AA again Try this.

[mattisme]

you should definatly call......when im playing in a tourney when i get close to the money is when i start getting really good because im not looking to make a quick buck i no everyone at that point will fold almost everything unless they have the nuts so i can be holding 72 and ill still win those pots......what im trying to say is if u got a hand like that u need to call to try and get as many chips as possible so you can win instead of goin for the quick buck

 

[starfall]

Basically, pre-flop Aces will be a favourite to win. The main worry with that kind of scenario is that you'll find yourself against an AK and AQ as well as a pair or 2, so tha you have little chance to improve.
Yes, on the bubble you're risking going away with nothing, but it's the best chance you'll have of getting a decent stack size and getting seriously back into the tournament.
That said, if you have 4 people all-in and you're 1 place outside, you're probably 75% or more likely to find yourself guaranteed in the money if you don't play the hand. It depends how big a swing you're willing to take in your tournament fees, and what the payout structure is.
Another consideration is how short a stack you are... if you have only a couple of chips, and the next blinds will still take most of your chips even if you triple up, then ensuring the money placing is worthwhile. If you have enough chips that tripling up will put you back up to a half-decent stack size compared to your opposition, then play it.

 

[Dennis C]

Excellent answers to this thread. I think a few that responded didn't read the original very well. This was a what would you do scenario not an AA is the better hand thread. Thanks to all for your colorful responses.

 

[Bill_Hollorian]

The issue here is the humongous leak that you give by not calling.
Once you identify an opponent playing so tight that they are folding AA, in the bubble, make sure that the minimum bet commits 75% of his stack every hand, and push them all in in the blinds.

Some make the case for folding AA in the bubble.

Hell, I could even argue there are other places where it makes more sense to fold them.

Bill

 

[shwingzilla]

Buy in fees for all the tournaments I get in can add up pretty quickly. It is a long shot to win. Although I play to win one of my first priorities is to make the money. When it comes down to the bubble and getting out, I let someone else be the fall guy. The return of my entry fee plus the extra few "cents" allows me to play in the next tourney. It is not that often that you are in that position, but why waste your entry fee on a coin flip? I sit and wait for those people that are willing to try to go for the "win" and get busted. They go out, I make the money. I depend on those people. Also, in some tourneys that bubble spot may make the difference of winning an entry to another tourney. If you won a satelite entry to the WSOP on a small entry fee, would your thoughts then change? Now we are talking about a few thousand dollars. Maybe that is just pocket change for some people, but that is a day in Vegas for me.

I have no idea why these threads are so popular. AA is about as good as you are going to get. If taking the risk is too much for you, why play at all? Your chances of even breaking even are much less than a coinflip when you first enter a tourney, so why are you entering? Unless of course all you care about is time spent playing poker, and winning money doesn't matter to you.

 

[F Paulsson]

If you're playing the tournament for the money (and not the glory) the answer you're looking for is in the equity of your decision. Without specifics I can't calculate it for you (your stack sizes vs. the others stacks, prize structure, etc.), but the decision usually leans to "call".

Sklansky actually brings up this situation in Tournament Poker FAP, and shows situations where it would be correct to fold. But - again - that's based on a maximizing-your-profit point of view, not the glory of winning.

 

[joosebuck]

AA is a headsup or 3way hand. You do not want to play if more than 3 (and it looks that way) will be in on the hand.

 

[F Paulsson]

AA is a headsup or 3way hand. You do not want to play if more than 3 (and it looks that way) will be in on the hand.

I do want to play it. The only time I would consider not playing it is if my equity is larger if I fold it.

Let's do the equity calculation and see where we land, and make some numbers up.

3 people are all-in before the action gets to me, and they all have me covered. This is important, because it means that no matter who wins the hand (other than me) I'll end up on the bubble, as I'm the short stack. Let's say that my stack is 10k, and it's the wsop main event. If I win, I figure to go up to 40k stack, and if I lose, I'm gone. Let's furthermore say that I'm 50% to win (someone can check with PokerStove how likely I am to win against some decent range of hands these opponents might have)

The prize pool of the main event is roughly that of the buy-ins, right? So that makes it very easy to calculate:

Presuming that I'm as good as the rest of the players here, or rather on average as good as them, my equity will be whatever my chipstack is. Or conversely:

If I fold, I have an equity of $10,000.
If I call, I will have an equity of $40,000 half the time, and $0 half the time.

Clearly, calling gives me an average equity of $20,000 and is the preferable option.

I think I did this right. Let me know if I screwed up somewhere.

 

[joosebuck]

but vs 4 people you wont win 50% of the time, right?

 

[joosebuck]

AA vs 22 vs KQd vs J10h vs 67s, aces are 34% to win, so the fold is 10k and the call is what.. 13k?

 

[F Paulsson]

You listed four opponents now, not three. And you also picked three of the worst possible hands for AA to be up against (suited connectors in separate suits). But removing any one of those four (and thus making it three opponents) would bump the aces up to ~50%. It's hard for me to create a situation in the odds calculator where we're less than a 44% favorite.

I'd say 50% against three opponents is likely to be quite a low figure. Against most hands that people are willing to go all-in with, AA should win significantly more than that.

 

[robwhufc]

God, the AA one again.

Joosebuck it's simple - the more players you are up against the less likely you are to win with AA. However, the more players you are up against, the more money you win when AA holds up. You will NEVER get to the stage where you do not have pot odds to call with AA - it's impossible, as AA will ALWAYS be favourite over your opponents. If you are unhappy taking 5/1 odds on a 2/1 chance because you know you will lose 2 times out of 3, then you shouldn't play Poker anymore.

 

[joosebuck]

Well I wasn't giving advice on how to play AA, I was just asking if you should lay it down vs. like 3-4 all-ins before you..

 

[joosebuck]

hah actually it looks like i was giving advice, but uh i think i meant to phrase it as a question, because i wasn't sure if it should be played in that situation or not

 

[~~Shelynn~~]

AA -I bet it and re-bet because if I don't- I get burnt with 2 pair crap. It scares me to but know it's the best hand going in and you have to be confident in playing pocket A's. I don't fold them till I get busted and that's quite often! It's just the luck of the draw.

 

[cornolio]

My buddie Crock65 asked me a few days ago if I would fold pocket aces being the low stack and folowing 2 re-raises. I told him hell no. Then he asked one that brought up an interesting point. Put this in your pipe and tell me what it tastes like:
You have pocket aces pre-flop, your on the button. 1st position raises the blind x2, 4th pos. raises 2x that. Next player goes all-in. You are the small stack, you know you have the best starting hand, then you relize you are on the bubble and if you go out this hand you get shit. Do you call or do you fold and make the money? To fold pocket aces is a sin acording to (The Poker Bible), but we've all seen AA go down hard and win like the champs that they are. What would you do?

You got to go all in and you have to taunt everyone at the table while your doing it. I've seen it win and lose , but if it's going to lose you'll have to show me. This is the chance I've been waiting for to make my charge for # 1 baby. Let's do this.

 

[JeeDub84]

I agree with most on calling with the Aces in a cash tourny. You are the short stack and you have a 4-1 ROI with the best starting hand. You have to take the chance to get enough chips to compete for a higher placing. I also agree with Crock65 though about the satellite tournys. If someone else is at risk of busting out then you should let go of the aces to further your chance at winning a seat. Because the satellite tourny prizes are all the same amount then you should probalbly be conservative. You must also think about Aces against three other opponents. Your chances of a winning hand are now reduced drastically.

 

[dinosdynasty]

I've gone out on the bubble so many times that the boys call me Bubble Boy now but the times that I have won have more than made up for the money lost on the bubble. Always play to win, you are the leader going to the flop, what more could you ask for?

The exception would be a Sattelite where all of the spots pay the same but you didn't mention a Sattelit in your original post.

 

[chicubs1616]

NEVER FOLD AA PREFLOP.

Unless it is a satellite and you are on the bubble where one more player goes out and everyone wins. You only fold here if you can fold into the seat and someone who covers you pushed all-in. Also, if one or two short stacks go all-in on the bubble and you have a short-stack as well, folding is smart if one of them will be eliminated or SEVERELY damaged so much so that the blinds will destroy them the next time they are hit.