The Idiot End Of A Flush

[Elvis Henry]

We've all heard the term "idiot end of a straight." You've got A2 with 345 on the board and you think you've got it made. Idiot!

Well, I've never heard the term "the idiot end of a flush" before, but after playing some rings on Stars and bodog last night, I made a killing twice when my boat beat someone's 10-high flush and another time my ace-high flush beat someone's flush that was holding 5-10 soooooted.

It is my general observation that there are a growing number of players that view any two suited cards as a true power hand, one to call a 3x or 4x BB raise with, or one to even jam with.

Thank God for these players. You hate them when they hit, but please do not type anything in chat to discourage this type of play. Please, just resist the temptation. You'll profit in the long run.

E

 

[Egon Towst]

Too right. Flush-chasing is a favourite sport among the intellectually challenged.

I`m not familiar with the term "idiot end of a straight", but I know Doyle Brunson talks about an "ignorant straight" - when there is (for example) 2345 on the board and you hold the Ace. His point is that an ignorant player might think this a good hand, but it is actually garbage and needs to go in the muck if there is any real betting. The opponent would need only one card (the 6) to beat you.

 

[Elvis Henry]

Harrington uses the term "idiot end of a straight" in his text. I think Lee Jones also refers to it in his limit text.

E

 

[Coryan]

Ah, what a fine (and true) statement!

Too right. Flush-chasing is a favourite sport among the intellectually challenged.

You take a normally crap hand (Ten-Five) and make 'em both clubs and the idiots go wild! Let one club fall on the flop and their flush is almost made...only two more needed. Even better, let three clubs hit on the flop and they are already putting a down-payment on that new Mercedes. A fourth club on the turn! Oh, who cares...they still have a flush, Ten-high. How can that be beat?

I love dem guys! Here, have a seat right next to me. Want a drink? Waitress, bring my friend a drink...whatever he wants.

 

[Marklar]

I don't know why so many want to make a flush anyway. In No Limit it's not like you're going to get paid off if you hit a flush. In Limit it's only a question of pot odds.

What you want is suited connectors and you don't want the flush you want the straight. So the ideal flop is a straight/flush draw with the hopes of making a straight because the implied odds are better. However you have the flush draw as backup.

One of the most annoying things is when someone calls your 4-5x rasie (you have AA) your opponent, probably in the big blind, has 82 of hearts and flops two pair. So you figure heh, no big deal I'll get it back from him. Then a tight player stacks him 20 minutes later and your money is in his hands without much of a chance getting it back

 

[Lana_Faith]

I've had the idiot flush beat me on more than one occasion because of such loose playing, so I know what you're talking about.

I flopped a wierd straight, 6-8-10 on the board and I'm holding 5-7 offsuit because of the BB... all three cards were different suits, so I figure I'll bet several times the BB and just take the little pot...

Wrong! I get not one, not two, but FOUR different callers. Turn comes the Q, and now there are two hearts on the table. I'm thinking, well, the Q itself MIGHT be an action card, if say, someone were holding Q-10 or Q-8 even, so maybe I can get a little more out of this than just a tiny pot. I bet twice the pot size.

ALL FOUR call me. One of them hits a low flush on the river and suddenly I'm on the ropes. Go figure...

 

[The Weevel]

Hi Lana,

I don't understand where you're coming from here. You had no hand at all and you're jamming the pot trying to chase an o/ended straight against a board that now has 2 overcards??

Didn't see that one in the strategy book! ;o)

 

[Marklar]

I've had the idiot flush beat me on more than one occasion because of such loose playing, so I know what you're talking about.

I flopped a wierd straight, 6-8-10 on the board and I'm holding 5-7 offsuit because of the BB... all three cards were different suits, so I figure I'll bet several times the BB and just take the little pot...

Wrong! I get not one, not two, but FOUR different callers. Turn comes the Q, and now there are two hearts on the table. I'm thinking, well, the Q itself MIGHT be an action card, if say, someone were holding Q-10 or Q-8 even, so maybe I can get a little more out of this than just a tiny pot. I bet twice the pot size.

ALL FOUR call me. One of them hits a low flush on the river and suddenly I'm on the ropes. Go figure...

You say you flopped a straight so you had 79, or where you semi bluffing a straight draw?

Anyway if you did flop the straight you played it good but got unlucky. If someone had J9 suited on this board they may have called (probably shouldnt to a big bet) They would have made their queen high straight on the turn plus a flush draw and then completing the flush on the river.

 

[Lana_Faith]

yes i'm sorry forgive me it was 4am when i typed this... lol yes my hold cards were obviously the 79 not the 57... sheesh... sometimes you THINK your brain is working, then it proves you otherwise.

 

[Coryan]

Geez, now it makes more sense.

yes i'm sorry forgive me it was 4am when i typed this... lol yes my hold cards were obviously the 79 not the 57... sheesh... sometimes you THINK your brain is working, then it proves you otherwise.

I hope you don't try playing poker at 4 a.m. The difference in 75 and 97 on that flop makes a world of difference! :smile:

 

[Lana_Faith]

No my usual time for playing poker is mid-to-late afternoon, with a pot of coffee brewing and a cup in my hand. I fire up Bodog and rape and pillage the competition. Lol...

Actually I've been dying to get more into tourneys and cash games. My play money game is pretty good (judging by the 2mil+ bank roll I currently have on Bodog and the 500,000+ bank roll I have on Celeb. Poker (bravotv.com/poker) But I recognize the fact that a cash table is VERY VERY different from play money. People defend their chips more and are FAR less likely to call a massive over-bet in a cash game.

So, here is my dilemma... I need to play in cash games to improve my cash game, but I live waaay out in the boonies of Colorado and can't drive to any B&M casinos to play a cash holdem game, and no one online seems to want to take an American's money anymore. Any suggestions?

 

[Green T]

Use ePassport or MyWebATM. Both will let US players transfer money. Full Tilt accepts both of them. I don't know about Bodog. Take note that it seems to take a few days (some times longer) to get the accounts set up so that you're able to move money around. Plus, read the fine print so you know what the different fees are. There are quite a few postings about both those services on Cardschat. Do a search to find them.

Good luck!

 

[taktaka]

It seems like everyday some site is dropping U.S. players. There is a thread which has a list of sites that allow U.S. players.

Here it is: https://www.cardschat.com/forum/pok...-us-players-updated-february-23-2007-a-73173/

P.S. I use my debit card to deposit at Full Tilt. I have a smaller regional bank. Transaction goes through every time.

 

[Elvis Henry]

It took two weeks before ePassporte verified my bank account. I ended up not using them. Loading via MoneyGram is much less expensive. MoneyGram locations are everywhere. It beats the hell out of Western Union, too. Once you get up to 2,000 FPP's Stars also gives you the option of the payTru visa card.

E

 

[Lana_Faith]

Some very good suggestions there. I live waaaay out in the boonies of Colorado, and there are a couple smaller regional banks here. Maybe I should try setting up an account with one of them just for my poker.