Why you lose with AA.

J

JonSherwood

Guest
I've been telling people this for a while in all their posts where they complain, but it seems to me no one seems to listen and there still continues to be a new post everyday about how aces never win.

Well they do.

I get a daily newsletter and today it was talking about what you can do to win with aces most of the time. (Nothing is every certain in poker, don't expect to win every time.)

I felt I'd enlighten you all with a little tidbit of the article.

The reason you want to force people OUT of the
hand is simple mathematics.

Let's say for instance you get pocket ACES.

Here's what three of your opponents are holding:

Player 1: K-K

Player 2: 10-9 suited

Player 3: Q-10 offsuit

Now, if you went heads-up against any of these
hands ONE-ON-ONE, your odds of winning would be
about 80%. They'd be 85% against Player 3.

BUT...

If you went up against ALL THREE of these
opponents in one single hand, your odds of winning
is just 58.5%!

That's just over 50/50 with the absolute BEST
starting hand possible.

Get my point?

So when you GET pocket Aces, you need to FORCE OUT
all but one caller.

You've got to be VERY AGGRESSIVE.
Roy Rounder is what he goes by, and his articles have helped my game tremendously. When I saw this I knew I had to post it instead of constantly telling people the exact same thing.

Jon
 
R

ronholes7059

Guest
I totally agree with playing aces strong. I used to slow play them by just calling the big blind if only one or two people were in hoping someone would raise then i could go all in, but I have gotten burned alot by doing this so now I push in my chips when I get the best hand in poker
 
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chicubs1616

Guest
I agree very good info but when I am aggressive I don't win a big pot
Stop whining.


I used to slow play them by just calling the big blind if only one or two people were in hoping someone would raise then i could go all in, but I have gotten burned alot by doing this so now I push in my chips when I get the best hand in poker
Bad idea slowplaying aces. Very few circumstances where you should slowplay them and very few people on this site would ever get to the point where they would need it.

Don't go all-in all the time when you get AA, this is almost as bad as slowplaying. You are losing yourself a lot of money in the long run...
 
K

km3_16

Guest
I think getting pocket aces also (like everything else) depends on your position. Obvuiously the best position to get them is the button.
The way I play them and have had a relative amount of succes (in NL tables) is that if I get them late I go all in or raise very hard. If its the middle, I just call or raise minimal. There is almost always someone reraising so you get a good feel for what the other players may have on your table. Good Post . Thanks!!
 
J

JonSherwood

Guest
km3_16 said:
I think getting pocket aces also (like everything else) depends on your position. Obvuiously the best position to get them is the button.
The way I play them and have had a relative amount of succes (in NL tables) is that if I get them late I go all in or raise very hard. If its the middle, I just call or raise minimal. There is almost always someone reraising so you get a good feel for what the other players may have on your table. Good Post . Thanks!!
I'm glad you've got the right concept, position is a huge deciding factor on how you should play your aces. Another deciding factor is if your playing a ring game or a tourney. On the subject of position, however, I'll contribute my way of playing, and I'll let you all know right now that my aces losing are a very rare thing. Why? Because I play them well. (You're wrong by the way, Jackus.)

Note: Strictly for online purpose. Live games are a whole 'nother taco. :)


First through third position: This is personally my least favorite time to get them. I'll usually raise 4 or 5 times the big blind here. If I get more than three callers I'll be making a huge bet post flop (some circumstances require otherwise). Why? Because you need to try and be heads up. If some reraises me preflop it's a definite all-in.


Middle position: If 2 or more people have already called the big blind or made a raise, I'm all-in. Otherwise, you want to make another big preflop raise.

Late position: All-in. Always. It's been my experience that someone will almost always call, and you'll almost always win.

By the way guys, when I'm saying all-in, I am NOT talking about in ring games. Never put all of your stack in preflop in a ring game. That's not smart. Plus you'll get no callers.

Also. I have played my aces many different ways since I started playing poker. It's just semi-recently I started playing this way (a few months) and I've finally entered the time when I've started making a great steady income with poker. Tight aggressive is how you need to be. It'll make you the most money. Also, these strategies work at their best in rebuy tournaments where people love to just give away there chips. They work well in others too. There's always someone willing to call. Don't try this if you're playing a $100 NL tourney. :p I'm sure you won't get as far with this. I've never played one that high, but I can't imagine people being as dumb as they are in a $20 buy-in tournament.

Want to know something funny? I got AA while writing this post, hahaha. it surprised me because I haven't been getting the best of cards. I flipped back to my poker screen to see it and about jumped when I saw my time meter about to run out. :p I'm playing in a $1/$2 room and I made $60 from them. Not too bad.

Aces are lethal when you know how to play them! So learn! :)


Jon
 
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chicubs1616

Guest
You should always play AA slow.
Never fast.
This is by far the absolute worst strategy in playing AA. Playing AA slow gives more opponents a shot at seeing a flop, which as JonSherwood originally posted decreases AA's chances of winning. The more opponents you let in, the lower your winrate with AA is. Thus, by raising with AA you trim down the field, which instantly increases your odds of winning the hand.
 
E

Eytch

Guest
I have found that going all in with AA is a bad think but 4-5 time the bild bet usally gets out the ones that you dont want in on the pot.
 
HoldemChamp

HoldemChamp

Rock Star
I go with the pros on this one. Although nothing is 100%. AA should be played hard. All in is not playing AA hard. 4-5x the BB is playing them hard.

All in is to many times an invite for several people who want to get lucky to call you.

And since you have less of an advantage when there are multiple people calling your AA you are taking a big risk.

4-5x the Big Blinds shows you mean business. If you still get called by 3 people is was likely you they were going to do that to your all in. At least with the Big bet as opposed to an all in you have a chance to get away from the hand. All in leaves you no outs.
 
robwhufc

robwhufc

Cardschat Elite
The worse thing about getting AA is when you're BB, ready to go and ...... Fold, fold, fold ,fold, fold ,fold, fold, fold, fold and fold! And you know next hand is going to be a monster pot won by a pair of 4's.
 
J

JonSherwood

Guest
HoldemChamp said:
I go with the pros on this one. Although nothing is 100%. AA should be played hard. All in is not playing AA hard. 4-5x the BB is playing them hard.

All in is to many times an invite for several people who want to get lucky to call you.

And since you have less of an advantage when there are multiple people calling your AA you are taking a big risk.

4-5x the Big Blinds shows you mean business. If you still get called by 3 people is was likely you they were going to do that to your all in. At least with the Big bet as opposed to an all in you have a chance to get away from the hand. All in leaves you no outs.

I think it might also be important where you play. That's how I used to play them at other sites, but I now play at royal vegas Poker. If I raise 4-5x the big blind at RVP, anyone who already merely called the big blind calls that raise, and some after the raise too. In order to win with them at RVP you need to be VERY aggressive, a lot of times all-in aggressive. I usually only get 1 caller, and the occasional two, unless you're playing in a rebuy. You might get 3 which is bad, so in rebuys you really need to pay attention to how your table plays and whether or not an all-in will shake some opponents. Some players in a rebuy will call an all-in whenever they're put all-in. It's tricky.

4-5x the blind is how I always play them in ring games. You'll never see me going all-in preflop in a ring game. That's not very efficient when you're trying to win a pot.

How I play them might not work for everybody too. There are a lot of factors I consider when I have Aces, and it's hard to put them into words, you know? My experiences with poker have shown me how to play them. Everybody should work out their own strategy that works for them. :)

Jon
 
JediQuest

JediQuest

Enthusiast
I lose alot with rockets, thats why when I get them I never slow playem. I raise alot and hope they hold up. Especially when I'm short stack.
 
HoldemChamp

HoldemChamp

Rock Star
Jon,

I concur that an all in preflop strategy is valid at times to push out those who don't think anything of calling a 4-5x the BB bet. However, there are those that see an all in as an invite to get lucky and take a chance. Been down that road one to many times.

That leaves you with no out in case the hand doesn't go your way.

I still use the all in play. But, I just tend to be more selective when I do.
 
M

Mr. Polley

Guest
i agree with the people that are saying to play AA aggressively, and just want to add a side note to that.

when you hit your set of aces on the flop, this is still not a good time to slowplay. why? because of the hands people will call you with preflop. people will usually call with KQ, AQ, AJ, and when you see that Ace come up on the flop, most of these guys will have 3 cards to a straight, and very likely 4. if you hit your set and also pair the board for a boat, then slow play all day. otherwise, you still need to bet aggressively and be conscious of any straight draws. :)
 
XXIII

XXIII

Rock Star
Yeah but nothing better then going all in with Aces and a moron with 89 (off) calls and hits 2 eights on the flop.
 
H

Hamlet

Rising Star
do you understand this?

taken from OnlyPlayers
"I find to go allin with AA is worthless.
you have only 2 outs, win or lose!! (I know about the tie, just leave apart)

With AA I dont miss the oportunity to get money from my oponents buy just play it betting little by little, and have found it pays more, much more.

If go allin if there is 1 caller you need luck to win, nothing else, a few times there are 2 callers and you have a big possibility to lose. If there are 3 or more callers that table is in the moon.

I you just bet little by little there will be several callers and you can stop it without lossing all if you se the hand is not good. I you win it you will get the money of all of them, then a good amount"
 
I

ItaliaHockey

Guest
ya i always say that, AA is good, but against lots of ppl its nothing, 2 cards for a person beats AA right away
 
Q

qball4holdem

Rising Star
I know that AA is the best hand preflop, but the only way that it seems to work for me is to pressure it hard and make 'em fold. I know this method doesn't earn much of a chip stack, but it is a victory never the less. You have to decide if you'd rather risk taking a bad beat with the best preflop hand or win a small stack right off the bat.
 
O

OlKee2

Rising Star
that was great information, because i use to wonder that question also, and started catching on right what you said, about being more aggressive and not letting people get there flushes and trips....by over betting just enough to mayber get 1 or 2 callers...ty very much for the poka info...:knuddel:
 
diabloblanco

diabloblanco

Guest
I hate it when a dead horse is beaten. I understand the reason for the post (people bitching about losing with A-A) but this isn't a new idea. Its been posted here as many times as the dumbass "My Aces got Cracked" thread. Bottom line, slowplay and suffer the consquences.
 
J

JonSherwood

Guest
I've never seen one before. I figured I'd try and be of help or knock some sense into people. Stop being an asshole to the people who are trying to help out.

Jon
 
J

JonSherwood

Guest
I was talking about other posts tackling the issue of why people's aces are always getting cracked. You quoted me when I was talking about the posts saying, "My aces were cracked."

Nick's even told me it'd be smart to compile some of this info and make an article of it.

Jon
 
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diabloblanco

diabloblanco

Guest
No doubt man...I hate those threads as much as you do trust me. But the ones responding to them get just as old IMO. No particular offense to you man. It just seems like lately were losing some good members to one of two things either they're sick of the same regurgitated crap all the time or they are sick of never being able to bring something worthwhile away from here on a day to day basis.

It sucks, but that's what's happening it seems. Anyway, like I said, I inadvertantly seemed abrasive to you but it was basically a blanket statement that ended up in your thread.
 
joshyb20

joshyb20

Visionary
On a related note, mine just got busted.... Didn't want to chance it. Rose 1200 of my 4k, got reraised all in by the chip leader, he turned KK and hit a set. Oh well. Pissed me off needless to say, but that's poker for you.
 
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