is folding pocket pairs 77+ in early stages too tight ?

I will say that in the later stages it will not be a mistake.Everything always depends on the situation at the table.Learn how to read the game will help you communicate and many years of experience in the game.Be brave and lucky!

The question is difficult to answer that way. It depends on your style of play and your goal in the tournament. If you are a TAG and want to get into the prize money places as often as possible and only play premium hands you can think about it. If you have a slightly wider hand range, you can definitely play 77. A more exciting question is whether you will call or fold a 3-bet with it. It is also difficult when there are 2 or even 3 overcards on the flop and several players are involved in the hand. I think there are game situations in which it is a mistake to fold 77 preflop and also a mistake to continue playing with 77 on the flop. Find your own and individual way.

I think you need to give more information's. Which position are you on the table, under the gun, button? If you are in late position happened something before, does any other player make a raise? If it is not too "expensive" i would at least take a look at the flop.

My limit is folding 99 if late position or stack is getting small. TT I have no problem betting half my chips in low buy-ins or freerolls.

In the MTTs I usually play there are aggressive bettors and frequent all ins from the beginning . If you place the bet in the early position there is a big chance of being overbet and this is not a very strong hand. In the late position you could bet a small amount.

Your question has way too many variables to really answer exactly what you're asking, but I'm going to mention some general guidelines about playing pocket pairs early in tournaments that hopefully helps answer your question.

Your stack relative to the blinds is much larger (usually 100 or more big blinds), so you will want to try and see flops with any pocket pair, with hopes of hitting a set and getting paid off. Folding at this stage of the tournament would be a mistake. Now, if you're facing a 3 bet and a shove behind, then your pocket pair (let's say you have Pocket 5's), decreases in strength given that action behind you and raise-folding wouldn't be a bad play here.

Later in tournaments, when you have fewer big blinds, open folding a low pocket pair is an absolutely acceptable play, especially in early position when you have so many behind you left to act, and many of them probably have stacks where their only play is shoving. So here, you'd want to save your 2 big blinds (or however much you would raise pre-flop) and wait for better spots.

If you want to try and utilize this type of strategy, try playing some 9-handed Sit & Go's that mimic a tournament from start to finish the best. You start with 75-100 big blinds, and eventually when you get to the later stages of a tournament, you will find yourself shallow, so where you'd WANT to see a flop with Pocket 4's at the start of the tournament when you're in early position, you're going to likely be folding the same hand when you are short stacked in the same position.

it all depends on your stack, position and if you feel lucky.

Many people fold their best hands. You didn’t say anything but your hand.

Yesterday I didn’t get into the big raises on our freerolls with a pocket pair of 22 all the way through the game. And I saw from the game that I was right. And several times I have had 77. And I never threw 77 away. I don't know, maybe I was lucky this time. But I took 3rd place. One game cannot be similar to another. Do as your knowledge of the game tells you.

I personally would play them early and tend to be more likely to fold them late.

It is always good to keep decisions easy. Early, it is cheap (small percentage of the stack) and I can play a big pot with a set or simply fold. Later, with bigger blinds, bets, and pots in general, a lot more thought goes into the decisions to fold or continue when you don't hit a set.

you have to play them with implicit, just to see.

It's not to easy to resign with pairs, i usually call to watch the flop. Set on the flop is a good chance to win high pot. I never raise too much with low pairs, it's very dangerous hand to lose coins.

In early stage MTT play, it's reasonable to fold low pocket pairs from early-mid position if you're first in the pot. (You can also raise these hands assuming stacks are deep, or even limp them at passive tables.)

You should definitely play facing a prior raise getting good implied odds, as these can be some of the best low-blind spots -- getting involved with very deep stacks to spike a set and stack a player with a high pocket pair.

Originally Posted by Collin Moshman

In early stage MTT play, it's reasonable to fold low pocket pairs from early-mid position if you're first in the pot. (You can also raise these hands assuming stacks are deep, or even limp them at passive tables.)

You should definitely play facing a prior raise getting good implied odds, as these can be some of the best low-blind spots -- getting involved with very deep stacks to spike a set and stack a player with a high pocket pair.

Hi Collin ,

vs 2x open raise my rule of thumb is flatting with 35-40 BBS my middle PP , is this too tight ,can I call with a shallower stack than that?(asking exclusively for set mining here) I think we don't have the implied odds anymore right?

in the early stages, it is precisely necessary to open small pockets.

i think it depends on the situation tbh

I think it depends on the situation maybe I’ll fold everything below jacks

Originally Posted by daniel411

I think you need to give more information's. Which position are you on the table, under the gun, button? If you are in late position happened something before, does any other player make a raise? If it is not too "expensive" i would at least take a look at the flop.

I agree...position is going to be the biggest factor for me.

Originally Posted by KLDUFF1987

is folding pocket pairs 77+ in early stages too tight ?

Personally I think the short answer is yes it is, based on the info you have given.

I'm usually calling to set mine, if there is a small raise or at small blind levels relative to my stack.

However, if you're in late pos, and there's big 2 raises, then I'm most likely folding, as I'm committing too much of my stack, just to see likely over cards on the flop.

I might be wrong here, but I feel like there's also some value to be had in late pos/button on an unopened pot, by raising, but you have to be careful then with post flop play. I can easily lose a chunk of chips here continuing into someone whose hit a higher pair defending blinds.

No, I don't think it's too tight. With smaller pocket pairs it is not so profitable to play out of position. With 22-99 you almost always need a drilling to win a showdown. That you hit a set is not that common. This means that if you already hit a set you have to be paid out for making a call worthwhile. But out of position you can often not play your drilling profitably. Even if you hit a drilling you won't get a lot of chips if you play out of position. But I don't think it's a mistake to just call with small pocket pairs in early position as long as the blinds are not that high and see if you hit a set on the flop. If a player raises big after you, you should probably fold. You can only call on small raises.

In my experience, this still depends on position and the action that takes place in front of you early in a tournament. I think rather than using a hard and fast rule to dictate folding or playing 77 early in a tournament, keep in mind that early in a tournament - you cannot win the tournament based on this one hand - you can only lose. With this in mind, play 77 conservatively without putting your whole stack at risk preflop and I think your decisions will be easier to make with 77.

GL GL,

HOUDINI9

depends on position and tournament type. If it's hyper turbo 6max or less then any pair is good.

I think you should be happy and brave to play first, but again it's up to the online bookmaker if it's your turn to win, because the more you enter the game, the more you win.

early stages of a tournment i will play any pair hoping to flop a set. The stacks are deep enough that the implied odds pay the 12,5% probability

Depends on stack size (implied odds) and position. Generally yes in the early stage of the tournament from middle or late position. Not when effective stacks fall below about 45 BB.

For me it depends on the reading you have of your opponents, your stack and obviously the position at the table, although I must confess I am not very good at the latter, but I think that a good reading can help a lot.

Without having a specific situation, I think the short answer is yes, 77 is good enough to see a flop the majority of the time. In some situations I will fold though, say if a tight player has opened from early position or if there has been a 3bet. I'm surprised by how many people are saying they fold, you don't need to hit a set for 77 to be the best hand post-flop...

You have to play them to see a flop if don t cost you much.

Actually that's when you can risk to see flops with even 22 if its low blinds to see a set depending on the situation. When blinds go up and up you should start folding pairs more and more.

I think very much like you, actually I usually play exactly the same way, but in the later stages of the tournament I still play too carefully and that is probably a mistake.How should low pairs be played later in the tournament in your opinion?

Originally Posted by zerosalex

Actually that's when you can risk to see flops with even 22 if its low blinds to see a set depending on the situation. When blinds go up and up you should start folding pairs more and more.

Depends on your position, from UTG i think its okay, but MP+ in early stages i think that is better for you to play the hand, the chances of hitting a set is 12%, so every 10 times you play 1 time you will hit. In early stages you have 100bbs, if you invest 2bbs i think it worths. And there is the chance of a low boad, that is good for you two

Originally Posted by KLDUFF1987

is folding pocket pairs 77+ in early stages too tight ?

maybe you mean 77 below

55 below early position I might fold it early stages but not 66+, yeah for me it's too tight to fold 66 and 77 early stages, but of course it's about you not about me, if you want to fold 77 it's fine it's early stages anyway

Originally Posted by KLDUFF1987

is folding pocket pairs 77+ in early stages too tight ?

Yes! You should play with them. of course it depends on a lot of things, but if you can watch a flop cheaply even with small pairs it’s worth it. You can win big with it. or you can win even if you haven’t become three of kind. If there is a problem, it can be easily let go.

As said above, that would depend on your position, your stack size, the dynamic of the table and the action been taken before you.
In ideal conditions, and as cheap as possible, getting involved with small pairs in early stages is a great way to chip up when you hit that set.

YES! a pair at least u limp in EP. never fold. or u must have shortstack and it is shove or fold

I agree with you, there is always a chance to win a large pot. Especially when we play with a deep stack.
You need to know when to fold.

Originally Posted by mervin88

maybe you mean 77 below

55 below early position I might fold it early stages but not 66+, yeah for me it's too tight to fold 66 and 77 early stages, but of course it's about you not about me, if you want to fold 77 it's fine it's early stages anyway

I like to to play these in good set mining positions.
VR a raise make sure he has 20x his raise.
I'll open all pairs when deeper stacked.

it would depend on your position i think, i dont like limping 66's and lower with a lot of people still behind me with a raise before me. i usually fold those hands then

if i have more blinds i dont might calling it via a lose player but really depends if you have notes on some players? tight players i fold them from time to time

people who keep betting every time i would call them sometime if i feel like it.

dont know if its the correct play but it works for me.

Depends.

Personally, if I can see a flop cheaply, then great. Hit the set and print money. Miss and be prepared to fold.

Early position, rather than early game, you'll need to consider the table you're at. Some games can expect to be three-bet every time...in which case, 77 can be uncomfortable.

From SB, I even shove 'em some portion of the time if it has folded around to me.


A marginal, made-hand for sure...but I suppose I play wider than most TAGs.

Cheers
ObbleeXY

There are some great answers so far in this thread. I would add that one excellent piece of advice I picked up from a poker coach concerned pocket pairs. It's easy to justify getting into a hand with a pair to set mine. But, if you can't find it within yourself to fold that pair post flop when you don't improve, and your opponent hammers the pot, then you will find success in mtts difficult to achieve.

I think you want to have at least 30bbs effective stack sizes if you are set mining, otherwise you wont get payed enough to make it worth it when you hit.

Pocket pairs can be profitable if you see the flop cheap. But if it is raised strong pre-flop its better to fold.

pocket pairs are ideal for limping

Originally Posted by gryphon3005

There are some great answers so far in this thread. I would add that one excellent piece of advice I picked up from a poker coach concerned pocket pairs. It's easy to justify getting into a hand with a pair to set mine. But, if you can't find it within yourself to fold that pair post flop when you don't improve, and your opponent hammers the pot, then you will find success in mtts difficult to achieve.

Thats the key. Knowing when to fold it.

I think the earlier the stages the more pocket pairs you should call. If you hit a set you can get a huge part of his stack and just calling pre flop won't hurt your stack.

i theres a 3 bet of course easy folding if some buddy raises and you called in mp and sb or BB shoves of course another easy fold .... you cant risk more than 10% of youre stack preflop with middle pairs less if youre big stack..... like 100bb the villain shoves 18bb or 20 may you call ....

always folding pair like 2 or 3 preflop unless its final 3

Originally Posted by KLDUFF1987

is folding pocket pairs 77+ in early stages too tight ?

Your decision depends more on how aggressive the table is, rather than what stage the tournament is in. If you are allowed to see the flop and make a set for cheap, you can easily recoup the costs of previous unfortunate events.