radartodd69
Rock Star
Silver Level
If you're sitting at a table that is all or nothing then that takes a lot of luck. If you're playing with sensible people who will actually fold when you bet, then that would be what I consider skill. Although it does seem like more and more people are going all in preflop nowadays.
Doubledunk
Visionary
Silver Level
i just read a blog post from john A about this
https://www.cardschat.com/forum/general-poker-13/im-starting-a-poker-blog-244973/post-4322387.html
https://www.cardschat.com/forum/general-poker-13/im-starting-a-poker-blog-244973/post-4322387.html
2NaCl
Rock Star
Silver Level
*puts on philosophical hat*
There's no such thing as chance!
*thinking emoji intensifies*
Now that my crappy humor is out of the way, both variables are important in poker but it all depends on the amount you play. You can argue that someone who plays once in their life only knowing the rules can possibly win their first tournament just by luck BUT in the long run he is ought to end up with a negative ROI.
On the other hand, a professional poker player (such as Phil Ivey) is bound to lose games here and there due to being unlucky BUT in the long run he is ought to end up with a positive ROI because he knows what he's doing and always makes the best decisions 99% of the time.
There's no such thing as chance!
*thinking emoji intensifies*
Now that my crappy humor is out of the way, both variables are important in poker but it all depends on the amount you play. You can argue that someone who plays once in their life only knowing the rules can possibly win their first tournament just by luck BUT in the long run he is ought to end up with a negative ROI.
On the other hand, a professional poker player (such as Phil Ivey) is bound to lose games here and there due to being unlucky BUT in the long run he is ought to end up with a positive ROI because he knows what he's doing and always makes the best decisions 99% of the time.
D
danielcai
Rock Star
Silver Level
Poker has its variance, but the skill of poker means that you know the chance of winning and if it is profitable to do it in long term. So the chance of poker may cause you to losr sometimes but the skill will let you profit in long term.
romych007
Visionary
Silver Level
If you can choose a right table, you can controll nearly 75% of the game process, provided you are skilled enough. If you play against too many fish, however, you skills can be greatly overwhelmed by those players.
Jane Franklin
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Agree. Poker is a war. Buttle of brains. Luck it is important but I believe that all players have good and bad luck. I mean you can't be lucky all the time. So poker its about skills and psychology mostly. Not about luck and cards.
Astokato
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Poker is a strategy of play, math and skills. Sometimes loose hands from other worlds ... (90% vs. 10%). Okay in the game. I play micro stacks and every day many players rely more on luck. My opinion is that if you play steadily and without endurance you will win a little. The main thing at these levels is that you do not miss because you really play for your fun. Donate fun so !!!
ironduke11
Rock Star
Silver Level
so I used to run a little pub game, great times and a great teacher about human nature....
the games were three or four tables and lasted about three to four hours to play down...started with 100 bigs and an add on at the break
two players come to mind when thinking of skill v luck
then a few others also inform the argument
the first player I think was the most complete poker player in the pub
she was adventurous, play any two, play the player not the cards, bluff strongly and would more than often chip way up and have 10 to 1 or 20 to 1 lead by the break
...this phase id say is mostly luck as she was also often out by the break...when she did hit a vein of form however she would accumulate chips like a magnet this phase I think is dependent on luck as it reflect who you are playing and the outcomes of some of the critical hands
after the break she would fall to pieces because she couldn't change gears....she was always stuck in the bully mode or the bluff mode so when other players who were looking to win tightened their range or started to play back strongly she would spew her chips away. she actually got angry at me when I suggested changing her play, never give advise to anyone who didn't ask for it especially a woman I realise
what that tells me is that there are clearly defined phases to a tournament even turbos and it takes someone with a strategic mind to adapt...the longer the tournament goes on the more important the pots the more it is a skill game skill
the second player was also a widely polarizing player who would either chip up fast or exit fast....on his day very tough to play against as he was fearless
but always agonized over hands that he would have won if he had played them...atypical hands that sometimes hit...92off etc
no matter how many times we spoke about strategy he would always come back to taking the shot no matter what....as such he was a very frustrated player and lost more than he should have even with huge stacks
the finer points of the skill of the game eluded these two players and it cost them money at the end of the day that probably to this day they don't realize.
luck is just a word we use to ascribe to outcomes that are not according to the expected aces losing to 62 off etc (which happened to me and cleaned me out of a tournament 62 off shoved blind). however there is a percentage attached to every hand and one has to account for the possibility that one might lose with any given hand that is why there are raises pre and blocking bets to try to mitigate the entry of those other players into a hand.
so to me its 85% skill 90% skill and 10% variance
one could say that some players rely on a style or a strategy that takes full account of the probability of that variance but it is still a style or a strategy and hence reflective of a type of skill based approach.
luck doesn't exist except on pokerstars where their bots are unreasonably lucky an unreasonable amount of the time
the games were three or four tables and lasted about three to four hours to play down...started with 100 bigs and an add on at the break
two players come to mind when thinking of skill v luck
then a few others also inform the argument
the first player I think was the most complete poker player in the pub
she was adventurous, play any two, play the player not the cards, bluff strongly and would more than often chip way up and have 10 to 1 or 20 to 1 lead by the break
...this phase id say is mostly luck as she was also often out by the break...when she did hit a vein of form however she would accumulate chips like a magnet this phase I think is dependent on luck as it reflect who you are playing and the outcomes of some of the critical hands
after the break she would fall to pieces because she couldn't change gears....she was always stuck in the bully mode or the bluff mode so when other players who were looking to win tightened their range or started to play back strongly she would spew her chips away. she actually got angry at me when I suggested changing her play, never give advise to anyone who didn't ask for it especially a woman I realise
what that tells me is that there are clearly defined phases to a tournament even turbos and it takes someone with a strategic mind to adapt...the longer the tournament goes on the more important the pots the more it is a skill game skill
the second player was also a widely polarizing player who would either chip up fast or exit fast....on his day very tough to play against as he was fearless
but always agonized over hands that he would have won if he had played them...atypical hands that sometimes hit...92off etc
no matter how many times we spoke about strategy he would always come back to taking the shot no matter what....as such he was a very frustrated player and lost more than he should have even with huge stacks
the finer points of the skill of the game eluded these two players and it cost them money at the end of the day that probably to this day they don't realize.
luck is just a word we use to ascribe to outcomes that are not according to the expected aces losing to 62 off etc (which happened to me and cleaned me out of a tournament 62 off shoved blind). however there is a percentage attached to every hand and one has to account for the possibility that one might lose with any given hand that is why there are raises pre and blocking bets to try to mitigate the entry of those other players into a hand.
so to me its 85% skill 90% skill and 10% variance
one could say that some players rely on a style or a strategy that takes full account of the probability of that variance but it is still a style or a strategy and hence reflective of a type of skill based approach.
luck doesn't exist except on pokerstars where their bots are unreasonably lucky an unreasonable amount of the time
P
psuedosuited
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Barbarrossa
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Winning tournaments.. a lot of chance involved. Making money... very much a skill thing. If you put in the time, study and play with discipline good things will happen.
The thing is what are the percentages of each? If you are doing multi tables then the percentage of 'chance' goes down. The larger the volume(done the right way) the less chance comes into play.
90% skill with the rest being luck..
My answer to the question.. Poker is a game of skill.
The thing is what are the percentages of each? If you are doing multi tables then the percentage of 'chance' goes down. The larger the volume(done the right way) the less chance comes into play.
90% skill with the rest being luck..
My answer to the question.. Poker is a game of skill.
odo333
Rock Star
Silver Level
Zzzms
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Oh, for sure.
But i think that a general rule of thumb that makes some sense of the balance between luck and skill is: the higher the stakes the more skill is generally involved.
Although there are going to be plateaus and valleys inbetween the stakes and different game types that naturally attract better or worse players respectively.
