Drive 'Em Out (using Pot Odds)

[rigor mortis]

While Pot odds are a great tool to let you know whether or not to play in a hand. It can be used to drive out villians. If you are in a pot and the flop shows a possible straight or a flush draw. You know the odds of making each and all you have to do is make a bet such that it is unattractive for them to continue. You really must know the pot odds!

 

[tauri103]

Yes, it's true knowing how to determine the probability that an event will happen and then transforming it into a rating is a necessary skill to play poker properly. It's important to understand when it pays to pay and when it's not worth it .

 

[John bruce]

While Pot Odds are a great tool to let you know whether or not to play in a hand. It can be used to drive out villians. If you are in a pot and the flop shows a possible straight or a flush draw. You know the odds of making each and all you have to do is make a bet such that it is unattractive for them to continue. You really must know the Pot Odds!

Having to deal with suck outs far too often. I have tried this method of trying to push people out by going all in with hands that are clearly ahead after flop. People will call you on a draw more i see because of the lure of a big pot. Far too often it feels like they are getting lucky and hitting. But this is coming from the unluckiest guy in poker. Hope it works for you.

 

[TeUnit]

I always like when you can give the villan negative odds by changing the sizing of your bets. Better players will notice if you change this size of your bets, but fish wont care.

 

[shykarno]

I play freerolls and there it does not work)) but the idea is not bad, and if the opponent with you goes further this is information about his possible hand.

 

[MikeCarasone]

I have noticed that many players are shoving aces and kings preflop in an opening bet a lot lately at all stages, especially very early. Seems counterintuitive to chase away all your opponents. I understand isolating the pot or protecting oneself when the flop has many draws but betting 100x preflop seems excessive. Not trying to hijack thread but seems relevant to pot odds and driving them out but it’s not always the correct move. Or am I missing something next meta level?

 

[John bruce]

I have noticed that many players are shoving aces and kings preflop in an opening bet a lot lately at all stages, especially very early. Seems counterintuitive to chase away all your opponents. I understand isolating the pot or protecting oneself when the flop has many draws but betting 100x preflop seems excessive. Not trying to hijack thread but seems relevant to pot odds and driving them out but it’s not always the correct move. Or am I missing something next meta level?

I know it seems crazy but even pushing all in you still can't isolate to only one opponent most of the time. The real funny thing is how bad my AA winning percentage are. A whopping 62 percent winning. Trust me there way off. But I keep chugging along.

 

[ph_il]

If you have a big hand that's a strong favorite, bet enough to give your opponent improper odds, but juicy enough to call so you can get value for your hand.

If you have a decent hand, but isn't a great, then betting big enough to force a fold might be a better option.

 

[MatMackenz]

While Pot Odds are a great tool to let you know whether or not to play in a hand. It can be used to drive out villians. If you are in a pot and the flop shows a possible straight or a flush draw. You know the odds of making each and all you have to do is make a bet such that it is unattractive for them to continue. You really must know the Pot Odds!

If you are talking about protecting a made hand against a draw, then yes, you should be betting large enough for it to be unprofitable for him to continue with his draw. Draws are almost always behind against a made hand, so you want to charge as much as possible for him to play it. You dont nessecarily want him to fold, it is more profitable for you if villain calls your bets chasing the draw, since the draw will miss more times then hit. Having villain fold and forfeit his equity is a nice outcome aswell of course.

 

[MikeCarasone]

If you have a big hand that's a strong favorite, bet enough to give your opponent improper odds, but juicy enough to call so you can get value for your hand.

If you have a decent hand, but isn't a great, then betting big enough to force a fold might be a better option.

This is exactly the line that I take with strong hands. I don’t want to be called by a bunch of players but I certainly want some action on my premium holding. Obviously too hands are not invincible but they do have value in the long run.

 

[RiverLord90]

I agree. I feel like when I'm in the Zone (Flow State) playing at my best, I'm able to make the perfect snap bet sizes to get my opponents to fold postflop. That's when I make most profit.

 

[sidenotch]

there are NO POT ODDS in online poker...

While Pot Odds are a great tool to let you know whether or not to play in a hand. It can be used to drive out villians. If you are in a pot and the flop shows a possible straight or a flush draw. You know the odds of making each and all you have to do is make a bet such that it is unattractive for them to continue. You really must know the Pot Odds!

There really aren't "pot odds" in online poker. The aspect of "free" money takes a BUNCH of those types of observations away! People willy nilly play AND bet on the goofiest cards, so it's hard to get a "read" on whether or not it's a good time to chase a flush or straight AFTER flops. Worst part is>>>I DO PLAY "pot odds" after I get decent flops and have BOTH of the draws to a flush AND straight, and even have TWO deal outs, turn and river, YET, I seem to lose WAYYYY more than I win in that situation. Attempt to "buy" pots, or raise(scare) them off the hand?>>>>Doesn't happen very often, because the sites(especially ACR) seem to deal out cards to where the big stackers get the winners about 80% of the time, no matter what, or when they play CRAP cards. It's get's pretty "WEIRD" watching the same people getting the good cards to play, and even when they get "rags", they'll play them, because for some reason it's like they know the site will give them the winners...right at about 80% of the time....pretty ridiculous AND UNFAIR. It's one of those, "it is what it is" when playing online "cards", and it's CERTAINLY not "poker" the way the sites are set up and the way people play. So, why is it that I can't get winners when I have MAJOR "pot odds" going to flops, and even when I have the odds AFTER flops....the person with 20% chance to win hand seems to win it closer to about 80% of the time when they play against my DOMINATE hand. Sadder when people won't say a word about the CRAZY stuff which occurs at these sites. I at LEAST say NH when someone plays "correctly" and doesn't just willy nilly guess flops to get winners...plus I ALWAYS say "sorry for the suq out" when it's ME who catches a weak, low pot odds win. Once again, I can't make people act, or think like I would like them to, but having some humility would make "some" people more tolerable when they start in with the "Maybe you should get better at poker, blah blah blah". Too funny. Happy New Year and may the flops be with you...hopefully wayyyy more than they are for me.

 

[John bruce]

If you are talking about protecting a made hand against a draw, then yes, you should be betting large enough for it to be unprofitable for him to continue with his draw. Draws are almost always behind against a made hand, so you want to charge as much as possible for him to play it. You dont nessecarily want him to fold, it is more profitable for you if villain calls your bets chasing the draw, since the draw will miss more times then hit. Having villain fold and forfeit his equity is a nice outcome aswell of course.

This strategy always worked for me at live play. But online averages have been way off. You win 1/4 of the time on drawing hands but for me it's opposite. I win the quarter of the time. Funny thing is I know how often i lose on drawing hands and I still can't play weak. I'll put you all in and they still will chase them. I think it's because they know online hits so often. I agree

 

[LavaStorm]

While Pot Odds are a great tool to let you know whether or not to play in a hand. It can be used to drive out villians. If you are in a pot and the flop shows a possible straight or a flush draw. You know the odds of making each and all you have to do is make a bet such that it is unattractive for them to continue. You really must know the Pot Odds!

Knowing your pot odds its very useful in your game.You have to use that in order to outplay your opponents when you don't have the best hand 'yet'.

 

[drubas]

Yep, thats definitely true. I think that knowing the basics is essential for winning or to be more concrete to play profitably. Otherwise you cannot win without being lucky.

Greets and all the best for your games!

 

[This Fish Chums]

Pot Odds can be used to lull players into bad calls.

The other aspect of pot odds is lulling a pot odds player into calling when they shouldn't. Let's say you've flopped a monster hand. Instead of betting the pot, bet 1/2 the pot or less and nickel and dime chips out of the pot odds player allowing them to think they're still in it and wanting to still be in it because the odds appear to be in their favor.

In my opinion, if you have a monster hand and end up forcing a fold instead of getting called through the river then you've lost out on chip opportunities.

 

[madjek]

Imo, this strategy is absolutely important in cash games. In tournaments though, when building a stack is crutial, I find a lot of players will call with their draws whether pot odds are there or not, especially before the turn. To me I think you can get value before turn then try to get them off the draw before river. Those that will fold the draw to a shove before turn will also fold to a value bet, so you cut your risk in half if you can get the chasers to at least fold before river.

 

[seven_outs]

While Pot Odds are a great tool to let you know whether or not to play in a hand. It can be used to drive out villians. If you are in a pot and the flop shows a possible straight or a flush draw. You know the odds of making each and all you have to do is make a bet such that it is unattractive for them to continue. You really must know the Pot Odds!

i see your point but isnt that in most cases a pretty large bet, if not even an overbet, which is in any case pretty suspicious? because in that special case, lets say if you habe the nuts, you would want to make a valuebet dont you?

 

[AMTTT]

in any case it is necessary to raise the pot with a good hand, do not give your opponent a free card to see

 

[Queenlimp]

Pot odds and pre-flop wagers has never really been effective for me (online), except at latter stages against any player who does not have a massive chip stack. Meaning, playing post flop is critical.


From understanding poker, I find it hard to understand why people do not fold certain hands pre-flop; however assumptions about opponent cards online rarely carry the weight it should (in my experience).

 

[okeedokalee]

Player dependent, a calling station or a maniac don't use pot odds they either call or in the maniacs case re-raise.
You also have to take into account stack sizes, if I'm on a draw and you have a big stack I'm going to chase in stead of 2/1 with your big stack it could be pot odds of 20/1+.