Would you look? A cash game dilemma...

[Recreationalplayer]

Part of being successful in poker (just like life in general) is to think about various situations ahead of time and decide how you would react. When the time comes, whether you change your mind or not, you at least had a plan of action in mind beforehand.

So what would you do in this situation?

The young, aggressive cash player next to you isn't doing a great job of protecting his hand. The way he looks at his cards makes it really easy for you to see

what he has. You quietly let him know to be careful, but he just laughs and tells you to worry about your own game. Would you keep looking at his cards when you get a chance? And do you think this is a form of cheating if you do look? Why or why not?

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Poker is an extremely competitive sport and every small edge over opponents contribute to EV.

I would refrain from looking at his cards as it constitutes cheating. I would love to maintain a healthy competitive spirit and approach while playing the game.

However, I won't look down upon other opponents look at the players cards and take advantage. I think it's a players responsibility to protect their hole cards.

 

[lauestla]

Part of being successful in poker (just like life in general) is to think about various situations ahead of time and decide how you would react. When the time comes, whether you change your mind or not, you at least had a plan of action in mind beforehand.

So what would you do in this situation?

I think it would be cheating because I would get informations that other opponents don't have.
So I think I would inform the dealer that there is something wrong and ask him to talk to the player who doesn't protect his hand.

 

[Luvart]

"You quietly let him know to be careful, but he just laughs and tells you to worry about your own game."

Well, if I told him in some polite way that his cards are exposed so I can see them and he just laughed at me telling me to worry about my own game, then I would follow his advice because I am really a kind-hearted nice guy.....:

I would worry about my game while at the same time looking at his cards anytime I had the chance.

No cheating if you continue to not protect your cards despite of me signalling the problem to you.

“Poker is war. People pretend it is a game." - Doyle Brunson

 

[ammje]

Hi, I've never played live, so I don't know what the unwritten rules are like at the tables, but I think you should protect your hand, and it's also true that we should be gentlemen at the table and not see the hand of the rival

Poker is a game between gentlemen, as the saying goes, at the table and the game the gentleman is known.

 

[mattiebumpo]

I think if you quietly let him know you could see his cards but he didn't care, then it is fair to look when you have a view. It isn't fair to the other players, but that is part of the darker aspects of the game. If I picked up a physical tell on a player, I am not obligated to share that info with the other players at the table. I would treat it the same way.

 

[Atararo14]

Part of being successful in poker (just like life in general) is to think about various situations ahead of time and decide how you would react. When the time comes, whether you change your mind or not, you at least had a plan of action in mind beforehand.

So what would you do in this situation?

The young, aggressive cash player next to you isn't doing a great job of protecting his hand. The way he looks at his cards makes it really easy for you to see what he has. You quietly let him know to be careful, but he just laughs and tells you to worry about your own game. Would you keep looking at his cards when you get a chance? And do you think this is a form of cheating if you do look? Why or why not?

You can earn 10 VIP Chips with a thoughtful, quality reply to this thread.

Personally, I wouldn't look at his cards because I have confidence in my results, and my skills allow me to get a positive result after a few cash game sessions.

Looking at my opponent's cards wouldn't add a great advantage to me. In addition, I would give a bad image of me if the players know that I cheat knowing that I can be a winner without cheating.

 

[dallam]

It's a really tricky question, since I would never choose the dark way, which is cheating. However if he is so arrogant, he would never learn by us only telling him not to show his cards or cover them more. So my really useful advice would be here that call for a supervisor and tell him the situation that this player simply cannot hide his cards at all, and it could give you a possible advantage so do something in this case. And I probably think this can take an impact on this player.

 

[BillyR23]

What an interesting thread, IMO it's not cheating as I already let the player know to be careful as I can see his cards and the number 1 rule of live poker is to protect your own cards... and to be honest, I would keep looking for as long as he keeps showing me... I also agree with the point that this is unfair to the other players at the table(you have information they don't) but it is what it is- it's not like we're using tools to see their cards and we're just taking advantage of our opponent's mistake* or even stupidity... it's not a perfect analogy but are we supposed to let the table know about a player's style of play/ poker tells and/or other things at the table that can give us a big advantage?!

 

[ADRI7HO]

This is a serious dilemma because I told him to I see his cards, but he, on the other hand, ignores my warning and continues to be lighthearted while looking at his cards, which gives me an opportunity to gain an advantage "within the playing field".
I probably wouldn't look at his cards on purpose, but if I happen to look at his cards and see them, I can't do anything about it.
But if the new player sitting in my place also sees the young guy's cards and doesn't speak, but takes advantage of him, it will affect my game again, for example, because I can get extra information from the reactions of the two players, which can be worrisome again.
E.g. If the unwary player raises and the card peeper raises back, it can be information to me that the unwary player has nothing, but at least his hand is weak compared to the peeper.
So it's more likely that it's worth moving to another table, because either I don't play my hands properly to protect the unwary player and lose money by doing so, or I take advantage but it raises moral questions.
But it can be similar when poker pros milk the billionaire who plays weakly and just wants to have fun behind closed doors, with millions of dollars, which is small money for him, but they still win from him by taking advantage of his weakness.

That was a good question @Tammy, thanks.

 

[whiskers77]

I think it is a very hypothetical question as I can't imagine a player would like to show his cards to someone else in a live game.
And usually everyone knows, that he/she has to protect their cards. I never would look by purpose on someone's cards.
But if it happens unintentionally, then it can't be called cheating in my opinion. Of course, it would give a certain advantage,
but definitely no guarantee to win against this player.

 

[ledsmith]

I think in such a situation, I would have warned him to be more careful. But if he continued like that, well, that's his problem. But this situation will most certainly not happen to me as I have never played live poker and I don't intend to in the future.

 

[ratbat615]

I made sure not to look 👀 at any post before I reply. So if I look stupid it’s on me .

Answer: first I would not tell the player Quietly, I would make sure everyone heard me tell that player that your cards needs to be protected.

Part 2: if the player still isn’t protecting their cards and tells me to worry about my game I would worry about my game.

 

[seiya1989]

This is a good question. Being honest I would not try to see their cards, although it would be a great advantage for me, I would not feel good winning that way and I think it is against the spirit of any game or sport to cheat. It does not matter if the other person is to blame for not hiding their cards well, it matters the values that I have as a person and nothing else. That's my answer.

 

[mattiebumpo]

All this talk of cheating , morals and ethics etc. makes me laugh. We're all sat there with the express purpose of taking each others' money. Where is the morality in that?? And thse talking about having an unfair advantage over the rest of the table....if you pick up on a tell will you broadcast it to everyone tou be fair to the rest of the table?? BS. Poker is a game of LIES and DECEIT....get over it or quit the game.

I agree with you. Poker is about finding an edge or advantage and exploiting it. Collusion is cheating and if I knew it was happening, I would not play that game. However, if you are playing against bad players, you try to win their money. If you are playing against drunk players, you try to win their money. If you are play against recreational players who are primarily there to socialize, you try to win their money. You try to find tells and give off false tells... bottom line, you are trying to win whether with the best hand or the better skill and playing the players.

 

[Mortis]

After that snide remark, I would just say "okay." And do my best to not even look towards them. If I happen to see their cards again, I would again try to tell them, or just announce that I can see their "xx" cards, whatever they may be. I would not actively try to cheat and see their cards. It's unethical. But I'm also not going to hide my face every time the player looks at their cards.

 

[Thiagon]

After I warned him, and he continued to show his cards, I would probably look at the cards to protect myself.

My conscience would be clear because I had already warned.

 

[DiazPoker3101]

I believe that morally, not looking at the hands would be the right thing to do. However, on the other hand, in my case, I will continue to do it, as that's what poker is about: gathering as much information as possible about the game and your opponent, and making decisions based on that. If the opponent wants to show you their cards, they have the right to do so, just as I have the right to keep looking anyway. Nevertheless, I think that while seeing the opponent's cards provides a lot of information about them, it can also be counterproductive because it conditions your play with the rest of the table. So, caution is needed in these cases.

 

[Jedrey]

A part of the poker strategy is to read your opponent, if I already warned him and he didn't care... it's not a trick for me to take advantage of the situation. I'm just using my reading game against him.

 

[50centOverdraft]

I believe that it is cheating because you have an unfair advantage that other players do not have. I wouldn't do it and would prefer to play the game honestly, it's the only way I'm going to improve!

 

[john_entony]

That's a great question! Poker is a sport for me. I always follow the rules of fair play. That's what I would say if my financial situation was stable while playing at that table. More precisely I will say this: if one scale with my moral principles would outweigh the second scale with material necessity. Of course, if, for example, the money that I could potentially win depended on the life of my relative (for example, I would need money to pay for the surgery of a family member), then I would go to any amoral steps (within the law, of course), specifically, when I would receive conditional "1010", then yes, I would look at the opponent's cards in the hope of seeing there conditional "99". But I hope that I will never get into such a difficult material situation (as, however, I hope that no one from our community will), and therefore I would play fairly. This is closer to me.

 

[theStarfish]

I have no problem with looking at his cards, especially with having him told, that he should be more careful. If he does not care, I do not either as every player would look for their own advantage.

 

[Aballinamion]

I would love to thank @Tammy and all of the administration for such effort on creating the most hot cash topic over the last..century? By the moment I checked for the last time it had 145 replies and over 2 K viewers, and that's cool and awesome and great!
But as a Nemo Fish, allow me to kindly push the OP a little bit, not for charging any actions but for fun:
Dear Tammy, you posted the most successful thread in the cash games forum and you haven't replied what would you do in a situation like this. Neither we saw any of your comments about what our mates have said. Could you please stand up and give us our opinion?

Thank you for this work!

 

[valeski 28]

First of all, I must say that I have never played live.That said,I wouldn´t look at his cards at all.no matter if I can see them or not.That player was warned and he didn´t care but If I did it I would have extra information that all other players don´t.That would be unfair .If the player keeps on playing that way,it is his business not mine.I would only focus all my attention on my game..Maybe the dealer could warn him

 

[EmptyHouse]

I will not look at his cards because it will be unfair to other players. I consider this a form of cheating because poker is not about seeing your opponent's cards. If, after bringing it to his attention and asking him to better hide his cards from the eyes of other players, he still wouldn't react, then I would tell all players out loud what cards he have. I think that would solve the problem and he would start hiding his cards well, because if he still didn't, his game would be pointless.

 

[Debi]

Thanks for all of the great replies to this thread!