Opinion: Most Important Note on Opponent

theANMATOR

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In your opinion what is the most important note you have on your opponents.

Some might say opening range, some might say 3 betting range, some might say other things.

I have one particular note I add to players once I have confirmed it - allowed me to take advantage of certain opponents.

We could expand this topic to include the most important HUD stat we use on opponents but I'd prefer to keep this within bounds of notes we add.

What say you?
 
Risto234

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In your opinion what is the most important note you have on your opponents.


Dont have such a thing but if i'd have one then it probably would be similar to one other (american?) forum's unofficial slogan: "Youaredumbshit"
 
theANMATOR

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Dont have such a thing but if i'd have one then it probably would be similar to one other (american?) forum's unofficial slogan: "Youaredumbshit"

Although this is definitely a note applied to several players - in probably every player pool - it's too vague - so it doesn't help in regards to playing against them.
Dumb shit is probably most commonly referred to as either having a horrible opening range - dudes that open or call down with ANY 2 suited cards from any position - or a station that calls down a 3bet and 3 streets with bottom pair. lol

 
Luvepoker

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In your opinion what is the most important note you have on your opponents.

Some might say opening range, some might say 3 betting range, some might say other things.

I have one particular note I add to players once I have confirmed it - allowed me to take advantage of certain opponents.

We could expand this topic to include the most important HUD stat we use on opponents but I'd prefer to keep this within bounds of notes we add.

What say you?

This will sound odd and I am sure your 1st thought will be WTF is is doing but its vital in my opinion. Its the date.

So why? I do add a lot of notes at times and it will be all over the place depending on the player. The date is the time my last note was made on the player. There is nothing worse that reading a note on a player that no longer applies. When I dont play someone for a long enough against a player I am more careful and want to make sure the player has not changer there style of play. I have literately had note call any top pair vs the loose player to seeing them months latter actually tighten up enough that top pair is not always a easy snap call. Some players will actually learn to become better players and just relying on notes can be hurtful in no longer accurate and up to date.

As for what your asking, I will notate hands that are played that are interesting and will help me in the future. You will have nits who jam every time all in if they have draws and maniacs who never bet the nuts. Its things like this I find valuable as hell. Im basically just using this info to get into there minds.
 
Rost

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I think that every player who makes notes about opponents has his own special system. I also recently started taking notes and my system allows me to make better decisions.
 
Z

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I only label donks "donks" if they show me donk moves.
 
theANMATOR

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This will sound odd and I am sure your 1st thought will be WTF is is doing but its vital in my opinion. Its the date.

So why? I do add a lot of notes at times and it will be all over the place depending on the player. The date is the time my last note was made on the player. There is nothing worse that reading a note on a player that no longer applies. When I dont play someone for a long enough against a player I am more careful and want to make sure the player has not changer there style of play. I have literately had note call any top pair vs the loose player to seeing them months latter actually tighten up enough that top pair is not always a easy snap call. Some players will actually learn to become better players and just relying on notes can be hurtful in no longer accurate and up to date.

As for what your asking, I will notate hands that are played that are interesting and will help me in the future. You will have nits who jam every time all in if they have draws and maniacs who never bet the nuts. Its things like this I find valuable as hell. Im basically just using this info to get into there minds.

That is actually a great tip Luv. I keep the dates - in an offline file because sometimes it's hella difficult to annotate a note and date - when playing 6+ tables.
Thanks for your input.
 
LFC_yllnwa

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I think right, when you ha a very lot of data about each opponent. You can't allocate specific data, because the game can't end every time on the flop or turn, and you can't use only the data on these lines. Very good, when you can read different situations at the table and not always the statistics of another player can help you in this. The online database in online poker is certainly a help to you, but I think that it is a help to the detriment of every player, who wants to learn to understand the situation at the table. Personal opinion!:)
 
mariale_1990

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Usually in my notes I write when I find that player and what is his style of play and anything that can help me face this player in the future, although many times I do not take notes because for some reason I can remember that kind of thing, rest I can forget anything else
 
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I say behaviour .if he's aggressive .if he bluff a lot ....
 
theANMATOR

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MY MOST IMPORTANT NOTE

My most important note - and when I say important I'm really saying most "profitable" - is MCS. Major Calling Station.

I will add an initial note to a player and put an asterisk when I have not confirmed the note is a certainty - a tendency that the player does over and over. Once the tendency is confirmed - I will remove the asterisk and use that to take advantage of the player later on, either in this event or future events.

i.e. Several players in the micro player pool will donk lead - min-bet buff any paired flop. The key word here is bluff - so after I have confirmed this - it is very easy to float and take the pot on the turn river.

But by far - the most profitable note I have on players is MCS. This note is applied to those players who will NEVER EVER fold any one single pair. These players chase ANY draw - regardless of bet sizes they face. These players are chip donators any time during a tournament - and max value betting vs these players is a great way to chip up. I'm not saying to bet like an aggro donk, betting POT every street with top pair - but unless these players hit their wonky 2 pair at any time - they will call down every street - regardless of the board runout. These players are stations to the max - just looking to donk that two pair so they can win the pot.
 
Roller

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The most important note could possibly be something like.
Folds (then an abbreviated description of possibly when, where, how, stage of tournament, BB stack size, position, etc...)
 
nuttea

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In your opinion what is the most important note you have on your opponents.

Some might say opening range, some might say 3 betting range, some might say other things.

I have one particular note I add to players once I have confirmed it - allowed me to take advantage of certain opponents.

We could expand this topic to include the most important HUD stat we use on opponents but I'd prefer to keep this within bounds of notes we add.

What say you?
Write extensively, but without unnecessary water. All information should be useful. Do not shorten too much, otherwise you will have to spend a lot of time decrypting. Write so that even after a few years you will understand the essence of the note. Don't neglect board sizing and structure. It is important to pay attention to what the opponent is showing at showdown.
 
Zapahlohotrona

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If you play a lot of tables, you can't make notes on all of them, so I use the HUD with the main stats.
 
Zapahlohotrona

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VPIP, PFR, Agression factor, limp, cbet, fold cbet, 3bet, fold 3bet. This is the statistic I use.
 
henriquemaduro

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In your opinion what is the most important note you have on your opponents.

Some might say opening range, some might say 3 betting range, some might say other things.

I have one particular note I add to players once I have confirmed it - allowed me to take advantage of certain opponents.

We could expand this topic to include the most important HUD stat we use on opponents but I'd prefer to keep this within bounds of notes we add.

What say you?

I tag a collor for loose and tight player, note I write some weird plays that the villain did.
 
garibe

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Usually simple notes like:

- Aggro;
- Call station;
- Loose reg/nit reg / loose rec/ nit rec
- Maniac

in a way they only serve me when in doubt, to help take a decision. It is very vague but sometimes you take too much time during the game thinking of a clever way to remember that player gamestyle.

The HUDs are only for reference. It reminds me of players I see the most mid/end phases of a tournament. I believe that you need a powerful HUD database to really have pin point information on all opponents moves (I believe HRC is one that most pros are using recently to create such database, but it requires a good pc setup).

*never thought about the date when I make the notes, definetely needed from now on :)
 
theANMATOR

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If you play a lot of tables, you can't make notes on all of them, so I use the HUD with the main stats.

VPIP, PFR, Agression factor, limp, cbet, fold cbet, 3bet, fold 3bet. This is the statistic I use.

True re; a lot of tables - which I do, therefore I only note those players that have exploitable tendencies, or those that are extreme types - ie aggro fish, or NITTY nit, or strong, solid player, or MCS! :)

Regarding your HUD stats Zap - I see a couple redundancies in them - a couple friendly suggestions.
Aggression factor - I have never seen any player - no pro - no HUD expert - nobody ever explain this stat in a strong enough detail to warrant it taking up space on my HUD.
Aggression factor can be deduced by all the other stats we have on our HUD - namely VPIP/PFR and 3bet, among others. I removed aggression factor from my hud and I don't think I'm missing any relevant info. Additionally if you left click on VPIP a pop up will show you the players AF on the pop up. But I find it an entirely useless stat all by itself.

Also you have - limp listed in your HUD. We can see how passive (limping) a player is by his VPIP & PFR - so this seems like another redundant stat.

My hud looks like this

VPIP/PFR/3Bet/Fold to 3bet /
Donk Flop/CbetFlop/FoldCbet/2betFlop/DonkTurn/#of Hands

If you can't tell - I have several stats that players do when they are bluffing/semi-bluffing.
Namely - 2bet Flop & Donk Turn and to a lesser measure Donk Flop.

In my pool a LOT of players donk the flop - and these players are normally weak, with top pair or worse. When this stat is high - I will often float and take it away when the board gets scary, or an over card hits. - I don't do this unless I improve to those MCS players we have been discussing.

Sure - these stats in isolation are not indicators of a player that over bluffs, but I use them together, and also if a player has a high % on one of those stats - it is a pretty clear indicator he is bluffing more than he should be. Donk Turn is one of the more profitable stats I think I have added to my HUD. A lot of players who are uncomfortable playing post flop with medium to weak hands - and aggro players who are overly bluffy - love to donk on the turn. Easy money!! :) Some great exploits can be utilized vs these players if their tendencies are true and confirmed.


Usually simple notes like:

- Aggro;
- Call station;
- Loose reg/nit reg / loose rec/ nit rec
- Maniac

in a way they only serve me when in doubt, to help take a decision. It is very vague but sometimes you take too much time during the game thinking of a clever way to remember that player gamestyle.

The HUDs are only for reference. It reminds me of players I see the most mid/end phases of a tournament. I believe that you need a powerful HUD database to really have pin point information on all opponents moves (I believe HRC is one that most pros are using recently to create such database, but it requires a good pc setup).

*never thought about the date when I make the notes, definetely needed from now on :)


- Aggro;
- Call station;
- Loose reg/nit reg / loose rec/ nit rec
- Maniac

I denote player types by colors - and I don't use the one listed above - It's the same one Lex V. uses - but I don't want players knowing what I have them tagged as so I use a different coloring system.
Aggro/Maniac - are essentially the same so I have them colored the same.
LAG
TAG
NIT
SOLID PLAYER
LP - Lose passive
 
garibe

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Agree, the color structure is also fast and easy to identify.

Also yep, Aggro/Maniac are usually the same. I have them separated because I play too many freerolls.

And this might help me as well, to understand if this is valid. I have this concept over Aggro / Maniacs in freeroll fields:

Aggro - Player who knows whats doing, and applying pressure based on the situations provided to him. Usually the one who knows when to give pressure during bubbles, or when its the chip leader on the table. That could be translated somehow between LAG.

Maniac - Play any2. lol These are usually the ones I get stacks during the early stages. Just like the MCS.

That's the understanding behind it. LAG and TAG are more reasonable inputs, but these players sometimes dont even know they're doing that consciously I guess. Maybe it is too much and I should keep with the simple tags.

I still use it as playing freerolls fields or micromicros there's a lot of new players. To observe their tendencies is chaotic lol.
 
theANMATOR

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Agree, the color structure is also fast and easy to identify.

Also yep, Aggro/Maniac are usually the same. I have them separated because I play too many freerolls.

And this might help me as well, to understand if this is valid. I have this concept over Aggro / Maniacs in freeroll fields:

Aggro - Player who knows whats doing, and applying pressure based on the situations provided to him. Usually the one who knows when to give pressure during bubbles, or when its the chip leader on the table. That could be translated somehow between LAG.

Maniac - Play any2. lol These are usually the ones I get stacks during the early stages. Just like the MCS.

That's the understanding behind it. LAG and TAG are more reasonable inputs, but these players sometimes dont even know they're doing that consciously I guess. Maybe it is too much and I should keep with the simple tags.

I still use it as playing freerolls fields or micromicros there's a lot of new players. To observe their tendencies is chaotic lol.


Actually that does make some sense - especially when playing those maniac players in freerolls.

Also - just to clarify - I'm not disparaging Lex V. coloring system in any way - it's is perfect - however I don't like the coloring scheme - everyone else is copying him so I choose a different scheme. Anyway - everyone knows Aggro/Maniacs should be colored red! :)
 
antonis32123

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If he's very capable/dangerous player with good moves I will take a note . But the most omportsnt note for me is how loose a player is , depending on the cards he chooses to play preflop and how far he goes with them . I tag as loose , next rank is very loose and after that something else that I am not suppossed to say it here , lol
 
CaSpeR851

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I always put a note to players who have seen them use different bet-sizing when they open their hands preflop.
Example: opens normally with 2BB and AKs with 3.5BB
 
AlexStar1981

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When I play, I look at the behavior of opponents. There are overly aggressive players who like to raise from any position and with all sorts of sometimes just junk hands. Sometimes I manage to knock these players out of the tournament. But sometimes, unfortunately, random is not on my side and these comrades win over me even with garbage !!!
 
A

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If they’re overly aggressive I’ll sit back and play super conservatively until I know I have the nuts and bait them in. I’ll call a moderate pot to get them feeling themselves and comfortable thinking I’m clueless. If it’s a super conservative table I tend to overplay my hands out of impatience and frustration trying to make something happen.
 
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