Duggs Deepstack thread

[Cafeman]

Like my brain cliffs went something like
He has so many floats, and sets, he should fire of pretty wide here I should check turn
C/r turn seems bad.
River is huge an doesn't make sense given what my range looks like. Really hard for him to connect with this river, he should bluff too much ad even vbet a J. I call

Reminds me of my thunks when I'm playing.

 

[Matt Vaughan]

Is all this stuff really going through your head while your playing the hand, or did you just put him on the bluff, then make this up after?

Ok cool, made me feel very inferior not being able to write a 1000 word essay in my head before time bank ran out.

Lol.

 

[rumsey182]

results for my last 20k hands, separated by stakes, def some mistakes i can fix in there

I can post stats if people want, but I start tables so would probably need to filter by player numbers

your winning a lot at showdown but oddy you have a very below 0 none showdown i would expect that is from a variety of things i would suggest watching the video series on deuces cracked (older video now) "the thin red line" focuses on increasing none showdown wins in particular

you would be just killing the stake if you won a little more none showdown

 

[duggs]

Thanks for the input, I think losing more at no sd is a function of deeper stacks, since hands that would be all in 100bb deep become annoying folds

 

[duggs]

But yea I def need to work on it

 

[hackmeplz]

umm at 6m/fr redline sums will be negative (think about it CO and button play a pot, the blinds both get nsd losses while the wins are at sd). It's easy to say that because it goes down you could work on it but 99% of people who try to improve their redline end up doing more damage to their blue line than they help their redline and then their green line, the only line that matters, starts going down.

 

[JCgrind]

regarding the 1010 hand, if villain overcalls with AAs KKs AsK AKs QQ JJs what do we want to do, do we expect QQ/AKss to overcall rather than raise flop? if QQ raises we can be much more confident with our hand because equity wise putting it into QQ is much worse than AK, as QQ is 3x more likely and going to kill us. i think on reflection i think flop is a raise, at the time I hated every option.

what to people think the shovers range looks like?

tbh i wouldnt even bother to consider it, there are far more important things to shit ourselves about! i think youre going to get flatted by the hands that beat you (even though thats really bad by them), and so ye, i prefer the raise too. does feel like absolute butchery at the time tho

it sounds obvious but their sizing and closing the action, likelihood of going multiway are all factors to consider.
how tight and how decent they are also matters since implied odds get reduced obv. basically we dont want to play a dominated range so after the flop calls we need to look at how our hand sits within our range and how our equity is. but yea people 3betting larger basically forces you to fold more, but they also tend to barrel larger with this so its still wide but hands that will flop combo equity, suited connected and pairs are all good.

I can't say for sure but likely you dont fold flop and turn enough in 3bet pots.

filtered for call 3b IP, call flop. super dorrah.
inc a call turn, breakeven
inc call river, hurties.

i get away with calling too many 3bs bc i call/raise many flops, and raise over lots of villain double barrels. im definitely lol exploitable, but its obv too intimidating to face that shit, while OOP, in a 3b pot for villains and they let me get away with muuuuuuuuuuuuurder... mostly

umm at 6m/fr redline sums will be negative (think about it CO and button play a pot, the blinds both get nsd losses while the wins are at sd).

yup. positive of both is so frikken hard

 

[duggs]

Like if QQ and AKss 3bet our raise does that turn it into a r/f on the flop? Can't see anything worse than TT doing it tbh

 

[Cafeman]

Your redline doesn't look too bad imo.

 

[Matt Vaughan]

Had someone laugh at my redline the other day and I was kinda like... Meh, I'm pretty damn pleased with my win-rate, so why would I make a fuss over my red line? Also, in my case (probably not as much in yours) I find myself facing a lot of nonsense aggression on flops and turns, which leads me to take more call-down lines with marginal hands, rather than turning a lot of hands into bluffs. So my blue line is pretty good (imo), from that.

That's not to say that I shouldn't look for profitable spots to boost non-showdown profits, but I agree that a lot of the time when we make an effort to specifically boost red line, it's at a greater expense to our blue line. We should just be trying to look for as many and as big +EV spots as we can.

 

[duggs]

anyone want to give me cliffs on how to run some decent reports, realize my recent sample size will be small but would be useful since iv never done it.

 

[duggs]

those filters are more or less what i expected jc

 

[duggs]

some more hands for you guys


PokerStars - $0.25 Ante $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 3 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (SB): 261.28 BB
BB: 384.6 BB (VPIP: 66.67, PFR: 50.00, 3Bet Preflop: 16.67, Hands: 13)
BTN: 200 BB (VPIP: 37.50, PFR: 21.53, 3Bet Preflop: 3.70, Hands: 149)

Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB, 3 players post ante of 0.2 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2 BB) Hero has A:spade: K:heart:

BTN raises to 2 BB, Hero raises to 10 BB, BB raises to 32 BB, fold, Hero calls 22 BB

Flop: (66.6 BB, 2 players) J:spade: 5:diamond: 8:club:
Hero checks, BB bets 44 BB, Hero calls 44 BB

Turn: (154.6 BB, 2 players) K:spade:
Hero checks, BB checks

River: (154.6 BB, 2 players) T:club:
Hero ??????

I hate every option on preflop this is the first real tangle with him what are peoples thought on every street?

 

[duggs]

I really hate the way i played that

 

[duggs]

PokerStars - $0.25 Ante $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (CO): 328.88 BB
BTN: 103.28 BB (VPIP: 23.00, PFR: 17.16, 3Bet Preflop: 8.83, Hands: 885)
SB: 788.48 BB (VPIP: 57.50, PFR: 42.50, 3Bet Preflop: 17.65, Hands: 41)
BB: 283.92 BB (VPIP: 26.48, PFR: 16.02, 3Bet Preflop: 3.91, Hands: 607)
UTG: 265.88 BB (VPIP: 23.21, PFR: 14.29, 3Bet Preflop: 3.51, Hands: 113)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB, 5 players post ante of 0.2 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.4 BB) Hero has 5:diamond: 5:club:

fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, SB calls 2.6 BB, fold

Flop: (8 BB, 2 players) 5:heart: 9:club: A:heart:
SB checks, Hero bets 5.16 BB, SB raises to 19 BB, Hero calls 13.84 BB

Turn: (46 BB, 2 players) 7:club:
SB bets 60 BB, Hero calls 60 BB

River: (166 BB, 2 players) T:diamond:
SB bets 706.28 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 246.68 BB and is all-in


same villain a bit later on with more information 3bet K4s v steal, has 3bet and tripled v me 3 times, one of which they over bet turn and another they overbet river. 4bet J10 AK and is runnning at 58/44/13 with pretty aggro postflop unconverged numbers, given that, how do we want to play our hand here? villain almost never has 99/AA here imo.

 

[Matt Vaughan]

AK, not sure why you hate it? I honestly don't know if we can b/f AK though? I hate b/c though. And x/c seems like we probs lose value? So b/f river I think. Other streets seem standard though?

With the 55, I assume we discount 99 because he'd 3bet it? (And I assume this deep he's 3betting AA 100%). So that being said I assume we put him on a lot of air? Is he capable of 3betting something like 86s? I just don't see why he's overbetting every street with air though. Not saying I find a fold though... Just his sizing so sickening.

 

[BluffMeAllIn]

I just jump a guestimate of 9Thh, missed his flush but smacked 2pair on the river and jamming for value from AK, AQ. Maybe I'm close lol, could make sense for the overbets in my thought process and why the river jam, also could be ATcc based on hitting top 2 on the river but i think the set was good because I would expect almost any pair 88+ to 3-bet pre for a bigger set.

Unless like scourge said he is sick and hit a straight along the way. lol

 

[Matt Vaughan]

I think T9hh would make more sense if he hadn't overbet the turn. Realistically it's hard for him to get value from one pair here, ever.

 

[JCgrind]

those filters are more or less what i expected jc

suggestions? or is it literally as simple as 'stop callign 3bs with air you fish' lol

I really hate the way i played that

i personally hate stacking AK PF vs unknowns, and dont gii often enough myself, but not wanting to stack pre vs unknown while 3 handed has to be the worst.

I hate every option on preflop this is the first real tangle with him what are peoples thought on every street?

i think flop has to be a c/r, cos calling to x/f is obv bad, and i dont think donking gets us anywhere. we still rep a legit range with our x/r, so i think that has to be the best plan of action, provided were willing to continue to bluff later streets, as the line would make sense, it looks incredibly strong and we will very likely have clean outs. thoughts?

OTT as played i def like x/c, and him checking back is a good result. if we hadve x/r'ed OTF, id want turn action to be open shoved. usually id consider that to be spew, but i think its okay 3 handed vs this guy, even with the very limited amount of info we have.

T OTR is dirty as fk, and its probably really bad, but id just x/c. not even sure if id want him to put in a chunky bet here. bad river.


as for the 55 hand, even just looking at his unconverged stats i love how its played, and would play the same regardless of the extra additional info.
and agree that vil never has AA/99. he will show up with awkward 2ps and straights relatively often though imo.

duggs im pretty sure you agree with me on this, but i feel the need to say it anyway...
@scourrge, this kind of vil is generally doing this bc they have a big hand. but they never understand the 'need worse hands to be able to call here' concept, meaning that theyre doing this with hands that we would immediately remove from their range (hands like 2p with the 5, etcetc), making any set a mandatory call/

 

[Matt Vaughan]

@scourrge, this kind of vil is generally doing this bc they have a big hand. but they never understand the 'need worse hands to be able to call here' concept, meaning that theyre doing this with hands that we would immediately remove from their range (hands like 2p with the 5, etcetc), making any set a mandatory call/

Hmm... Ok, fair enough. That definitely makes sense to me, I just face very different villain types usually so I think sometimes I don't think as in-depth about stuff like that. I am definitely occasionally guilty of attributing my thought processes/skill levels to villains, when it's just not called for.

 

[duggs]

What hands are we worried about on the 10 river?

 

[OMGITSOVER9K]

nothing, really

but i'm bad so my opinion doesn't matter tbf

 

[duggs]

id be very surprised it he elected to 4bet AQ or J10s cause they play great as a cold call, so that leaves J10o and TT i guess?

 

[duggs]

and K10s i guess? maybe some K10o, but given we dont even know if his range contains any of these hands i dunno

 

[RamdeeBen]

PokerStars - $0.25 Ante $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (CO): 328.88 BB
BTN: 103.28 BB (VPIP: 23.00, PFR: 17.16, 3Bet Preflop: 8.83, Hands: 885)
SB: 788.48 BB (VPIP: 57.50, PFR: 42.50, 3Bet Preflop: 17.65, Hands: 41)
BB: 283.92 BB (VPIP: 26.48, PFR: 16.02, 3Bet Preflop: 3.91, Hands: 607)
UTG: 265.88 BB (VPIP: 23.21, PFR: 14.29, 3Bet Preflop: 3.51, Hands: 113)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB, 5 players post ante of 0.2 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.4 BB) Hero has 5♦ 5♣

fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, fold, SB calls 2.6 BB, fold

Flop: (8 BB, 2 players) 5♥ 9♣ A♥
SB checks, Hero bets 5.16 BB, SB raises to 19 BB, Hero calls 13.84 BB

Turn: (46 BB, 2 players) 7♣
SB bets 60 BB, Hero calls 60 BB

River: (166 BB, 2 players) T♦
SB bets 706.28 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 246.68 BB and is all-in

Horrible spot; but I think 99 is very possible here. He's never bluffing the river here with like missed hearts I don't think. 9h7h/Th9h are possibilities although river is a blank card I just don't see why he turns those hands into bluffs. Just going of stats though I think I'd call although I'm not super happy about it.