Mistake or cooler?

[duggs]

First mistake is 3xing of a 30bb eff stack, I would be 2xing here, folding preflop probably foldin to his flop sizing aswell.

If the hand went min raise/min bet then I would call, then on the flop he 1/3 potted it I would call and evaluate on turn, but the type of range min raises over a 3x of your stack is outrageously strong.

You can't discount strong hands assuming they will check
Flop btw, you have bluff catcher and a few ill advised setmines that got there, he has all overpairs and over cards, he might check something like 98s or A8s but assuming he checks the top of his range is pretty nonsensical

 

[thatgreekdude]

First mistake is 3xing of a 30bb eff stack, I would be 2xing here, folding preflop probably foldin to his flop sizing aswell.

If the hand went min raise/min bet then I would call, then on the flop he 1/3 potted it I would call and evaluate on turn, but the type of range min raises over a 3x of your stack is outrageously strong.

You can't discount strong hands assuming they will check
Flop btw, you have bluff catcher and a few ill advised setmines that got there, he has all overpairs and over cards, he might check something like 98s or A8s but assuming he checks the top of his range is pretty nonsensical

this is a strange hand because i'm usually always opening 2.2-2.5x but this hand i just got lazy.. it's always easier to fold to a 3bet when you make it around 2x because it's not like you've committed a lot of chips 30bbs deep. thanks for advice

 

[duggs]

I think even 2.5 is pretty big as a std for 30bb deep, plus pot is smaller when we get called and our steal needs to succeed less often

 

[thatgreekdude]

I think even 2.5 is pretty big as a std for 30bb deep, plus pot is smaller when we get called and our steal needs to succeed less often

I think when you're trying to steal though wouldn't a min raise kind of induce the blinds to limp with marginal holdings like suited connectors and unsuited broadway that's why i don't like the min raise, never seems to work for me

 

[duggs]

It still works, but it needs to succeed less often to be profitable. And most people are in elastic, and if they do we vbet and insta profit

 

[thatgreekdude]

that makes sense now i guess thanks

 

[Carl Trooper]

Making mistakes is part of the game. It is especially very annoying when you are deep in a tournament and that ONE mistake costs you everything. Mega tilt.

Nothing like playing perfect for 5 hours, making the final 27 and being in top 10 just to lose 1 hand because you played it poorly, and be all but out.

Keep on trucking along and play as best as you can. When you make a mistake, recognize it and try to learn from it. This is the only way you can keep improving!

 

[nevetshan]

At that point, I would've have folded due to him re-raising me. K-8 isn't a great hand cause at this point a lot of hands can have you beat pre-flop. It wasn't worth losing more money trying to out flop him.

 

[IM deusXmachina]

I agree with the thought that you should fold PF after he raises you up with your read being AQ AK, it puts you in an especially tough spot if the flop comes K-J-x(not 8). So forget the cooler bit...in a spot late in a tourney there are times you must follow your gut and make the folds you don't want to make. I have found myself folding AKo and AQo LATE in trnys lately B/C I put a read on my Opponent of KK AA or if I have AQ that they are holding AK. It has yielded results and gotten me to more Final Tables. I see the flops come to blanks and run out with me being SOL, only to maintain my stack and see another Player KO'd by a JJ that I wouldn't have been able to crack.

OF COURSE its easy to like your decision/ or hate it after the result has been seen...The Key to Life and Poker is to make what you feel is the best decision for you, and if it turns out you were wrong then you learn how to be better the next time!

 

[el_magiciann]

Can't be a cooler, it is a clear mistake to me, you can't shove that easy deep in tournament, u better re raise the flop to find out where your opponent is and you cant shove really that easily, better fold it after you faced the re raise pre flop, thats what i would do.

 

[tohos]

Raising 3x in the first place is also a mistake. With a 30bb stack, you should be raising 2.5x at most. Usually just a 2x should be fine(I rarely raise 2.5x and almost never do 3x because the effective stacks are rarely deep enough for it).
If you are opening 3x as a standard regardless of the stage of the tourney or stack size you are going to lose chips fast in certain situations such as this one, because you are opening for 10% of your stack with a weak hand and not only that you can't fold when you have to call another 10% more from a small 3b which is more often than not a monster(because they don't want you to fold so they don't raise as big, reverse psychology.

Randomly putting people on AK / AQ just because you don't want to believe they have a monster is a big mistake and will cost you time and time again if you don't stop doing that. This is the trademark big leak of a stubborn player who doesn't like to fold to 3bet because they don't want to give the 3b credit and want to try and outplay him or whatever post flop and then hit a pair and get stacked.

And as someone pointed out above, if your read was that he missed the flop, reraise shoving him is a bad play considering that in the case that he did have a hand(like here) he would call, but he fold all his trash/missed hands meaning you don't get any more value. Whereas if you just called, he might fire another barrel with the said trash/air hands. Your read was that he was trying to screw with you right? So let him go ahead and do it. As played though, while you might be able to get away from the hand post flop at times, I think this is one of the flops where your hand should be best often enough so I feel calling is fine.

Another thing I want to point out is that he is 3betting your 3x open. People generally don't want to mess around too much against 3x open(thats 10% of your effective stacks, if he want to 3b you standard 2.5x your open, he would be committed). Well actually 32k is not even a min raise here, min raise would be 24k to call since you raised 24 to the starting 12, but yes still slightly smaller than a 'standard' 3b but that might just be because you opened a 3x making it all weird with the effective stacks.

The main mistakes here imo are
1. opening 3x
2. calling the 3b
could possibly be linked back to the 3x open, giving you better odds to call)
3. assuming opponent has AK/AQ
if he is 3betting you for value sure maybe they make up like near half of his range but you can't just assume he HAS to have those hands.
if he has been 3betting your steals light then his range is surely wider
4. reraise shoving on the flop