Help needed- got 2 accounts on PS and want to cash out- can i?

[zachvac]

If Doyle Brunson didn't break the rules or laws to play poker, there would be no Dolye Brunson as we know today.

By that logic, let's just take all the laws off the books? Rules are for breaking obviously, so let's just legalize murder. Jeez, why have laws in the first place? Why allow a business to set their own terms? Let's force restaurants to let customers buy their pies for a quarter per slice, after all they want the pie and if we didn't do that less people would eat pie and we wouldn't have the competitive pie eaters we would have in that mythical world so it must be good right?

 

[zachvac]

How much in value to be able to play in a freeroll?
0.0

Wrong. Next week's PS freeroll: $200 given away, 5k people max, so average of 4 cents/seat and a good player gets more than 4 cents in value. Just because you don't pay money to enter a freeroll doesn't mean playing in it doesn't have a positive ev.

 

[zachvac]

Jesus Christ I cant believe how many people are being so hard on OP because he is underage. Playing in country freerolls when your not from that country is cheating.

I'm sorry but I'm betting that A LOT of people (some pretty successful) play poker online underage and others at least used to play underage (I know I did), so did Phil Ivey. I would do the same thing if I could take back time. If I enjoy playing a game, can win money at it, but the law says I cant play, then F**K the law.
Cheating is having an unfair advantage. Whilst it is against the law, being underage IS NOT CHEATING. It just isn't.

I actually support making the gambling age the same as the age at which you could go into a candy store and spend money. I also think that with the age of majority at 18, making the legal drinking age 21 is stupid as well. But I've seen time and time again what happens to people that get caught breaking that stupid law.

Being underage isn't cheating per se, I have a problem with the country switching part myself, but being underage is breaking not only the law but also breaking the agreement with the site allowing them to confiscate all of your funds.

 

[NoWuckingFurries]

There can actually be a difference between something being illegal (i.e. breaking the law) and something which breaks the rules of a company that you deal with. In the UK it's the difference between a criminal prosecution and a civil law suit, possibly for breach of contract, not sure what it is on your side of the pond? Does criminal = felony?

I actually support making the gambling age the same as the age at which you could go into a candy store and spend money.

So let's clarify this, are you saying that kids shouldn't be able to buy candy until they're 18/21, or are you saying that a kid of four years old should be able to play online poker?

 

[zachvac]

There can actually be a difference between something being illegal (i.e. breaking the law) and something which breaks the rules of a company that you deal with. In the UK it's the difference between a criminal prosecution and a civil law suit, possibly for breach of contract, not sure what it is on your side of the pond? Does criminal = felony?

In this case, you agree to the punishment for breaking the terms, it's losing your money. Criminal does not = felony but I believe fraud is a felony. Not sure on the details of breach of contract law here in the US, but for this example you agree to the punishment if you break it, they get all your money.

So let's clarify this, are you saying that kids shouldn't be able to buy candy until they're 18/21, or are you saying that a kid of four years old should be able to play online poker?

I'm saying if a 4-year old has the money and is allowed to blow it in a candy machine or candy store, he should be able to deposit it on an online poker site and play poker. I support the right of 4 year olds to do both. I wouldn't advocate they do it, but I don't think the government has any business stopping someone who can legally spend money from doing so.

 

[4Aces]

:rofl:
<3 switch
but in reply what 4aces07is saying : it is true but that doesnt make it right
yes alot of players started off underage but that does not mean that we should disregard the rules that have been set into place, its not cheating but u still need to follow the age limit set out

Thing is, I am going to disregard a rule if:

1) I completely disagree with it,
2) The chances of getting caught are extremely slim,
3) The punishment is not that bad,

As for following the set age limit.
Well if you were 16 years old, you loved/had a passion for poker, could win money constantly online, most probably wouldn't get caught, would you play? I know I would/did without thinking twice.

 

[pokerchris]

I'm saying if a 4-year old has the money and is allowed to blow it in a candy machine or candy store, he should be able to deposit it on an online poker site and play poker. I support the right of 4 year olds to do both. I wouldn't advocate they do it, but I don't think the government has any business stopping someone who can legally spend money from doing so.

By that logic, you will let any kid to do whatever an adult can do including drinking, own guns, having sex etc. Why is there an age limitation in doing things?

 

[NoWuckingFurries]

By that logic, you will let any kid to do whatever an adult can do including drinking, own guns, having sex etc. Why is there an age limitation in doing things?

Actually I don't think that kids should drink alcohol (except in moderation in a family/meal setting), smoke, own guns or have sex (at least not with my daughter! ). I don't see why they shouldn't play poker, though.

 

[pokerchris]

Wrong. Next week's PS freeroll: $200 given away, 5k people max, so average of 4 cents/seat and a good player gets more than 4 cents in value. Just because you don't pay money to enter a freeroll doesn't mean playing in it doesn't have a positive ev.

An entry to a free roll actually has real value. That's news to me. Tell me why it’s call FREE roll. If it worth 4c an entry, I like to sell it for 1c. Anybody wants to buy it? It’s a very good deal. I am selling a seat which worth 4c for only 1c.

 

[zachvac]

By that logic, you will let any kid to do whatever an adult can do including drinking, own guns, having sex etc. Why is there an age limitation in doing things?

wrong. Playing poker is spending money, plain and simple. If a kid can pay $5 to watch a movie or buy $5 worth of candy why can't he buy-in at a $5 poker game? What about poker makes it unsuitable for kids under 18 yet if you want to pay for other forms of entertainment or goods it's perfectly fine?

And owning guns is legal in the US for kids under 18, you just must get training and a lisence along with parental permission and responsibility. Having sex is also legal below 18, usually as long as they are within 2 years of each other depending on the State.

 

[zachvac]

An entry to a free roll actually has real value. That's news to me. Tell me why it’s call FREE roll. If it worth 4c an entry, I like to sell it for 1c. Anybody wants to buy it? It’s a very good deal. I am selling a seat which worth 4c for only 1c.

It's called a freeroll because tickets are given away FOR FREE. No one would buy it for 1c because there is a competing company offering the ticket for cheaper (FREE). Let's go the other way: if a freeroll ticket has no value, why would anyone play a freeroll when they're getting zero value from it? Just to waste time?

My question is this: "why is a freeroll better than simply playing for play money?" (HINT: it has something to do with the prize money and the fact that this money has RL value thus your ev is positive for simply playing in the freeroll. Oh darn I gave away the answer)

 

[pokerchris]

Actually I don't think that kids should drink alcohol (except in moderation in a family/meal setting), smoke, own guns or have sex (at least not with my daughter! ). I don't see why they shouldn't play poker, though.

I don't think so either. But if you follow zachvac's logic in message #76, you will reach the same conclusion.

 

[K_Kahne_Fan]

Do I want to get into this... why not, "everyone else is doin' it"

Breaking the law: If you are playing and you are under your Country/State's age limit to gamble, you are breaking the law

Breaking the rules: If you are playing and you are under a certain site/B&M's age limit, you are breaking their rules. And in any "game" I've played in, if you break the rules you are "cheating". If you move two squares in checkers and your opponent does not notice, you've still cheated since you've broken the rules.

You can be breaking the law without breaking the rules and you can be breaking the rules without breaking the law. Depends on your age and the restricted age.


It seems pretty simple really.

As for stealing, this is really a gray area, it would take someone in law to clearify if this situation is actually "theft" per say though. But I would tend to agree with Zach. Personally, if someone has "cheated" me out of something, they have "stolen" it from me since they did not take it the correct way.

If a 17 YO played my state's lotto and wind, then cashed the check after they turned 18, technically they stole that money from someone else who could/should have won. Even if it was a $1 or $10M winner, it still should/could have been someone elses. As for the bubble, say said 17 YO purchased that ticket in front of me... that ticket (scratch off since lotto uses RNG) would've been mine to win, so yeah, he TOOK/stole that winner from me. I don't even know if a lotto company would cash said ticket. If this were a B&M and this happened, the B&M would take the chips back immediatly and probably report this player to authorities.

Not only did OP cheat... and yes, I will use the word cheat since he did it against the "rules"; not only did the OP "cheat" the bubble, he cheated ANY player he played against. If he made it to the money he, more than likely, went HU with several others that he knocked out. Not only that, and you're going to love this, he changed how ALL the cards were dealt at any table that he was on. Technically this "cheated" many MANY players since he was there when he shouldn't have been. Want another? If this was a max seat tourney which was maxed out, he cheated 1 "legit" player out of a seat. Plus, are you ready for this one, he changed the seating chart of everyone seated after him, which changes the cards all of those people were dealt. SO, it may be "cool" if someone beats you, but do you realize how much they may have really changed the outcome?

As for something which is considered "accepted" as some of you would "accept" the OP playing underage; Smoking marijuana in the US is VERY common and very easy to come across, but it's still illegal. Should it be legal is a whole other topic, but at this time it IS ILLEGAL. Weather it's "accepted" or not, it is illegal.

 

[pokerchris]

It's called a freeroll because tickets are given away FOR FREE. No one would buy it for 1c because there is a competing company offering the ticket for cheaper (FREE). Let's go the other way: if a freeroll ticket has no value, why would anyone play a freeroll when they're getting zero value from it? Just to waste time?

My question is this: "why is a freeroll better than simply playing for play money?" (HINT: it has something to do with the prize money and the fact that this money has RL value thus your ev is positive for simply playing in the freeroll. Oh darn I gave away the answer)

You just answered you own question. THE TICKET TO THE TOURNAMENT IS FREE.

 

[quads]

What a righteous bunch here.

 

[zachvac]

I don't think so either. But if you follow zachvac's logic in message #76, you will reach the same conclusion.

Really? Please elaborate on that? I compared playing poker to spending money on entertainment or food, not on having a gun or having sex.

 

[NoWuckingFurries]

Breaking the rules: If you are playing and you are under a certain site/B&M's age limit, you are breaking their rules. And in any "game" I've played in, if you break the rules you are "cheating". If you move two squares in checkers and your opponent does not notice, you've still cheated since you've broken the rules.

Actually it's not quite as straightforward as you make it sound. Moving two squares in checkers is breaking the rules of the game, and is cheating. But this person did not break the rules of poker.

 

[zachvac]

You just answered you own question. THE TICKET TO THE TOURNAMENT IS FREE.

umm, it's free to the people who can legally get it. For someone in the US, a UK freeroll is not free to enter and it obviously has some value or no one would want to cheat to play it, they'd be wasting their time and taking a risk for absolutely no gain. But there is gain, the tournament has value.

Our school had a freeroll earlier this year. The top prize was a pretty big TV. If you didn't go to this school, entering it would be cheating. If someone from another school had entered the freeroll and ended up winning the TV, would you not argue that this was stealing it from someone who rightfully should have won it?

 

[pokerchris]

Really? Please elaborate on that? I compared playing poker to spending money on entertainment or food, not on having a gun or having sex.

You compare Doly Brunson breaking law by playing poker to murder.

 

[zachvac]

Actually it's not quite as straightforward as you make it sound. Moving two squares in checkers is breaking the rules of the game, and is cheating. But this person did not break the rules of poker.

But he was not playing generic poker or even generic NLHE, he was playing pokerstars poker, and the rules to that game involve being truthful about where you live.

 

[cardfetish]

I agree that there should be age restrictions for certain things. Gambling is addictive, and can become a problem for anyone. A young adult may be more susceptible than someone who has had greater life experiences. Having said this, where would a 14 your old kid get the money to play online? (Outside of building a BR from freerolls) They are not old enough to have a credit card, and it can entice them to do more illegal activities to obtain funds in order to play. Stealing identities, Credit Cards, family and friends account info, and the like.
I do believe the OP fits in w/ this statement, as he admitted to using an account in his Mom's name. Not sure if HE stole her info and made the account in her name, or just got her account password and used it. I am thinking he just made his own in her name (that would be a form of identity theft) b/c if it was hers and he just used it to make $, then he should have NO problem cashing that one out. He could even transfer money from the fake one to his mom's. Sounds like he doesn't want to.....MOM will know what he did!

Also as far as US laws are concerned, what he did is fraud. Willfully agreeing to terms and misrepresenting himself in an attempt to defraud a company of funds. Yup, he could get in alot of trouble for that if he lived here and the site wanted to pursue legal action. But, I'm sure they wouldn't anyway for such a small amount and they don't want to stir the pot re: underage folks on their site. That is just more ammunition to give the legislators for shutting out the US players

 

[K_Kahne_Fan]

What a righteous bunch here.

None of us have said we we're perfect. But, if I speed and get caught, guess what... I'm getting a ticket. If I smoke pot and get caught... I may get a ticket, but probably going to jail. Smoking pot/speeding are both "accepted" by many... except the authorities who make the laws which I am supposed to abide by. BTW, I don't smoke pot, but I do speed... wait... I don't DO speed, I speed in my vehicle... you get what I mean

 

[zachvac]

You compare Doly Brunson breaking law by playing poker to murder.

Wow, I don't think you understand basic logic.

My murder analogy was a FLAWED ANALOGY to point out how YOUR EARLIER ANALOGY equating all forms of breaking the law (ie saying that if breaking the law in one way was right, all forms were right thus the OP was fine). You made a flawed analogy and I made up an equally flawed analogy to show how your original analogy was flawed.

 

[quads]

Hey zachvac, I don't believe that picture of you. You have to be in your 60's.

 

[zachvac]

I agree that there should be age restrictions for certain things. Gambling is addictive, and can become a problem for anyone.

Can candy become addictive? I know a ton of kids who had jobs during the summers and blew it all before school was out and they worked again. None of these people played poker. My logic is that if it's legal to blow your money on other stuff, why isn't it legal to blow your money on poker?