Need another opinion

O

odds_maker

Guest
I have been using software that automates my poker play. A friend of mine told me that that is bad..err unethical or cheating i guess but i don't think so. It doesn't cheat in any way. I just configure what hands to play preflop and how to play postflop on what i flopped. I have been successful using it but he says that's cheating. I don't think so. What do you guys think?
 
F

Fish

Rock Star
odds_maker said:
I have been using software that automates my poker play. A friend of mine told me that that is bad..err unethical or cheating i guess but i don't think so. It doesn't cheat in any way. I just configure what hands to play preflop and how to play postflop on what i flopped. I have been successful using it but he says that's cheating. I don't think so. What do you guys think?
I think you will be making a lot of posts in the near future.
They will be along the lines of : Grrr Party Took all my money! Wahhh Wahhh!
I don't understand why! Grrrrr Wahhh Wahh.

So good luck with that. :hello:
 
Stick66

Stick66

Legend
Sorry, but it's 100% cheating. Welcome to Planet Earth. What planet are you from where it isn't cheating?

(Not to be harsh, but I just thought this^^ sounded cool. Welcome to the forum.)
 
goffman73

goffman73

Rock Star
Is this something like Texas Calculatem?I dont think I quite understand what program your using......is it an odds calculater???????
 
Bombjack

Bombjack

Legend
Poker's supposed to be fun. Sounds like you're just interested in scamming money out of people.
 
O

odds_maker

Guest
I think you will be making a lot of posts in the near future.
They will be along the lines of : Grrr Party Took all my money! Wahhh Wahhh!
I don't understand why! Grrrrr Wahhh Wahh.

So good luck with that. :hello:

I'm actually very profitable online and at the casino. I wouldn't automate bad play. LOL. I'm from another forum but need an opinion without anyone knowing who I am. I don't think it's cheating. It doesn't share card information with other poker bots. It just plays like it would if I was there. It doesn't make much, maybe one big blind per hour. I probably make more as I read players well.
 
O

odds_maker

Guest
Sorry, but it's 100% cheating. Welcome to Planet Earth. What planet are you from where it isn't cheating?

(Not to be harsh, but I just thought this^^ sounded cool. Welcome to the forum.)

Would you automate play if you were successful. I guess Earthlings aren't that smart. JK Thanks for the welcome.
 
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Freakakanus

Legend
Taking the human element out of the game is not playing poker. It's just well.....cheating.
Besides what fun is it to let a computer make all the decisions for you?
Don't you have the skill to win your own money?
 
F

Freakakanus

Legend
odds_maker said:
Would you automate play if you were successful. I guess Earthlings aren't that smart. JK Thanks for the welcome.
No, I really honestly don't think I would. Maybe I'm the stupid one but I really think it stinks what you are doing.
Welcome to the forum, stay if you like... but you may want to go back to your other forum where cheating must be considered cool.
 
Stick66

Stick66

Legend
Freakakanus said:
No, I really honestly don't think I would. Maybe I'm the stupid one but I really think it stinks what you are doing.
Welcome to the forum, stay if you like... but you may want to go back to your other forum where cheating must be considered cool.

Nah, they probably think it's cheating, too. He's just looking for someone else to agree with him.

Why don't you just put a disguise on your friend, send him to your next live tourney, and have him play like you & say he's you. Same thing because IT'S NOT YOU PLAYING! No matter how you program it, it aint you.

Now I am being harsh. I still welcome you to the forum, but what you are talking about is serious and is one of the reasons they are trying to ban online poker in the US. Probably best to drop the subject, bud.

How 'bout them Dodgers? Do you like baseball?
 
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F

Fish

Rock Star
odds_maker said:
I'm actually very profitable online and at the casino. I wouldn't automate bad play. LOL. I'm from another forum but need an opinion without anyone knowing who I am. I don't think it's cheating. It doesn't share card information with other poker bots. It just plays like it would if I was there. It doesn't make much, maybe one big blind per hour. I probably make more as I read players well.

I don't doubt you are profitable or not.
And I understand that you will make this program play almost identical to your true play.

So let's analyze it:
Do I think this is a good idea?
Yes. I do.

Will it work?
Yes it will. (or it should if you do it right)

So what's the problem?
The poker sites have access to your harddrive.
They know what you are running when you have the poker client running.
This type of program is against their T&Cs.
They will close your account. They will confiscate ALL the money in that account.

That's where I was going with my Original Post.
If you are from one of the forums I suspect you are from, I suggest that you make a "gnome" account, run up the post count in the Off Topic lounge for a few weeks, then post your question there.
You will get about 15 stupid responses, but you might, just might get one good one. Which is exactly why I believe you are here.
You know that.

Seriously dude, it just isn't worth it.
To make any decent money at it. You would have to have some sort of roll on there, and the amount you make vs the risk of having it confiscated is just too -EV to even try it.

It just MIGHT work on a smaller site, but again, I still think it's too -EV.

Good luck dude.
 
O

odds_maker

Guest
Why don't you just put a disguise on your friend, send him to your next live tourney, and have him play like you & say he's you. Same thing because IT'S NOT YOU PLAYING! No matter how you program it, it aint you.

I would if I could.

The poker sites have access to your harddrive.
They know what you are running when you have the poker client running.
This type of program is against their T&Cs.
They will close your account. They will confiscate ALL the money in that account.


The software runs hidden...I'm not worried about detection and cash out every week.
 
F

Fish

Rock Star
odds_maker said:
The software runs hidden...I'm not worried about detection and cash out every week.
So do it Then.
But it would really be appreciated if you could post what happens on one of the major forums after it hits the fan.
And if it doesn't happen, Then Good on you!
Just be sure to mix up your play in this program. Because they will catch you.:cool:
 
O

odds_maker

Guest
Is this something like Texas Calculatem?I dont think I quite understand what program your using......is it an odds calculater???????

It's not like Texas Calculatem...it does play proper odds though. I have added an aggressiveness factor to it.
 
blankoblanco

blankoblanco

plays poker on hard mode
You must not be making very much. At decent stakes, I'd be shocked if everyone was so stupid that there wouldn't be someone who could take advantage of a completely automated, predictable player. Play at my table any time, please.
 
wsorbust

wsorbust

Cardschat Elite
You must not be making very much.
You can take a look at an article below about a very successful bot that was programmed and ran on its own....
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6002298/

Poker sites might ban you for it because it's against their rules, but, is using an automated system really cheating? I can see the reasoning in believing that your mind is an automated system/strategy... and as for poker sites having "access to your harddrive", they might be able to see what programs you have hooked in with their poker client, but I'd say that's about it...except for Prima of course. If you run a spyware program it'll show them as being, if I can remember correctly, a trojan. No software runs "hidden", you might think it does, but it doesnt...it has to be running somewhere, somehow, in some sort of state. It's just a matter of time until they figure out what exactly you've got attached to them.
 
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shortstacked

shortstacked

Visionary
found this on another site
They're worse than poker sharks. They've taken over online poker rooms everywhere. In fact, they're most likely sitting next to you at the table right now. They probably have most of your chips. Emotion doesn't get in their way. Neither does greed, exhaustion, or fear. Their tells are nil and, try as you might, you cannot put them on tilt. They're poker bots, and rumor has it, they're fleecing you bare.

Poker bots are computer programs set up to play on behalf of (and instead of) an actual human being, according to a consistent and, presumably, proven strategy. Hearing of the possible presence of these borderline cheaters in your online poker rooms could be enough to make online poker players question whether to sit down at the online poker tables at all.

So let's start there. In a word: yes. Of course you should keep playing poker. As we'll explain, these poker bots are far from foolproof and even farther from unbeatable. Secondly, online poker rooms are in the process of making it harder and harder for a poker bot to even get through their virtual doors (think: cyber-bouncer).

You see, here's the thing: there are countless poker bots. Countless programmers with dollar signs in their eyes have tried and are trying their hand at pitting technology against humanity. There are so many different types of poker bots to choose from, new ones cropping up on online poker rooms all the time, that it leads to but one crystal clear conclusion:

They can't all be unbeatable. This is both a caution against relying on them and a consolation to those players who fear being unwittingly pitted against them.

What about a table with more than one seat occupied by a poker bot? If you think it hasn't happened, doesn't in fact happen all the time, then you're kidding yourself. In an instance like that, some poker bots have got to lose. In fact, in each hand, only one can win.

In truth, each bot is only as good as its programmers. And to be clear, that's programmers with an "s": there's the guy or gal who built the program and you, the user, who must determine the parameters (or settings) by which the poker bot will play. That's two human variables affecting quite directly the actions of the poker bot. So, let us ask you something: Why not just play the darned game yourself?

Another thing to realize is that poker is not suited to mechanical play. It's a human game. Sure, a poker bot can't be put on tilt, but neither can a poker bot read a tell nor spot a bluff. It's questionable at best how beneficial a poker bot can be to one's game. You're probably just as well off improving your game the old fashioned way: practice practice practice.

But this threat may not be a threat for long. You might think, why should the poker rooms care, since poker bots make just as much money for online poker rooms as real people? The answer: the real people are getting restless. And at the risk of having their flesh and blood customers retaliate against poker bots by boycotting online poker itself, the online poker rooms are starting to take notice of the problem.

Already, may online poker rooms are instituting software that identifies when a player seems to be using too much of a pattern in their play. It'll be a tricky road, since distinguishing poker bot play from human play is a tricky and therefore risky business. Nobody wants to make false accusations or, worse, take erroneous action, like blocking an innocent user's account. But they're working on it.

As a new form of competition arises -- namely: who can build the better bot? -- we'll find more and more online poker rooms hosting bot-only tournaments (don't laugh, some already have). Hopefully, an increase in this practice will encourage poker bot enthusiasts to create a niche for themselves (surely a profitable niche for the online poker rooms) and leave the rest of us ordinary folk to play against other flesh and blood human beings.
 
Bombjack

Bombjack

Legend
This is one reason I can't see PartyGammon real money tables taking off. It's too easy to get a computer or standalone machine to calculate the optimal moves.

What they don't mention in this article is that the Vex Bot has only mastered the heads-up game. Multi-way is a lot more complicated.
 
G

gammon34

Guest
Guys, QUIT PLAYING ONLINE. Online is full of players like the guy who started this thread. I personaly get better results if I play myself than having a bot play for me (thats plain stupid, half of poker is reading other players).

The real problem is players playing with each other. Collusion!
You can not stop that or do anything about it, except starting to play live games like the game is supposed to play.

Cheers,
 
Bombjack

Bombjack

Legend
I don't know, I think collusion is probably easier in live games, where people are more likely to know eachother, can soft play, squeeze, manipulate the deck, and signal to each other.

Although I would be a bit worried about collusion in high stakes Omaha games, where most of the deck is dealt out and the stakes are worth the attentions of organized crime. In the $10 Sit and Goes I play, I don't think it's an issue at all.
 
O

odds_maker

Guest
You must not be making very much. At decent stakes, I'd be shocked if everyone was so stupid that there wouldn't be someone who could take advantage of a completely automated, predictable player. Play at my table any time, please.

Right now I'm not making much. Less than one big blind per hour (around $5). There are just so many bad players online that it's not hard to make money if you stay tight, play your cards, play your position, and don't bluff that much.
 
O

odds_maker

Guest
For the guys that say this a form of cheating, do you consider all the other programs that help you cheating? Odds Calculators, Tracking Players, etc. If not then what is your reasoning. They still help you and that is not meant to be.
 
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