vanquish
Legend
Silver Level
Leo 50
Legend
Silver Level
After reading your entire post, I think you played it as best you could given the information you had about your opponent.
I probably would have played it in a similar way but that being said maybe not all in.
A re-raise may have given you opportunity to get out of the hand and depending on what happened a red flag may have gone up.
If I was at a table with a player who appears to being pushing his chips around maybe an all in.
AQ is a powerful hand but I've seen so many players (myself included) play it WAY too much only to be beat by a smaller pair, and AK etc.
Without actually being there it's hard to say but I wouldn't beat yourself up over it, you made a decision, stuck with it and now you have to live with the outcome.
That's poker isn't it?
Good luck next time.
I probably would have played it in a similar way but that being said maybe not all in.
A re-raise may have given you opportunity to get out of the hand and depending on what happened a red flag may have gone up.
If I was at a table with a player who appears to being pushing his chips around maybe an all in.
AQ is a powerful hand but I've seen so many players (myself included) play it WAY too much only to be beat by a smaller pair, and AK etc.
Without actually being there it's hard to say but I wouldn't beat yourself up over it, you made a decision, stuck with it and now you have to live with the outcome.
That's poker isn't it?
Good luck next time.
M
msjoker999
Rising Star
Bronze Level
NICE CALL
i would probably go call the bet just to see the flop or in the event that the cards come my way if i had that hand i would bet as smooth as possible just to see if someone had it higher than i. then again they could try and buy the pot but i would just go smooth the first person that raises might have something or could be bluffin if the have they would go all in to get others to fold:joyman:
i would probably go call the bet just to see the flop or in the event that the cards come my way if i had that hand i would bet as smooth as possible just to see if someone had it higher than i. then again they could try and buy the pot but i would just go smooth the first person that raises might have something or could be bluffin if the have they would go all in to get others to fold:joyman:
M
msjoker999
Rising Star
Bronze Level
sometimes you would have to be there or in it to win it just commenting without impression or live its pretty hard but i guess if it was online then my first suggestion-live it'll probably different go with your gut feeling if you don't think you got fold it
Y
young hova
Rock Star
Silver Level
well based on what you just said, the move seems good against the small blind. I still just think its always going to be a risk. I wish you could do a sample on some hands in this similar situation (say about 25 hands). And see what the success rate of the shove would be.
I'm kind of confused tho, are you shoving because you think you have the best hand, or were you shoving because you thought you can make everyone fold based on your image and if they happened to call you wouldn't be dominated?
Its a good hand to discuss, tough one to figure out man. I just still think, regardless, if these 2 guys are going crazy with the raise and reraise, I would try to let one of them explode on each other in those situations rather that get caught in the middle of one of their explosions with AQ; thats just me though. If they were really going at it I'd figure one of them is bound to make a mistake, and like I said your M is still good for this particular level for you to do that if you choose. Meanwhile, I'd take my chances stealing when its folded to me, here and there or sometimes in the blinds raising it up trying to steal. Because, I'm thinking the small blind will be the one to make a mistake soon. So I'd just try to make discreet plays so those two don't really think I'm much of a threat and let them blow up, than I'd completely flip the script when one of them knocked the other out.
he' couldn't have said that any better
I'm kind of confused tho, are you shoving because you think you have the best hand, or were you shoving because you thought you can make everyone fold based on your image and if they happened to call you wouldn't be dominated?
Its a good hand to discuss, tough one to figure out man. I just still think, regardless, if these 2 guys are going crazy with the raise and reraise, I would try to let one of them explode on each other in those situations rather that get caught in the middle of one of their explosions with AQ; thats just me though. If they were really going at it I'd figure one of them is bound to make a mistake, and like I said your M is still good for this particular level for you to do that if you choose. Meanwhile, I'd take my chances stealing when its folded to me, here and there or sometimes in the blinds raising it up trying to steal. Because, I'm thinking the small blind will be the one to make a mistake soon. So I'd just try to make discreet plays so those two don't really think I'm much of a threat and let them blow up, than I'd completely flip the script when one of them knocked the other out.
he' couldn't have said that any better
Z
ZzRick
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Poker Orifice
FoolsTilt
Platinum Level
I'd say 'trust your first instincts'... you were on that table playing against that guy,.. you witnessed how he was playing and what he was playing, etc. With your super tight image, maybe he'd figure you'd lay your hand down even.. who knows.
Your gut was giving you the know how,.. our subconcious minds sometimes piecing things together for us and arriving at our 'first instinct' (one that's been developed over a period of time from many situations, etc.).
I'd say just shove it in there if you shoved it in there. Easy for many to say to just fold here but with the way your opponent was playing, I think you need to take a stand and just shove it in.
Unlucky... he woke up with a real hand this time. I'd say to just try to let it go and again trust your first instincts again in the future (it's a big part of what got you that deep in that tourney in the first place so I'm pretty sure you were doing something right... obv ).
GL!!
Your gut was giving you the know how,.. our subconcious minds sometimes piecing things together for us and arriving at our 'first instinct' (one that's been developed over a period of time from many situations, etc.).
I'd say just shove it in there if you shoved it in there. Easy for many to say to just fold here but with the way your opponent was playing, I think you need to take a stand and just shove it in.
Unlucky... he woke up with a real hand this time. I'd say to just try to let it go and again trust your first instincts again in the future (it's a big part of what got you that deep in that tourney in the first place so I'm pretty sure you were doing something right... obv ).
GL!!
Poker Orifice
FoolsTilt
Platinum Level
Y
young hova
Rock Star
Silver Level
I didn't say don't be aggressive, I said I just wouldn't jump to get in on the action of a bet and raise, as I said in that post that you are referring to:
my point is, I would try to initiate aggression. His M was fine, a few blind steals here and there and he is going to be okay without question. As long as I can steal a few times here and there or maybe raise an original person's bet once in a while I am maintaining, while the other 2 players are seemingly going at each other like wolves, one of them is bound to make a mistake, tilt, get trapped, etc. A double up at this point between pretty much any of the stacks is gonna make the winner of that pot the chip leader and as long as that is the case the villain is good. You don't have to be aggressive every single hand, this is just one hand he posted and he's facing a raise and a reraise in my hand. I didn't say don't be aggressive, I basically hinted at the idea of if I can't be the initiator of the aggression (or resteal once in a while, even though I don't feel thats necessary all the time; at a table like this it probably is) than I'll let that particular pot/hand go preflop.
Hero is not INITIATING the aggression here, he's got 2 other people doing that before him. At this point I don't think aggression is the point, the point becomes who thinks they have the best hand, only thing aggression really matters here imo is fold equity, If you can't make both players fold, than there is no real AGGRESSION to this hand.
RJB-7
Rock Star
Silver Level
B
baudib1
Legend
Silver Level
I ran into an almost identical situation this morning with AQo. It wasn't at the final 3, though, it was the last two tables of a 385 player $24+2 tournament at FT.
Just as before, Button and SB have been very active, running over the table at my expense and stealing my BB every orbit. They've been in several reraising wars with each other. I was prepared to shove over the Button's raise here but the SB shove gave me pause. I remembered all the talk about mucking AQo in this situation and was ready to fold. But my instincts were again telling me that SB really had nothing and was just restealing from Button, as she had several times previously. I called and prayed Button didn't have QQ this time.
--------------------
HAND #1
--------------------
Full Tilt, 2,000/4,000 blinds, 500 ante NL Hold'em Tourney, 6 Players
Hand History Converter by Stoxpoker
UTG: 78,244 (19.6 bb)
BTN: 138,275 (34.6 bb)
SB: 153,064 (38.3 bb)
Hero (BB): 82,324 (20.6 bb)
MP: 28,470 (7.1 bb)
CO: 4,602 (1.2 bb)
Pre-Flop: Hero is BB with Q
A
3 folds, BTN raises to 12,000, SB raises to 152,564 and is all-in, Hero calls 77,824 and is all-in, BTN folds
Flop: (178,648) K
5
8
(2 players, 2 are all-in)
Turn: (178,648) 3
(2 players, 2 are all-in)
River: (178,648) Q
(2 players, 2 are all-in)
Results: 178,648 pot
SB showed T
J
(high card King) and lost (-82,324 net)
Hero showed Q
A
(a pair of Queens) and won 178,648 (96,324 net)
Just as before, Button and SB have been very active, running over the table at my expense and stealing my BB every orbit. They've been in several reraising wars with each other. I was prepared to shove over the Button's raise here but the SB shove gave me pause. I remembered all the talk about mucking AQo in this situation and was ready to fold. But my instincts were again telling me that SB really had nothing and was just restealing from Button, as she had several times previously. I called and prayed Button didn't have QQ this time.
--------------------
HAND #1
--------------------
Full Tilt, 2,000/4,000 blinds, 500 ante NL Hold'em Tourney, 6 Players
Hand History Converter by Stoxpoker
UTG: 78,244 (19.6 bb)
BTN: 138,275 (34.6 bb)
SB: 153,064 (38.3 bb)
Hero (BB): 82,324 (20.6 bb)
MP: 28,470 (7.1 bb)
CO: 4,602 (1.2 bb)
Pre-Flop: Hero is BB with Q
3 folds, BTN raises to 12,000, SB raises to 152,564 and is all-in, Hero calls 77,824 and is all-in, BTN folds
Flop: (178,648) K
Turn: (178,648) 3
River: (178,648) Q
Results: 178,648 pot
SB showed T
Hero showed Q
almostfamous1003
Enthusiast
Silver Level
like others have said this judgement lies in how you have seen the opponents play. IMO playing 3 handed AQ is a great starting hand, if both players are in the hand with raises i would fold the hand in hopes of gaining another place in prize money
BillHall
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Depends how much you want that 2nd place $...
from your description, it seems to me that should sit out and let the two protagonists fight it out and take second place. The 1K difference is probably worth waiting since you indicate that there is a very good chance that they will do so. Then heads up, who knows, you might catch good cards. IF, on the other hand the 1K doesn't mean that much to you...go all in like you did. AQ is a top ten hand. Three handed, that's pretty good preflop, either way, congrats.
from your description, it seems to me that should sit out and let the two protagonists fight it out and take second place. The 1K difference is probably worth waiting since you indicate that there is a very good chance that they will do so. Then heads up, who knows, you might catch good cards. IF, on the other hand the 1K doesn't mean that much to you...go all in like you did. AQ is a top ten hand. Three handed, that's pretty good preflop, either way, congrats.
K
kcirjr
Enthusiast
Silver Level
In this situation i fold it reluctantly just because if the other guy with 300k is reraising 80k that is a large part of his stack. At the least I put him with tens which really only gives you six outs. I dont know bout you but i dont want to risk my tourney life with just six outs i want to go in with hand I know i am favored to win. it is a tough situation but even if the other 300k stack doubles up u are not the short stack and can still wait for hands.
X
x4n4x
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Honestly, I believe whatever decision you made was the right decision. This is an example of a case specific decision. You are the only one who has been playing in the same tournament for 5 hours or so with these people. You are the best person to decide whether or not you made the correct decision. And you did.