Play To Win Or To Get ITM?

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fernando21

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Most bubble strategy is common sense: hold on and wait for other players to go bust before you.

If your stack is 10 big blinds or less, you’re in ‘all-in-or-fold’ territory. In other words, if the hand or position’s right, commit and make the most of it – or fold and stay out of trouble. Your aim is to pick up blinds and snaffle chips when you can, without getting into risky confrontations.
 
AKQ

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First is the only place that didn't lose I'm a winner 1st or bust
 
Farseer

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I play to win most money possible. So playing accordingly. Money bubble shouldn't be underestimated, but it's great spot to steal lots of chips if you attack weak-tight players.
 
makisaa

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In the long run it is better to target the best result, which is the first position. This way passes from the "in the money" smaller target. If I had to risk the ITM target for reaching top positions I would do it! Of course it depends from other factors and generally it depends from the conditions of each game and what options or dynamic I have!
 
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01461958

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win

in bubble position i always wait and being patient....
i take the risk only with AA.
 
Vachina

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You should get much more conservative when near the money. It's because there are massive long term implications of missing the money.

That does not mean that you should only play AA, but avoiding marginal spots will do wonders for your overall winnings.
 
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NarcisoAlfa

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Just made a move on the bubble and lost, hurts but I was ahead in the hand and would probably do it again. Wondering if this is the right strategy in the long run?


You must always play to win, although entering ITM you recover the entry and maybe a little more, the time invested does not make up for recovering the entry, because to play for playing I buy a console, the idea is to reach the final table and become a habit, but you can not indisputably let the crucial instances, that is, the bubbles, leave you out of stack :D
 
gon4iypes

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Just made a move on the bubble and lost, hurts but I was ahead in the hand and would probably do it again. Wondering if this is the right strategy in the long run?
I would say, all things being equal, that it was a good move.
seeing that it was the bubble, villain may most often just fold to your move, unless he has a monster. That chips you up a bit. And as we all know, every little bit helps, said the old girl as she pissed in the sea !!!!
 
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UncleConRon

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My opinion

I like to play to win. It does mean you lose instead of cashing out. I am not much of a grinder. To me time is money and the tournament loses its feel after two/three hours even an hour into it. Its no fun playing a tournament that loses its feel.

I have to admit if you ITM you make more money in long run.
 
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Richardszabo

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You did not write down the exact situation, so it wasn't a good decision in general. The first rule for Tournaments is to get to the paid places and only afterwards is the victory. Naturally, you could get into a situation that was worth the risk.
 
Joco413

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Mainly depends on how much it matters to you to break into the bubble. Is the money good for the last ITM placements if so then you should play it out tight until you reach that. Otherwise if there isn't much to lose play to win for days.
 
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williamsc99

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depends, in my case game for both, win and enter in itm. It is possible to make a strategy that allows you to enter itm first and then get in conditions to fight for the title
 
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Shooter74

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I am extremely conservative ... so I play with a lot of caution in the bubble (hand to hand)
 
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djsviga

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You should the majority of time play to win, and consider itm when they're really significant (pay jumps). GL!
 
dino

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I play for FT, not min cash.
If you play for min cash, you'll be eaten alive protecting your chips and will lose them all.
 
Matt Vaughan

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I think the people saying bankroll is a consideration are partially correct, but you also need to have a decent sized bankrolls to be firing MTT's in the first place. If you are constantly thinking "I need to min cash this or my roll will be ruined" then you're playing WAY too big for your roll.

MTT's are generally excessively top heavy, especially as the field grows larger. Often you are looking at 15-25% of the ENTIRE PRIZE POOL to first place. So if you are going in looking for a min cash of ~2 buyins when there are say, 40-100 buyins up top or even more, then that's a problem.

Let's just take a stupid, simple example and show how important it is to place high.

You play a $10+1 tournament 1,000 times, and it has 1,000 runners. This means the total prize pool is 1,000 runners x $10 = $10,000. For the sake of argument we'll say there is $2,000 up top.

Let's say a decent player min cashes the tournament for $30, 20% of the time, and wins the tournament 2 in 1,000 times. (Yes this is a drastic oversimplification, but bear with me.)

They would cash for $30 20% of the time which is 200 of the times they played out of 1,000 = $6,000 back. They win it 2 times out of 1,000 and win another $4,000. This is $10,000 in cashes, but it cost them $11,000 to enter the tournament 1,000 times, so they are stuck $1,000.

They want to improve their play, so they focus on min cashing a lot to try to bring their numbers up. And let's say they improve dramatically, and start cashing it 25% of the time for $30 (this would be a pretty high cashing rate but w/e). But they still only win it 2 times out of 1,000. So now they add another $1,500 in cashes, to make them profitable for $500 in their 1,000 entries.

What if instead they focused on winning the tournament just 1 more time out of the 1,000? We are not talking a crazy amount. Going from winning it 0.2% of the time to 0.3% of the time. Well now you win $12,000 total on those $11,000 entries. A better improvement than improving your cashing rate by a lot.

Are these numbers made up? Yes.
Should you work to win more AND cash more? Yes.

But the point stands. So much of the money is up top in these things, and it actually becomes a stronger point once you see how much is in the top 3 or top 10 even. This example above actually favors the min casher a bit because we say that getting 2nd place doesn't do any better than say, 100th place.

Focus on going VERY deep, and the money will follow. If you focus on min cashing, you will FEEL like you are doing well, but may actually be losing money in the long run because you never go deep enough to hit those top few spots that actually allow you to have a positive ROI.
 
Gaviria8

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There's no answer, all depends about your bankroll, and how big is the impact getting ITM, if you don't care too much about the money you get ITM, just play to win, if ITM does a big impact in your bankroll, play to ITM.
 
kraemer

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If you are really a big favorite then go for the hand... sometimes you get unlucky and lose. But winning will give you a stack that can help you to reach a really high position and win a big prize.

If your hand is really good then you will benefit more often than you will lose and since the payouts increase significantly at the top it will make up for the few min cashes that you miss
 
el_magiciann

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i always play to win not only to cash, because making it ITM doesnt change much your bankroll :D
 
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Unashamed88

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Just made a move on the bubble and lost, hurts but I was ahead in the hand and would probably do it again. Wondering if this is the right strategy in the long run?


I 100% agree. Think about what you just said. You were ahead percentage wise right? So if 7/10 you stack off and go deep into the FT than it's definitely the right move my friend! Keep playing and grats on going deep and even making it to a bubble scenario!
 
0546474

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my actions on the bubble depend on how many chips I have the more chips the more aggressive I will play and vice versa the smaller the chips the more carefully I try to play !!! in any case, my initial goal is to make money, and if it is a minimum, I will not risk them senselessly !!!
 
pancho_1954

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I always play to win, although I can not always achieve a good result or win the tournament, although I think the first step is to get to ITM and then make more effort and have more concentration to win the tournament, in the bubble you must be more careful, Many times it seems that they give us very good cards in that phase to fall, but I think the first thing you should do is secure the game and then go for the victory
 
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3gdata

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I depends on what tourney I play. Different tournaments, different strategies. If it is a freeroll or very cheap tourney, I always play for win, not to just get ITM. If a tourney is big (let's say I won an expensive ticket for free or from a sattellite), and winning anything would be significant for my balance, I try to at least get ITM and win some money. And, for example, if I play a sattelite with the same prizes for first 50 places, why try to win, I need to just get ITM and take my ticket.
 
fishfood80

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Just made a move on the bubble and lost, hurts but I was ahead in the hand and would probably do it again. Wondering if this is the right strategy in the long run?


It's really hard to say not knowing your stack size and stuff, but if your playing to win you gotta pick up those chips. Now with me I actually make certain goals in a tourney. My first goal is to cash now i know that might be obvious but I mean just to make money. I mean that's what we play for to make money. I make some big folds and sometimes let people run over me to get ITM, but once I accomplish that goal I switch gears. My next goal is to make the final table and I try to accomplish that just like i did to get ITM by any means neccessary. So i guess that's my short answer I play to get to the cash so I can live lol, then it's on and I'm looking to win the game.
 
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