New Scandal - AI Bot Farm on ACR

[puzzlefish]

One of my favorite moments in CC games was when someone pointed out the BOT in our game. After several comments by this player the BOT said Hi, but I am not a bot. I got a lot of LOL that day.

Let's be honest here. There's a very blurred line between bots and human players using RTA tools. One is a bot through and through. The other is a bot with a human puppet hand that performs the actions. I'm not saying that any particular CC member uses RTA or how prevalent that is in CC games, but I do know a bit about how far people are willing to go to make a dollar.

With regards to the topic, I know fundiver makes it look like this is just some guy who listed a bunch of accounts and called them bots. But it's not like that. One hundred got banned and haven't come forward to dispute it. There are 22 pages of discussion on 2+2.

 

[thejuice1]

blows my mind that there are people out there that think there arent bots everywhere.. some places yes its way more frequent than others but without a doubt from time to time even at the top most respected sites, bots are going to get through. theres almost nothing any of these places can do to totally prevent it from happening, so thats why they do next to nothing in reality to do it. i dont think bots are in huge numbers or anything like that anywhere, but they are most definitely out there... at some sites more than others... so just beware, no matter where you play.

 

[Only_player]

There was also a problem with multi-accounts. When freerolls were held, many people created 5 accounts and were looking for a streamer. I saw more than once how the players themselves boasted about this in messengers on poker groups. Then they withdrew without verification on a crypto wallet. It is surprising that a room that is included in the TOP5 still has not solved many problems from the past and there are many bots there, bags in soft and not so strong security. H2N miners easily find such cases and, after marking them, exploit them to earn additional EVs.

I think that professional players at the moment should not be too afraid of bots, although sometimes they will lose to them due to the programming of the turn river with A-high, excluding logic and beating your bluff. But the fan-players will suffer a lot from this, because even though there is a soulless machine playing there, it uses a certain strategy that will still be a plus at the distance. True, amateurs lose money anyway, so at this stage of bot development I don’t see any point in blowing up this strong topic at all.

And yes, bots are everywhere and will always improve and, accordingly, improve the security system of rooms that will not stand still. The problem with ACR is that they promised a reward and then canceled it) It looks so-so

 

[fundiver199]

Let's be honest here. There's a very blurred line between bots and human players using RTA tools. One is a bot through and through. The other is a bot with a human puppet hand that performs the actions.

Or for that matter players, who have spend 100`s of hours to work with solvers. They will also play close to perfect GTO poker, as will a well made computer program (bot). And this is also why, I personally dont care to much about this. I am using a HUD, and if someone have close to perfect GTO stats, then I will try to avoid that player. Because I know, there is no way, I can beat them, weather its just a good reg, someone using RTA or someone using a bot to play for them.

So my real criticism of ACR is, that they are making the site less and less transparent. You can no longer see, who are registered for a SnG, which makes table selection impossible. On pokerstars by contrast this information is visible, so if for instance 6 players are registered for a 9-man, and they are all solid regulars, I can avoid registering for that particular game and find another instead. And lately ACR is not even showing a players location, which makes it more difficult to detect possible collusion or multiaccounting.

With regards to the topic, I know fundiver makes it look like this is just some guy who listed a bunch of accounts and called them bots. But it's not like that. One hundred got banned and haven't come forward to dispute it. There are 22 pages of discussion on 2+2.

I am not disputing, that there might have been bots on ACR. I am just saying, that this recent post does not add anything new to the topic, and certainly does not present any evidence, as far as I can see. Also when ACR or other sites ban accounts, they typically only announce, that they were banned for some sort of TOS violation. Which could be the use of bots, but it could also be other issues like multiaccounting or using a false identify or address.

I remember, when that 2+2 thread started, and for me some of ACRs statements almost seemed like a sort of advertisement. Like "Ok we hear, what you are saying, and now we banned 100 accounts, so look, how serious, we are taking it". But do we actually even know, if its true, that 100 accounts were banned? Not saying they were not, but in principle we only have ACRs word for it.

 

[turnupthebb]

I made a relevant topic before about how online poker is mostly about software aided skill while live poker is real player skill.

The reason why online poker is so hard compared to live poker is because online almost every one is cheating. It's not allowed to use charts, huds and RTA etc but almost everyone does it.

You can bet that if people did the same in live poker it would be just as difficult to play live.
Almost everyone cheats in online poker, even the players who say they dont cheat are most likely cheating.
The poker coaches who make videos for training sites are most likely cheaters as well. They barely even hide it. Sometimes they even show the Apps they have which has 1000+ charts for every situation imaginable and they say like "you could just use this App while playing but be careful because its against most poker sites rules. So i dont do that because its against the rules".

So to become successful at online poker you should cheat by using these apps which everyone else is also using even though they claim they aren't. If it really was true that most people dont use these cheats then online poker wouldnt be so difficult compared to live poker.

Then you just do what the apps tell you to do which is GTO. They tell you the GTO decision. Then you use your HUD to find out which players are recs who don't use cheats and bum hunt them. You play GTO with your cheats to defend against all other cheaters at 0 ev, and make money by playing exploitably against the few recs you find.

 

[Ingryd]

and charlie carrel saying the same about 888 iam confused is this just bizarre because all we now that and we steel playing 🤥

Do you really think that this news is fake. I really think there are bots in 888, because there is a lot of consistency and players who win 8 to 10x in a row this is not normal

 

[ScooperNova]

This is something that has been discussed for years and dismissed. And now we are here.

Online Bots and How to Solve it

One of the biggest issues in the modern world of online poker is the existence of bots and people using programming knowledge to exploit recreational and unsuspecting players. I would suggest that all poker sites cease allowing players to use HUDs. If hand histories are not readily available...

www.cardschat.com

The "smart" people made sure to tell you what an idiot you were if you thought any kind of cheating whatsoever was going on amongst the morally superior online poker players...

 

[battlebornVC]

I don't like AI. Too much stuff reliant upon computers, etc.

 

[puzzlefish]

The "smart" people made sure to tell you what an idiot you were if you thought any kind of cheating whatsoever was going on amongst the morally superior online poker players...

I don't know if it was wishful thinking on their parts or maybe they just didn't see the benefit in scaring away players that they could make money from.

 

[B1961579]

It's too bad this kind of cheating is so likely to keep repeating itself. For all who enjoy the online game, it is very discouraging to hear about this, and know that it's happening, at least to some extent. I do hope sites will find more successful ways to crack down on the cheaters. Until then, I'll keep playing low stakes and free sites, and hoping for the state laws to change and bring more opportunities to play in live games closer to home.