips with minimal risk.

It would be really interesting to compare the ROI's of people who think this is an insta-call/shove as opposed to those who let A/K go here. These situations come up a lot, and I expect the people who can let the hands go are going to be the ones who do better overall.
It's just too much risk for not enough reward. Surviving at this point is more important than winning the pot here.

If you sharkscope me on Full Tilt, I'm SavagePenguin
If you Sharkscope Snowmobiler on Full Tilt, he's Urajackazz

It'd be different if the opener had was a chronic opener, and the shover was apt to make a move back at him. But with no reads, fold.

I'm not sure how many strategy books you've read, but I don't know of any that think that a risk like this is justified.

 

[Marginal]

TPC explained it pretty well, I just don't think you can grasp it.

A call (which is essentially a shove) here is usually a coin flip at best. They just so happened to have the bottom of their range there. If someone had 6/6 it's a bad call as it's an unnecessary risk for not enough reward.

Isn't it pretty much proven that we are not a coin flip at best? They stack KQ here so saying that we are in a coin flip at best is pretty flawed logic.

And I could not give a damn what your ROI is. It does not mean that your opinion has more weight that others. So if you are talking about ROI and ITM you are just leveling yourself.

 

[Marginal]

Also, the people saying it is early so we should not take the risk. You are mistaken, this is the time to take risk.

 

[TPC]

Taking a risk for 75% of your stack when you have an M of 52 is just stupid. There will be plenty of better spots with less risk to earn chips.

I'm still waiting for the math riley is talking about.

 

[TPC]

Isn't it pretty much proven that we are not a coin flip at best? They stack KQ here so saying that we are in a coin flip at best is pretty flawed logic.

SP already said it just so happens that all the callers are calling with the bottom of their range here. You'll see a middle pair in this situation more often than not.

 

[jewboy07]

I'm with TPC on this. It's a fold... wouldn't even have to think twice.

thats probably because you're a super nit and don't understand the game...

Also, the people saying it is early so we should not take the risk. You are mistaken, this is the time to take risk.

id like to quote this too just because it's a simple concept that shouldn't get overlooked.

It's all been said already.

and this.

im not personally going to waste my time trying to explain why folding is a super huge mistake since marginal and others can't help you guys see the light but kudos to the people who aren't completely retarded and know that this is a call every single time.

 

[pifan]

There are a few who say folding here is bad play because it is a 2 dollar tourney, ranges are wide, we are ahead most of the time.
do you make the same play when it is a higher buy in,the players ahead of us ranges are tighter, and we are behind or flipping most of the time.
I also believe folding here is the correct play.


What amazes me is that the seasoned (didn't want to call us old ) think fold is the better route to go here, and the youngsters (wish someone would call me that ) are saying to get it in here, is there just a difference in playing styles between us old and the young.Well i mean older and younger

 

[Marginal]

There are a few who say folding here is bad play because it is a 2 dollar tourney, ranges are wide, we are ahead most of the time.
do you make the same play when it is a higher buy in,the players ahead of us ranges are tighter, and we are behind or flipping most of the time.

You do realize that this has nothing to do with anything right?

And the difference is that you guys are obvious nits

 

[bubonicplay]

nevadanick you talk about being a winner do you play any mtts over $20 online? Because if you do I would be absolutely shocked. Like seriously I don't proclaim to be an mtt genius or anything but almost every mtt I've played is over $20 and I'm showing a profit and I highly highly doubt you can say the same thing. Pointing to results about how you crush the nanostakes donkfests as proof that your terrible logic that anyone who wins at reasonable stakes at poker cash or tournaments realizes is wrong is just laughable to me.

And if anyone here does play $20+ and is up for a friendly challenge to see whether nitting it up can win the $20 180-man challenge still stands.

Or we could just play HU cash or HU sng which would be far more fun/interesting. Warning though I don't fold AK preflop.

 

[pifan]

You do realize that this has nothing to do with anything right?

And the difference is that you guys are obvious nits

I am just pointing out that sometimes the correct play is to fold AK. By your comments i feel you come across that it is always the correct play to call preflop with AK here. which i am sure you are not saying, but to someone reading this thread will end up saying "In no case will i fold AK preflop"

but i really think i do fold here.

and BTW whats wrong with being a little nitty

and also your Bert avatar is way cool, who is going too use Ernie?

 

[Marginal]

Anybody applying a specific situation in a specific hand to all situations is way to dumb to even be on this forum. That is why saying it was a higher buy in game is irrelevant. Anyway, if you want to use the Ernie avatar, go ahead

 

[pifan]

Anybody applying a specific situation in a specific hand to all situations is way to dumb to even be on this forum. That is why saying it was a higher buy in game is irrelevant. Anyway, if you want to use the Ernie avatar, go ahead

you really think there are not a few of these here on the forum oh thats right you dont play the cc freerolls and the cc buyins

and no id rather be Bert than Ernie seeings my name is Albert and most of my friends call me Bert (well the one or two i have)

 

[Epik High]

There is so much LOL in this thread I cant stand it.

TPC, you went at stoved it.Well assuming you actually know maths then its always a +EV call. That is ofc unless you come from the Phil Hellmuth school of poker. Then just snapfold!

 

[TPC]

There is so much LOL in this thread I cant stand it.

TPC, you went at stoved it.Well assuming you actually know maths then its always a +EV call. That is ofc unless you come from the Phil Hellmuth school of poker. Then just snapfold!

It's obvious you were never hooked on phonics.

I know math and poker stove is saying we are only winning 26% of the time. We are risking way too big of a chunk of our stack with little reward. To make that call we need to be getting 4 to 1. You are all stuck on the hands that actually called in this specific hand. We are seeing the bottom of everyone's range, that just doesn't happen that often.

Our M is huge, we don't need to take big risks at this stage in the tourney, I don't get why this is so hard to understand.

 

[SavagePenguin]

I also believe folding here is the correct play.

What do you know, agreeing with us! I see you've earned the fish logo as well.

Even though TPC is blocked, I've played enough with him to know he plays about the same as us.

It would be really interesting to compare the ROI's of people who think this is an insta-call/shove as opposed to those who let A/K go here. These situations come up a lot, and I expect the people who can let the hands go are going to be the ones who do better overall.

Yeah, it sure would be.

 

[Marginal]

Now post number of games played plz.

 

[Epik High]

It's obvious you were never hooked on phonics.

I know math and poker stove is saying we are only winning 26% of the time. We are risking way too big of a chunk of our stack with little reward. To make that call we need to be getting 4 to 1. You are all stuck on the hands that actually called in this specific hand. We are seeing the bottom of everyone's range, that just doesn't happen that often.

Our M is huge, we don't need to take big risks at this stage in the tourney, I don't get why this is so hard to understand.

lol, well its obviously going to tilt me to make a detailed response as to how youre like..incorrect.
so im just gonna conclude by saying lol PH itt!

 

[Epik High]

Now post number of games played plz.

I MEAN WE ALL KNOW 107% ROI IS TOTALLY SUSTAINABLE!!!!!

edit: post avg stake too. if its below 10$ then lol.