Checking it down?

[dragonflyamb]

Wow, this thread really took off. Looks like I missed quite a bit. When I told my husband that I posted this topic, he told me that People would have a lot of different opinions. And I guess they do.

I think what it comes down to, is that If I am fairly certain I have the all in beat, I shouldn't hesitate to create or bet into side pot if I think I can improve my position by Collecting additional chips off the third player. But, if I'm not certain., then the best play maybe to check it down and increase the odds of eliminating the all in.

As I am learning, it appears there are very very few absolutes when it comes to poker play.

 

[ssbn743]

Wow, this thread really took off. Looks like I missed quite a bit. When I told my husband that I posted this topic, he told me that People would have a lot of different opinions. And I guess they do.

I think what it comes down to, is that If I am fairly certain I have the all in beat, I shouldn't hesitate to create or bet into side pot if I think I can improve my position by Collecting additional chips off the third player. But, if I'm not certain., then the best play maybe to check it down and increase the odds of eliminating the all in.

As I am learning, it appears there are very very few absolutes when it comes to poker play.

There may not be any absolutes in the game of poker, but if you just play your hand you won’t have any problem.

Of course, Darwin (in the video above), learned the hard way that even that isn’t absolute - which is expressly why it gets under my skin so much. Nonetheless, this is extremely rare – just play your hand and you’ll be fine – ignore the banter from the other players!

 

[detourglr]

I think you onlynget grief from players that was on a draw and want to see it for free.. In others other words they are complaining because it was best for them for you checking it down.. If anything you want the adventage and if they are complaining then you did it right..

 

[bz54321]

Wow a lot of stuff in this thread.......

The other day in the league game some one got the nut flush on the river and was last to act. I bet 1k into the pot and they flat called I had a lower flush. I said out load why did they just call, that was odd but oh well lucky me.

But anyhow one other thing to think about in these situations is that you get two chances to win. If you are one of the larger stacks and you shove behind the small shove and get called by the other large stack. Then you only have to beat the other large stack(depending of course on stack sizes) to break even. So the two large stacks could be freeroling each other. Well I dont think that was really very clear but basically if you got a great pre-flop hand shove over the small all-in in hopes of getting insured by another big stack.

Also I love checking it down in these situations most of the time.

 

[aa88wildbill]

There's very few situations that you check it down. One has to do with knocking somebody out and there's more than one person in the hand. The second one would be your read is your opponent as you beat and you don't think you'll fold. Most the time however hold'em is about forcing the other player or players to make a bad choice.

 

[zingbust]

Years ago, everyone seemed to have bought into the unwritten rule that you should check it down in these cases. There were a few times I didn't want to check it down so I bet. I could care less about increasing the odds of losing one more player in the tournament. To me, that's almost completely meaningless. But since the consensus was that you should "check it down", I was the victim of angry outbursts every time I didn't go along with their way of doing things and made the other guy fold.

Now it's years later and nobody obeys that unwritten rule. Things have changed, most people just go ahead and bet whether they've got anything or not. Sheesh, when I argued my point years ago, I was right after all, even though every single other player at the table always agreed with the guy who called me a stupid idiot.

 

[MediaBLITZ]

I think you onlynget grief from players that was on a draw and want to see it for free.. In others other words they are complaining because it was best for them for you checking it down.. If anything you want the adventage and if they are complaining then you did it right..

Well that's just not true in my case. Sometimes I am glad to get out as I am only in the hand as a safety to prevent the AI from taking the blinds easy. I ask only one thing - win the damn hand and knock the guy out - if that doesn't happen then you will get grief - even more if my hand would have happened to end up in a suck out. And once again, this is about money bubbles and final tables. I'm fine with whatever in the early stages - not really concerned about a knock out that doesn't change anything.

 

[ssbn743]

Well that's just not true in my case. Sometimes I am glad to get out as I am only in the hand as a safety to prevent the AI from taking the blinds easy. I ask only one thing - win the damn hand and knock the guy out - if that doesn't happen then you will get grief - even more if my hand would have happened to end up in a suck out. And once again, this is about money bubbles and final tables. I'm fine with whatever in the early stages - not really concerned about a knock out that doesn't change anything.

^ +1

Even then though – this is just a factor beyond your control most of the time; I try not to waste much time fretting about it!

Years ago, everyone seemed to have bought into the unwritten rule that you should check it down in these cases. There were a few times I didn't want to check it dowan so I bet. I could care less about increasing the odds of losing one more player in the tournament. To me, that's almost completely meaningless. But since the consensus was that you should "check it down", I was the victim of angry outbursts every time I didn't go along with their way of doing things and made the other guy fold.

Now it's years later and nobody obeys that unwritten rule. Things have changed, most people just go ahead and bet whether they've got anything or not. Sheesh, when I argued my point years ago, I was right after all, even though every single other player at the table always agreed with the guy who called me a stupid idiot.

I don’t know about years ago –this goes on right now! And the check it down thing still happens. In fact it happens so often, that my local casino has announcement before every tournament begins that goes something like this: “We following TDA rules except when they conflict with house policy. Only one player to hand a hand – “Do not say check it down?” or a penalty may be called…”

Bottom line, people worry too much about stuff that they can't possibly control; just don’t worry about it, concentrate on the game and hope the cards fall in your favor!

 

[bz54321]

“Do not say check it down?”

Normally I end up checking it down just based on the speed at which I check. Doing it really fast seems to get people to check it down more. Or it could be they are just happy they are getting a free ride from me.

 

[ssbn743]

Normally I end up checking it down just based on the speed at which I check. Doing it really fast seems to get people to check it down more. Or it could be they are just happy they are getting a free ride from me.

No you’re absolutely right and it works quite well. I thought I was the only one that did that!

 

[MediaBLITZ]

Yup, I do the same to make sure I am clearly intent on checking through to the river. I've done it with as much as a full house before.

 

[alchemistkid]

some people just suck

I was involved in a hand a few years ago don't remember all details...it was a while ago.
3000/6000 1 or 2 off bubble in 30k live tourney
utg limps (50k stack), short stack shoves with maybe 12-14k and I am in SB w 99 85-90k in chips
I call, UTG calls
flop J 10 8 rainbow check check everything fine
turn K, I check, UTG bets 16k or so, i am sitting there thinking wtf. i got 99 with an open ender ( not great but not horrible probably would lead out normally) and this guy is going to push me off. He MUST have AQ if he's betting at this point on the bubble, so I will just cut my loses and get out cause I am probably drawing dead.
I fold
They flip cards and the UTG turns over A9 and the short stack turns over 77
I almost Flipped out.
The river comes with a 6.
Short Stack triples up.
I was not pissed that he bet, I was fine with it. I would not have been mad if he bets, pushes me out with a respectable hand and the short stack wins outright. I was pissed because he just bet to push me out with nothing and my thought was he must have the nuts in order to do that. Maybe I was naive.
a little while later after the bubble burst I got knocked out by that same short stack guy ironically with me having 77 and short stack guy had 99 and caught another 9 on the river to boot. Needless to say I had a few words for the UTG guy on my way out as he milked his stack.
I do not believe that you HAVE to check it down, but if you are going to bet, at least have something that you would be proud to turn over at a regular showdown
That's just my opinion though and I have changed my thinking every since that day.
Bottom line is: lesson learned. different strokes for different folks.

 

[bezobrazny]

From my experience during this years playing online poker there are 50/50 % of chaces to be in the hand like you describe with player who respect that unwritten rules about check-check between two deepstacks against short stack in all-in. So, thing like that is pretty normal and very often thing in tgat situation. It is sad but still it's true.

 

[detourglr]

From my experience during this years playing online poker there are 50/50 % of chaces to be in the hand like you describe with player who respect that unwritten rules about check-check between two deepstacks against short stack in all-in. So, thing like that is pretty normal and very often thing in tgat situation. It is sad but still it's true.

But doesnt mean the correct thing to do

 

[groggy44]

well it's an unwritten rule that you check down a dry side pot when a short stack is all in.

I was in a live tourney a few years ago. we were down to 18 people, top 17 are in the money.' Short stack is utg, goes all in for his last 2 chips. It was like 4k/8k blinds. He just suffered a 2 outer suckout a few hands before. For him it was either that hand on the next. So he goes all in. All 8 of the people limp called his all in. We all checked it down. No one cared who won the pot. We only cared who did not win the pot. I've never seen that happen before or after. when yuo have the chance to knock someone out just check it down unless you have the top full house or better
I

 

[Flsnookman]

Imho the smart play is to check it down unless you hit the nutz. Why would you want to force another player out of a draw to knock out the all in in a tourney? The objective is to be the last player. Again, if you hit the nutz bet it but anything less and its a strategically bad move.

 

[MediaBLITZ]

well it's an unwritten rule that you check down a dry side pot when a short stack is all in.

I think calling it an unwritten courtesy or collaborative strategy is more accurate than "rule".

And do I not use the word "collaborative" in the premeditated, illegal sense of the word.

 

[vinylspiros]

I think calling it an unwritten courtesy or collaborative strategy is more accurate than "rule".

And do I not use the word "collaborative" in the premeditated, illegal sense of the word.

wow,media. thats some deep stuff right there.

 

[PLAYINBIG]

Check it down,unless you have the absolute nuts.Why run the another player off the hand that could possibly have the all in player beat.The object of a tourney is surviving and eliminating other players ,making a cash out.Not by rebuilding their chip stack back up and possibly taking you out of a game.

 

[ChipEaterMan]

Safest strategy on the bubble is to check it down. If the bubble is no where near, go ahead and play.

 

[Chemist]

playing or checking is fine if you have a reason for what you are doing and it has some value..

Being a complete idiot, and showing the whole table that you are clueless,
by bluffing with nothing at a dry pot is a different matter though.

 

[ChipEaterMan]

The only time I will check it down is when it will benefit me and help me win the pot or if id be bluffing and if that means check it down to burst the bubble then hell ya but if I believe I have the better hand I'm gonna try and get as many chips as I can but as far as people getting mad ? Were not on a team why would I help anyone at my table by not betting? I just laugh when they get angry

 

[TeUnit]

think u should check it down if you have no hand, and then i think it comes down to how much if any equity u pick up from betting

 

[imafish]

Yeah, bet if you make a hand. I see no problems with that.

 

[baudib1]

Checking it down is BS and anyone who complains about you not checking it down is a moron. Your goal is not to make the money or "cash out" but to win all the chips. If you have a hand worth betting, bet it.