Preflop all ins - tournaments

Funtast

Funtast

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Hey there.

I'd like to discuss something that has been bothering me for some time now.

It's preflop all in ranges in early/mid stages of tournaments where you are having a big edge over the field.

So what exacly is bothering me:
Super spewy fishy villian opens mid/late pos, you got AJs+/AQ+ and 3bet from late pos 80bb+ eff. Villian jams. You know you are ahead of his range and a call definetely is at least slightly +ev but often you end up in 60/40 and 50/50 situations where it might have been better to just fold because of edge you lose? I am just getting so pissed to bust early with AQs vs KJo/KTo or AKo vs 44/../88 for 80bb+ deep against someone playing 50+VP/20+PR.

What is you opinion about this situation? Would you take all these small+eq spots or play your edge for less but bigger +eq spots?
Is flatting with good but non premium (AA, KK, qq) hands an option for you?

Howdy.

Ps: Don't get me wrong, if I have a big stack, those situations are no brainers.
 
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mr.fers_one

mr.fers_one

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Hey there.

I'd like to discuss something that has been bothering me for some time now.

It's preflop all in ranges in early/mid stages of tournaments where you are having a big edge over the field.

So what exacly is bothering me:
Super spewy fishy villian opens mid/late pos, you got AJs+/AQ+ and 3bet from late pos 80bb+ eff. Villian jams. You know you are ahead of his range and a call definetely is at least slightly +ev but often you end up in 60/40 and 50/50 situations where it might have been better to just fold because of edge you lose? I am just getting so pissed to bust early with AQs vs KJo/KTo or AKo vs 44/../88 for 80bb+ deep against someone playing 50+VP/20+PR.

What is you opinion about this situation? Would you take all these small+eq spots or play your edge for less but bigger +eq spots?
Is flatting with good but non premium (AA, KK, qq) hands an option for you?

Howdy.

Ps: Don't get me wrong, if I have a big stack, those situations are no brainers.
in such early stages, if you are already exhibiting, then with monsters... aa, kk, qq, on AKs is still possible, but at your discretion... and so it's better to reset, the tournament time is more important and better, yes, you can end up going in and you will immediately double, but you can also lose and get out at the first level of blinds... and if you continue to play, then the probability that you will develop the stack will be greater. well, this is purely my opinion, I would throw out AQo at an early stage.
 
hardongear

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This use to be a huge tilt/mistake of mine when I first started. I had to learn willpower and control myself not to do this. Took awhile to break this habit/bad play. But in the end anything before I'm in the money NO. I don't call off small edge all-in's when I have a good stack and can just take a pass. This isn't cash tables where I can just reload and keep doing it with villains who have too high a VPIP.

But then I feel as a long time winning micro/low stakes MTT player I'm always one of the better players in any given field I play. That means seeing flops favors me. Taking coin flips, which is basically playing bingo and depending more on luck simply doesn't favor me.

My advice would be start study all-in pre-flop ranges per all stack sizes depending on what stage of the MTT is at and type of villain you're facing.


Cheers!!!
 
Baoka

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Này.

Tôi muốn thảo luận về một vấn đề khiến tôi băn khoăn bấy lâu nay.

Đó là tất cả các phạm vi preflop ở giai đoạn đầu/giữa của giải đấu mà bạn đang có lợi thế lớn trên sân.

Vì vậy, chính xác điều gì đang làm phiền tôi:
Villian siêu cá tính mở pos giữa/cuối, bạn nhận được AJs+/AQ+ và 3bet từ pos muộn 80bb+ eff. Villian mứt. Bạn biết rằng bạn đang vượt quá phạm vi của anh ta và một cuộc gọi chắc chắn ít nhất là +ev một chút nhưng bạn thường kết thúc trong các tình huống 60/40 và 50/50 trong đó có lẽ tốt hơn là bạn nên bỏ bài vì bạn thua? Tôi đang rất bực mình khi bị phá sản sớm với AQs vs KJo/KTo hoặc AKo vs 44/../88 với 80bb+ deep trước người chơi 50+VP/20+PR.

Bạn có ý kiến gì về tình trạng này? Bạn sẽ giành lấy tất cả những điểm eq nhỏ này hay chơi lợi thế của mình để giành được những điểm +eq nhỏ hơn nhưng lớn hơn?
Việc chơi bài với các bài tốt nhưng không cao cấp (AA, KK, qq) có phải là một lựa chọn dành cho bạn không?

Xin chào.

Ps: Đừng hiểu lầm, mình có stack lớn thì những tình huống đó không có gì phải đắn đo.
Yes, don't think you have a lot of chips and underestimate your competitors.
 
Funtast

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I am aware of ranges, that's the whole point. I question if call or fold is MORE +ev in your opinion. Folding 7-9bb is something. And yes sure, under normal circumstances only qq++ or maybe KK++ is the play.
 
TeUnit

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The bigger your edge the less you want to be taking these kind of flips.
 
pentazepam

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You don't have that of a big edge in normal online MTTs as you think.

You should take every +EV opportunity you get. (with some ICM exceptions close or in the money).

A 60-40 edge pre-flop will make you a millionaire if you get them (and take them) often enough.
 
dannystanks

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Calling off 80bb in early or middle stage with AK or AQ is not a good idea in my opinion.
 
Kbscores

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I think it depends on the tournament structure and personally I think your best option is to learn to be ok with it. Ev is realized over the course of many hands. Meaning statistically speaking you will lose some of them. We often think more about the hands we lose vs the ones we win. If you collectively look across all of those hands you've probably won more chips than lost and those moments have set you up to run deep. If you have pot odds you should take the shot. The only time I'd fold those hands with slight edge is if there is tremendous ICM pressure. For example pocket queens on the bubble with a larger stack already all in in a satellite/survivor with shorter stacks still to act or blind out. In that moment there is no reason to take the risk because I'm likely to receive max value.

Someone once said to me - every time you bust should be a bad beat. If it isn't then you probably aren't playing well.
 
Igor Popadyk

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if you are sure that you are older than his opening range, then you are doing everything correctly, the main problem here is variance, and you yourself are ready to place 60*40 - then you yourself must decide whether you are ready to play in such a situation, without winning such hands you cannot win the tournament
 
takinitSLEAZEE

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I am just getting so pissed to bust early with AQs vs KJo/KTo or AKo vs 44/../88 for 80bb+ deep against someone playing 50+VP/20+PR.
Calling off your stack w/AQs or AKo is highly frowned upon, especially out of the $. I see this all the time; you want the advantage of putting the villain to the test for all their chips. If you just like racing and gambling w/a nice ace v XX then go for it, just be able to accept the outcome.
 
AndyFio

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I think in this case people often act on the principle of all or nothing, it is easier to bet all the chips with QJ and win or lose with these cards than to think and play for a long time using your skills.
 
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