KK : late stages of a satelitte

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Peterr211

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With 3 players to go, I'd be more likely to push than with 1 to go. However, it would definitely depend on how the raiser had been behaving recently. If they had been doing a lot of calling and folding, I would suspect they have something decent. If they've been making lots of raises, I'd call in a heartbeat (okay, I'm a little tighter than that . . . maybe 3 heartbeats.)
 
razin-n-blazin

razin-n-blazin

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If you fold you are not guaranteed to make it to the prize, although it will be very close.

If you go all in you are giving yourself about a 75-80% chance of getting more chips and guaranteeing yourself a spot in the money. You could lose and get knocked out but you are pretty heavily favored against almost anything else here. I'm shoving it all in and will be happy to get it all in with the best of it. Can't control the cards after that.
 
dd_decker

dd_decker

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If you are in 17th place, it was probobly ok to lay down KK, although it is hard to do. Depends how may chips the players near 17th place have, both in front of you and behind you. It's a great hand, but it only takes an A or some stupid flop to knock you out. If you were playing a different kind of tourney, where it pays more to finish higher, then by all means, push all in.
 
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Riedel

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I've never managed to fold KK pre-flop and probably never will. Folding it in your position is - imo - the coward's way out, but probably the correct and most sensibe play. Would you fold aces in that spot?
 
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Skidmark

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only fold aces if you are guaranteed the prize on a satelite. in this spot never imo. any ace against KK have %20 chance of winning and %20 is no joke :) .
 
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EvilEmperor

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Without knowing the exact stack and position situation on other tables it's hard to give exact answer but as default I'm shoving here. Reason being is some of the shorter stacks than you might get lucky and then everyone will be waiting you out.

KK is pretty good hand in this situation to go for double up and almost sure ticket.
 
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hommi

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yeh i mean u need to call if u win ur almost guarenteed in the 100K and if u lose wich is a verry little chance of u playd ur best poker and u will get to it in the next satelite with those plays ;) gl hope u won it
 
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murraygoals

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clearly all in

in that situation with barely even a big blind left.....you are forced to move all in.....you really can't sit around waiting for aces so id just take my chances with kings and hope to double up and be at least over 4x the bb when i do so.......GOTTA PUSH THOSE BOYS
 
robert_wrath

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Unfortunately folding here is the correct move. You must bear in mind, your in contention for a shot at the cash/token. Play to win. the two short stacks are ahead of you and are likely to blind out. You also have the option of sandbagging the short stacks guaranteeing you the last spot for the ticket. Temptation is the mind killer here. Fold them Kings/over pair, the itch for action can wait for the next tournament your vying for.
 
okypoker

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I think I would have pushed in that situation. You got a good hand, and maybe that raiser was just taking advantage of being close to the money
 
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RA2000

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Depends on the other 2 tables and how many players are short their...
If you keep folding you will just stay for 4 more hands and at your table their will probably just one player out...
And if he gets lucky he will stay in.
I would move all in. But that also depends on the player that raised.
Is he aggressive?! Seems like that, then he got nothing + i would risk it.
Double up and sit out!
 
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sexytamuman

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thats why you dont let the tourney bubble affect your game. your playing to win not barely make the money. u should have pushed all in. big mistake
 
PradBitt

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I guess i'd fold too but shoving might be the best move, it depends on many factors.Really tough decision.What happened at the end?Did you win the ticket?
 
vanquish

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thats why you dont let the tourney bubble affect your game. your playing to win not barely make the money. u should have pushed all in. big mistake

"barely making the money" = winning in a satellite
 
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Aaronftw

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The raised had 22,000 in chips, you had 2,000? Id push hoping my hand holds up because i know its the best cards im going to get until im blinded out. But if you do and go out accept thats poker.
 
ABorges

ABorges

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People, it's a sattelite. If you don't know what it is/don't know the strategy involved in one, how's your advice gonna help anyone? The thing about sattelites is once you reach a number of players it's over, and the guy with the most chips doesn't take any more than the shortest one. The pressure is on the players who are on the outside looking in. If 22 people are paid and we're on 17th, we don't have to do anything. It's the shortest stacks who have to make a move to change their situations, why should we do it for them?

If I understand correctly, you are 17th/25 with top 22 being paid. You also have the cut off with slightly less than 2 BBs, which is important because it means you still have like 4 hands before the BB. Oh, and it's a micro tournament so noone has any idea what they're doing (you'd probably see top 10 stacks going against each other with big hands).

Okay, so let's say you call the all in. Against a normal raising range, you probably have around 70%-75% equity with your kings. If a 3rd player comes in you'll be worse, but let's ignore that. So, assuming you'll always win a seat when you win the all in, 70% of the time the seat is yours. This is very important, because now you have to face that equity against the percentage of times you cash when you fold! Since there are still around 8 players with worse stacks, plus probably a lot of larger bad ones and only 3 have to lose before you do. I might be wrong, but I'd say you cash over 80% of the time, probably closer to 90%... this stuff is best done with an ICM calculator, but I'm not familiar with that.

90% is better than 70%

And that's why you fold. Oh, fold aces too I think.
 
ABorges

ABorges

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Oh, I see SavagePenguin had already pretty much said what I did. Oh well, at least I reinforced his post, so there.
 
odinscott

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you really cant say what to do without knowing stack sizes of everyone left obv

but that said, i am shoving this if there arent others very close to getting knocked out (i think that i am never seeing a flop without having everything in pf though - can we really get away from this after a flop with these stacks?)

alot of the time, the bigger stacks are abusing the table because everyone is afraid of getting bubbled
 
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xCipx

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i like that fold. i have folded KK or even AA a few times when your close to the money. I mean sure preflop your 99% chance have the best hand but there are still 5 cards to come, and somne could easly have 10 7 suited, and they are shortstack and that is the best hand they have seen in 15 minutes and u could get donked out. When you close to the money, and you know you have enough chips to make it then play tight till the money, then after your in the money push, or move all in with that KK, just my opinion though
 
CrossCrucificio

CrossCrucificio

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This was some great discipline you have. You have played this hand correctly. Since the prize is not who has the most chips but who places in the top 22. Being placed 17th at the time and only three more to get eliminated, this is the correct play you have done. It amazes me at times when some players just lose sight of the big picture when bubble boy or girl is close. especially those with big stacks. Their eyes light up when they hold pocket aces or kings and dont realize whats going on the table and overall in the tournament. Job well done. I hope you made it !! lol
 
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Aaronftw

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1.8BB left, you could make it threw the BB and SB by folding out of it and holding on by your teeth if you had to, so thats still quite a few hands 13 more before your all in if i counted correctly. I was only talking about the big stack's chip size because hes more like then likely trying to make this thing end by bullying knowing the small stacks are soiling there pants trying to hold on. No doubt hes pushing people around with any sort of range... None the less, more equity folding here.
 
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leavem

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Like many others have said, without knowing the position and stack sizes of the others behind you I will assume they are more likly to hit the blind before you. I would say fold. It is hard folding KK in this spot but a satellite is so different from a regular tournament. It doesn't matter how many chips you have when the bubble bursts, 1 is enough. And yes even AA would be a fold here.
 
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