DaveE
Solvem probler
Project Moderator
Probably a failing grade here but I shove....he's probably stealing. If he has a hand I have a decent chance (40-60 or maybe better) of winning the hand. I need chips if I want a shot at a deep finish.
rwilson
Rock Star
Silver Level
I vote fold. The SB should be calling a shove with a wide range of hands, and I'm assuming from the raise that I'm probably 40/60.
In a perfect world I'd let this pass by, and then shove into the shorter stacks on the other side, who I'm assuming (with no reads, just going on general common sense) are less likely to call a steal.
That's just my opinion.. hard without any more info on the players.. but I'd avoid the big stack and make moves into the shorter stacks.
In a perfect world I'd let this pass by, and then shove into the shorter stacks on the other side, who I'm assuming (with no reads, just going on general common sense) are less likely to call a steal.
That's just my opinion.. hard without any more info on the players.. but I'd avoid the big stack and make moves into the shorter stacks.
Mase31683
Legend
Silver Level
Well, our M is very low, however I don't feel this warrants moving all in with jack high. As our M decreases, big card value is more and more important, but so is first in vigorish.
The reason we're moving in with a low M is not simply, we're low on chips, time to shove it in and see what happens. What you're looking for is a spot where it's likely you can pick up those blinds and antes without a fight.
Further, the player who opened the pot can't really be hurt by our stack if they lose an all in against us. Two of the other players at this table would be crippled losing to us, and are very likely to fold when we shove if we chose one of our next hands. The other player, while with a largish stack, would still lose 25% of his stack to us, so he shouldn't be calling us with just any two.
Just sticking our money in knowing that it will be called, then hoping to win just doesn't cut it for me. I want to be the first to act at the pot, and I care about that way more than what my two cards are in this spot.
The reason we're moving in with a low M is not simply, we're low on chips, time to shove it in and see what happens. What you're looking for is a spot where it's likely you can pick up those blinds and antes without a fight.
Further, the player who opened the pot can't really be hurt by our stack if they lose an all in against us. Two of the other players at this table would be crippled losing to us, and are very likely to fold when we shove if we chose one of our next hands. The other player, while with a largish stack, would still lose 25% of his stack to us, so he shouldn't be calling us with just any two.
Just sticking our money in knowing that it will be called, then hoping to win just doesn't cut it for me. I want to be the first to act at the pot, and I care about that way more than what my two cards are in this spot.
RichKo
Visionary
Silver Level
With only 7 BB+antes left it's either fold or shove, I'm going with shove. At least you will probably have 2 live cards to battle with if your opponent calls. You could try your chances at another time but, if you get a hand soon and push who's to say you wont have 3 or 4 callers, just to be busted by say, suited connectors, or even rags, at least now it's just you and your opponent.
Y
young hova
Rock Star
Silver Level
This is a tough one. I don't know if I would shove if I know he's the type to call with any 2 cards here. If he's capable folding to a shove here than its a good time to shove. Only reason I'm shoving here is to get a fold I wouldnt want to get called here.
chances are I think you will get a better chance to shove here if you fold down the line when its either folded to you or you have a dry ace or hand like kj or k10. Plus you are in the money, and you have 2 other stacks that have to shove too. The hand looks pretty, but being that the other 2 stacks are so close to your stack size one double up will change the outlook of the money. I'd fold and take my chances getting a dry ace or a slightly better hand this time UNLESS the bilnds are about to increase significantly higher or something. Than I start to consider pushing here more. My gut tells me u can't make this player fold and if ur gonna push I think a fold is what you want not a call.
chances are I think you will get a better chance to shove here if you fold down the line when its either folded to you or you have a dry ace or hand like kj or k10. Plus you are in the money, and you have 2 other stacks that have to shove too. The hand looks pretty, but being that the other 2 stacks are so close to your stack size one double up will change the outlook of the money. I'd fold and take my chances getting a dry ace or a slightly better hand this time UNLESS the bilnds are about to increase significantly higher or something. Than I start to consider pushing here more. My gut tells me u can't make this player fold and if ur gonna push I think a fold is what you want not a call.
Genso Hikki
Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
I voted bastard - mostly because I don't think I can make a decision with no reads on the player. If the SB is capable of stealing here, it's probably a shove. But, if he's been playing LDP I probably would have to fold.
aliengenius
Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Arguments against a shove:
1. Too many hands dominate ours that he is raising with, i.e., all the other broadway combinations: QT, KT, QJ, AJ, AT. [ie disagree that our cards are likely live]
2. We are not beating very many hands, including all ace highs, which are a large portion of his range.
3. We have ZERO fold equity, as he has raised ahead of us. Shoving w JTs is ok when we are opening, but three betting w/o fold equity gurantees us a call in a spot where we beat only a very small portion of his range.
1. Too many hands dominate ours that he is raising with, i.e., all the other broadway combinations: QT, KT, QJ, AJ, AT. [ie disagree that our cards are likely live]
2. We are not beating very many hands, including all ace highs, which are a large portion of his range.
3. We have ZERO fold equity, as he has raised ahead of us. Shoving w JTs is ok when we are opening, but three betting w/o fold equity gurantees us a call in a spot where we beat only a very small portion of his range.
Dwilius
CardsChat Regular
Silver Level
This is very similar to a hand I played with AG a month ago, shorthanded and shortstacked but it was a button raise. I shoved in the bb w/ JT, and afterward AG made a suggestion that made alot of sense to me. A little different here with sb first to act. Depending on reads I might consider a fold here to go after the blinds, but I won't be shoving in this situation next time. I'll most likely be following AG's choice, bastard 
.
.
Jillychemung
Stacks & Stacks
Loyaler
If the SB is a 9/9/0 nit then I'm folding but if the SB is a 46/35/8 then I shove all day every day as I'm very happy to take what at WORST would be a 40/60 to move off the bottom. I don't care about finishing 1 or 2 spots higher at this point, I want the win and JTs hits so many ways.
JupeZ
Rock Star
Silver Level
Call
If u hit the flop:
Opponent bets -> go all in
opponent bets so u would put all ure money in -> call
miss flop:
opponent check -> push all in
opponent bets -> push all in if flop has draw anyway/not scary (no high cards)
Can't tell much because no reads.
If u hit the flop:
Opponent bets -> go all in
opponent bets so u would put all ure money in -> call
miss flop:
opponent check -> push all in
opponent bets -> push all in if flop has draw anyway/not scary (no high cards)
Can't tell much because no reads.
vanquish
Legend
Silver Level
you're ITM, have a tiny stack, antes hit, and you're raised by the SB (who probably does this with ATC considering your stack size), and you have some FE (he will raise/fold probably bottom half of his range).
you're gonna have to start pushbotting in like 2 hands, and you're playing to win the tournament. just shove.
you're gonna have to start pushbotting in like 2 hands, and you're playing to win the tournament. just shove.
katymaty
Legend
Silver Level
Shove -
If you are going to have a poll then more important and correct information is needed
5 left and 5 get paid
$5 tournament
5th 8.40
4th 12.60
3rd 16.80
2nd 25.20
1st 151.00
Bubble money was only marginally more than buyin and didnt increase alot unless you win the game.
The BB didnt have 2349, the pic shows before BB and ante was posted. BB only had 2024. 2024 to win 4773
J10 suited is favourite over any pair 77 and under and only a marginal dog against rag A9 downwards which were the most likey holdings.
Even against AK or AQ - BB was nearly getting correct odds.
Only hands BB wasnt getting correct odds was AA KK QQ JJ 1010 and a dominated J or 10
The raiser had raised the 2 small stacks on several occasions without showing.
As for no fold equity didnt someone on same table earlier raise someone else about 700 and was raised all in and they folded even though they was getting 3/1 odds
BB was smallest stack on table with diminishing fold equity.
Maybe repoll is needed with full info
If you are going to have a poll then more important and correct information is needed
5 left and 5 get paid
$5 tournament
5th 8.40
4th 12.60
3rd 16.80
2nd 25.20
1st 151.00
Bubble money was only marginally more than buyin and didnt increase alot unless you win the game.
The BB didnt have 2349, the pic shows before BB and ante was posted. BB only had 2024. 2024 to win 4773
J10 suited is favourite over any pair 77 and under and only a marginal dog against rag A9 downwards which were the most likey holdings.
Even against AK or AQ - BB was nearly getting correct odds.
Only hands BB wasnt getting correct odds was AA KK QQ JJ 1010 and a dominated J or 10
The raiser had raised the 2 small stacks on several occasions without showing.
As for no fold equity didnt someone on same table earlier raise someone else about 700 and was raised all in and they folded even though they was getting 3/1 odds
BB was smallest stack on table with diminishing fold equity.
Maybe repoll is needed with full info
Attachments
blankoblanco
plays poker on hard mode
Silver Level
it's opponent-dependent. vs. some (most) players you have no fold equity here ever. this includes most players who are competent. because frankly, raise-folding getting 2:1 here is usually pretty bad for the SB to do ever. but some players still do it, so even vs. a total unknown, you have to factor in some small amount of FE
Jillychemung
Stacks & Stacks
Loyaler
Guess we need to define 'his range'. PokerStove shows a coin flip on all myy ranges.
22+, Ax, Kx, Qx, any 2 Face, Face Ten, any connectors suited or not, any single gappers suited or not, any 2 gappers suited or not
22+, Ax, Kx, Qx, any 2 Face, Face Ten, any connectors suited or not, any single gappers suited or not, any 2 gappers suited or not
J
jrmonty
Enthusiast
Silver Level
I voted shove, I'm thinking this is a steal he knows we are in a push/fold situation and probably believes there is a decent chance we dont have a hand playable. Also the fact that he only raised to 750 seems to me he is trying to risk minimum chips ,because we are in push/fold in his situation he must know any hand range we are going to go all in with to raise of 750 we are going to do the same if he goes all in and any hands we are going to fold here it doesnt really matter how much he raises really we will still fold.
So if we go all in he must fold unless he does have a hand but we still have a chance of winning anyway.
So if we go all in he must fold unless he does have a hand but we still have a chance of winning anyway.