duplicate poker - skill or no

cycolist

cycolist

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Just was wondering what other people thought of Duplicate poker? For supposedly being legal because skill element required, I haven't seen it. In the short tournaments all-in seems to be the norm and luck is the winner. Tourneys(long) ending in round robin are a little better but not much.
 
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WhatItDew

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IMO, there is no skill involved in the tournament format. I do like the cash format however, and have found there to be a lot more reward for skillful play. I have had multiple matches where I have had to fold every hand preflop, and I won the match because I lost less than my opponent who called raises preflop taking chances. So I think it really depends on what format you are playing in. I started with the initial $5 and i'm up to $48 just from the cash games.
 
skoldpadda

skoldpadda

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I havent' tried it yet primarily b/c everyone who has tried it has said it completely sucks.
 
Gunns23

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its nothing to write home about....but if you sign up they give you $5 for free and no credit card needed, just try to get it up more then $20 and cash out, personally i would never deposit money there !
 
scruffy mojo

scruffy mojo

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it is hard enough for me to play regular poker, i tried to play it once and that was enough for me. it was the quickest poker session i ever had..
 
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unlucky79

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Tried to sign up this evening. Wont let me play as it said I live in a state that does not allow betting online. Funny because last time I checked the list it was 13 US states and Maryland wasn't included. Ohh well might not be missing much anyways...
 
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switch0723

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what is duplicate poker, can someone explain what it is, not that i would play it, im just interested
 
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ph_il

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Basic DP strategy that I wrote after playing in a few MTTs and placing fairly well.

One thing I noticed while playing again is that normal NLHE strategies will not work. The reason is you aren't just playing the person across from you or the other players at the table, you are also playing those being dealt the same cards as you. If you are playing an MTT, the way you advance into the next level is if you meet the Line Rank requirements. The Line Rank is your rank vs the other players playing the same cards as you. MTT will go onto the next round after half of the players are eliminated after a certain amount of hands. Line Rank players change during each level.

So, lets say its a 6 handed table and there are 6 players playing the same hand as you are. The session is 6 hands and in order to advance you have be in the top 3/6 Line Rank. Remember, though, you dont advance by beating your table but by outranking the players in your Line Rank. Honestly, the best strategy in this early stage is just to fold you hands unless you AA, KK, QQ. I raise big with these hands. Hands like AK or smaller pairs, I'll limp and see a board. You want to get paid for your hands because you will earn Net Total Chips (NTC). NTCs are good when you advance into the next round because A)The bigger your NTC, the higher you are in the Line Rank and B)it acts like a cushion. You can lose a small pot, but not be at a negative NTC. What this means is if your NTC is still higher then the other players in your Line Rank, then your line rank position wont change. However if you negative NTC is lower then another players, your Line Rank will drop. If your NTC exceeds less than 3x the starting stack, you are eliminated so watch out for that.

If your Line Rank is within the zone to move up the ranks, I wouldn't stress playing hand. The downfall is if other players in your Line Rank play the hand and win, you might get pushed down a rank. If you are outside of the Line Rank requirements, then you might have to play hand.

You can move up in Link Rank 2 ways: A)You win a pot and your NTC total is bigger than the other players in the Line Rank who played and won the same hand. B)Your opponents lose a hand and earn negative NTC. Its pretty much vice versa for moving down a rank.

The most important think to do while you are playing is TAKE PLAYER NOTES. This is very crucial because in the later stages because it'll be the deciding factors in how you play a hand.

Somethings to look for:
-Who likes to chase their draws
-Who will call on a draw if given proper odds
-Who will call down with any pair
-Who raises PF and with what range of hands
-Who reraises PF and with what range of hands and how much they raise
-Who folds if they dont hit the board, but will reraise if they have any pair and how much they raise
-How they play their hands PF and post flop
-ETC.

Remember you're playing the table in order to earn NTC and you're also playing those in the Line Rank to make sure you maintain or increase your position in the rankings. As a bonus, you can also see who is in your opponents Line Rank.

Hand example:

Lets say Im playing player X in a heads up game. My opponent has Player Y and Player Z in their Line Rank. I am player A and have Player B and Player C in my Line Rank. Top 2/3 will advance.

notes on X are:
-(re)Raises PF with any A, KK, QQ, JJ
-Will limp in with ATC, only cause a PFR with J high hand or better or any pair.
-Will call down with at least 2nd pair, but raises with top pair
-Does not bet out on draws
-Folds if he misses the flop

notes on Y and Z are:
-They call any PF raise
-They call with any pair
-They raise big with top pair
-They do not chase draws.

notes on B and C are:
-They raise 5x Blinds with any Ace
-They call with any pair
-They chase flush draws
-Player C bets out on draws

I am dealt Ah2h and your opponent checks. I would check it here and see a cheap flop. There is a very good chance my opponent is playing ATC and will fold if I raise. Also, I know B and C are going to raise with the exact same hand. So, if they miss and have to fold on the flop, they will have a bigger negative NTC.

The flop is 7h 2d 9h.

My opponent checks, I bet out half pot with my pair of 2s and my opponent check raises me the minimum. Now, I know my opponent has top pair with his check-raise. Now, I have to decide if I want to call or fold. Well according to my player notes, I know that players Y and Z have bet the flop big with their top pair. And I know that players B and C are going to call that bet with their flush draw. And there is a good chance that C will push all in on this flop with their draw. So, if the flush draw doesn't hit they will lose more chips and be a greater negative NTC and I will move up in ranks. As folding or calling the raise, I would call here to see if I improve on the turn. If I dont, I know the players in the Line Rank didnt improve either. So, now I can fold a turn bet and lose a lot less then my Line Rank opponents because I know they will call a turn bet chasing their draws. If they miss on the river and they do not improve their hand, I might lose the pot to my table opponent, but I will be a higher rank than my Line Rank opponents (they will have a greater negative NTC) and this is what moves me onto the next round. The downfall is the draw does hit, I might not get a lot of action from my opponent unless they have at least two pair. So, even if I do win my opponents will have won a much larger NTC and move higher in the rankings. The good news is I can use my NTC as a buffer in the next hand.

Im sure there are a lot more things and strategies I've overlooked. Please post and lets discuss.

Im starting to enjoy Duplicate Poker. I wouldnt go as far as to say its great, its just the same game with different strats.
 
pantin007

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very well written philthy
was an excellent read
4 thumbs up { if that is possible}
 
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ph_il

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very well written philthy
was an excellent read
4 thumbs up { if that is possible}
Thanks.
It wouldve been a better read if I didnt have so many spelling and grammar errors.

Thats what I get for not proof-reading, I guess.
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Something else to add to the DP strats is: keep an eye on your place in the line ranks during the session and after you change tables. While you might be in 1st during your current session, you could drop down to 3rd in the next because 2 opponents in your new line rank has more NTC than you. Always check you position after every hand. If you're still at the top or within the limits, than you're good but if you happen to be falling below or you're tied with another player, you will want to play a hand and try to gain a spot.
 
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switch0723

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Can someone explain how this duplicate poker works, i may consider trying it if it sounds good.
 
bustermoves

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i didnt like it.played some play money tourney there,won all 20 hands ,and still lost.glad i didnt deposit there.
 
Vhyre

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Its a joke.
I have no other word to label it with.
 
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ph_il

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i didnt like it.played some play money tourney there,won all 20 hands ,and still lost.glad i didnt deposit there.

It just means that someone else you won more total NTC than you did.

You can win 20 hands and an opponent can win only 1 hand and still beat you if their NTC is higher than yours in the end. This is why they break tournaments into sessions. In order to move on you have to finish in the top half of the total line rank. If you're placing 2nd and 3rd or even 4th (depending on how many players in the line rank) and someone else is placing 1st and 2nd, then it doesnt matter how many hand ranks you win. Its about how high you place at the end of each session and that is determined my your total NTC.
 
eNTy

eNTy

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So can you only play tourney's cause I'm playing this quick play now but it seems to be heads up type play where you just play for a higher NTC against the guy at the other table.. So far I'm up for 40c or so :p I like the free $5 tho nice action..

Also in the quick play it says $0.60 buy in 4 players and 2-5 comparisons what does that mean ?
 
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ph_il

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So can you only play tourney's cause I'm playing this quick play now but it seems to be heads up type play where you just play for a higher NTC against the guy at the other table.. So far I'm up for 40c or so :p I like the free $5 tho nice action..

Also in the quick play it says $0.60 buy in 4 players and 2-5 comparisons what does that mean ?

I got the free $10 before they dropped to five. Im only playing freerolls, though, until i get a better understanding of the game.

As for the 2-5 comparisons, I believe thats how many hands they will compare with the other players in your line, per session. 4 players is probably heads up game. So 1 heads up match will be 2-5 hands compared, then the winners of those tables will face off in another session 2-5 hands. So, you can either play a minimum of 2 hands, but no more than 5. Then they'll see who has the highest NTC and that will be the winner.

Dont quote me on this, though. This is just what I assume.
 
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tuff_gong777

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This sounds like too much effort. But i'll give it a bash sometime.
 
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ph_il

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This sounds like too much effort. But i'll give it a bash sometime.

It does seem like a lot of effort, but its more about skill and knowledge than anything else.

The object to win is to finish with the highest NTC. And in order to do this you need to be able to: a) Extract as many chips as you can from your opponents when you have a strong hand and b) lose the least amount when they have a big hand.

Having an understand of outs and odds will help your game. If you're on a draw and you're getting the right price, then it'll be profitable to call. And if you arent, it'll be more profitable to fold. Also, knowing how your opponents play will give you an advantage. If your opponent will chase their draw, then you can bet out enough not to give them good odds and they will pay you off. Or if your opponent will only chase with proper odds, an over bet might scare them off, so you'll just want to bet enough to reel them in.
 
eNTy

eNTy

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I got the free $10 before they dropped to five. Im only playing freerolls, though, until i get a better understanding of the game.

As for the 2-5 comparisons, I believe thats how many hands they will compare with the other players in your line, per session. 4 players is probably heads up game. So 1 heads up match will be 2-5 hands compared, then the winners of those tables will face off in another session 2-5 hands. So, you can either play a minimum of 2 hands, but no more than 5. Then they'll see who has the highest NTC and that will be the winner.

Dont quote me on this, though. This is just what I assume.

I don't think so. It seems heads up but it's only 1 session. So you have 2 tables 1v1 each time. You play 4 or 6 hands depending on the buy in and then at the end of those hands you win the buy in plus your opponents on the other table if your NTC is higher. They do seem to take a lot of rake tho :(.
 
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tuff_gong777

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It does seem like a lot of effort, but its more about skill and knowledge than anything else.

The object to win is to finish with the highest NTC. And in order to do this you need to be able to: a) Extract as many chips as you can from your opponents when you have a strong hand and b) lose the least amount when they have a big hand.

Having an understand of outs and odds will help your game. If you're on a draw and you're getting the right price, then it'll be profitable to call. And if you arent, it'll be more profitable to fold. Also, knowing how your opponents play will give you an advantage. If your opponent will chase their draw, then you can bet out enough not to give them good odds and they will pay you off. Or if your opponent will only chase with proper odds, an over bet might scare them off, so you'll just want to bet enough to reel them in.

ok ok... gotcha! I will definitely check it out!
 
Crummy

Crummy

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I don't know about this site still.....I have played there and used the free money they gave me, built it up, got it knocked back down over and over. What I don't like is the fact that if your on a table that has a really tight player and the other table your compared agianst has two loose players then your have an issue, as well as if it were reversed.
 
eNTy

eNTy

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Signed up yesterday for the free $5. I'm up to $17 now so if I can make it to $50 I'm gonna cash out and put it on PS most likely to play some real poker :).
 
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bobbo

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Never played duplicate... think i'll try learning holdem, been trying for years now lol
 
jolubman

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I got the free $10.00 and I've never played there. From what I've read I don't know if I'll play or not.
 
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