jackass strategy

nevadanick

nevadanick

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I saw part of Aussie Millions where Phil Ivey raises with rags very often and reraises very frequently. ? was there a reason to this

As mentioned, TV shows give a very distorted view of real-life poker. You do NOT see the non-action hands, folded hand after hand. Basing your own play only on what you see them do on TV makes for a VERY bad strategy.

Any $ you've made is a fluke. You'll lose $ in the long run playing like this.

Yep, these are the majority of players that we see disappear from the player list in the first hour of large field MTT's.

I think you just made me open my mind by making me realize that changing styles of play can be very effective. Play loose-aggressive and then when people think i play like a lucky jackass while being a chip leader, i become tight-aggressive using chip leader strategy and play solid poker. By the time people try to adjust to my loose-aggressive play, I can play tight-aggressive and it'll screw up their strategy. Once people start thinking I play very conservatively, I will then bluff often and play loose again because I've given tight-image to the table. Changing styles can be very effective. Thank you very much for this information. I guess changing styles can be effective. I'll try this tomorrow in daily dollar.

So far, I've been playing through one style, which was tight-aggressive with little gambling feel inside of me. But now, I'll try changing styles.

You might want to consider limiting those 'changes of style' to more of a 'range of hands' change. Switching from jackass mode to super-nit puts you all over the board and still means your sessions of 'jackass' mode need to survive with nothing more than luck. Good players pickup on this quickly and will still adjust to you and the chip bleeding will continue for you.

Look at your own stats on OPR. Are your MTT results anywhere near what you would like to see?

I built it up to 7000. Kept doing the same thing, and then later, when I got monster hand, I flopped set of 7s. Kept doing same thing but opponent had pocket Kings and hit his King on the river. Since I figured I would be going on tilt from this bad beat, I didn't bother re-buying.

I'm wondering if that guy would've laid down his overpair(pocket Kings) if I played tight-aggressive and pushed all-in like I normally played. I think downfall to this strategy is, you run into many bad beats compared to if you played tight-aggressive.

If you want a good comparison, check out the following for yourself. It will take some time to do it, but you might find the comparisons interesting.

Look at your Full Tilt OPR stats. Your style MUST be very loose overall... it shows.

Look at my pokerstars OPR stats (user ID = nicklong on Stars). I'm ITM almost 40% playing a mostly tight-agg style. The only reason my ROI is down overall is from playing in the CC Invasion games that are outside my Stars BR, but I play them for fun with CC members and it's with all monies won starting a BR from $0. I have never deposited on ANY poker site. Remove the few $2.20 games and I would be a +ROI playing the dimer and 25c DONKFESTS. (I've also won the LMS (Last Man Standing) in the Invasions to pay for almost all of the losses in the $2 games.)

I'm not a poker genius ... far from it, but I've played live since '69 and save my cash for live table play and MTT's here and in Reno. What I've played online is more 'experimental' and for the fun of it, but I still maintain a tight-agg nit style.

Also take a quick look at my Full Tilt OPR (id = nevadanick). I'm a losing player like you as far as ROI, but that's equally deceiving since I've never deposited on any site. How do I have the funds to play all the fun CC and OFC events? Freeroll and ring game winnings.... but the point is, my play is tight-agg there too and I get a lot closer to ITM than you do playing 'jackass' strategy.

Check it out ... then decide what works. If you think 'jackass' works for you, please continue. We love your chips, even with all the blood on them ... :D :p
 
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PoKeRFoRNiA

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As mentioned, TV shows give a very distorted view of real-life poker. You do NOT see the non-action hands, folded hand after hand. Basing your own play only on what you see them do on TV makes for a VERY bad strategy.



Yep, these are the majority of players that we see disappear from the player list in the first hour of large field MTT's.



You might want to consider limiting those 'changes of style' to more of a 'range of hands' change. Switching from jackass mode to super-nit puts you all over the board and still means your sessions of 'jackass' mode need to survive with nothing more than luck. Good players pickup on this quickly and will still adjust to you and the chip bleeding will continue for you.

Look at your own stats on OPR. Are your MTT results anywhere near what you would like to see?



If you want a good comparison, check out the following for yourself. It will take some time to do it, but you might find the comparisons interesting.

Look at your Full Tilt OPR stats. Your style MUST be very loose overall... it shows.

Look at my Pokerstars OPR stats (user ID = nicklong on Stars). I'm ITM almost 40% playing a mostly tight-agg style. The only reason my ROI is down overall is from playing in the CC Invasion games that are outside my Stars BR, but I play them for fun with CC members and it's with all monies won starting a BR from $0. I have never deposited on ANY poker site. Remove the few $2.20 games and I would be a +ROI playing the dimer and 25c DONKFESTS. (I've also won the LMS (Last Man Standing) in the Invasions to pay for almost all of the losses in the $2 games.)

I'm not a poker genius ... far from it, but I've played live since '69 and save my cash for live table play and MTT's here and in Reno. What I've played online is more 'experimental' and for the fun of it, but I still maintain a tight-agg nit style.

Also take a quick look at my Full Tilt OPR (id = nevadanick). I'm a losing player like you as far as ROI, but that's equally deceiving since I've never deposited on any site. How do I have the funds to play all the fun CC and OFC events? Freeroll and ring game winnings.... but the point is, my play is tight-agg there too and I get a lot closer to ITM than you do playing 'jackass' strategy.

Check it out ... then decide what works. If you think 'jackass' works for you, please continue. We love your chips, even with all the blood on them ... :D :p

If you're curious, I'm actually on profit. During beginning of this year, I lost about 200 bucks. But later, through help of my friend, my roommate won 45 dollars through ofc freeroll, we played cash game together and won about 300 bucks. He pulled the funds and negated our previous losses. Then through help of cc freerolls, i got funds and played mainly cash games. I was always a blaster. As for tournament ranking, it's very low and horrible. I'll tell you why. Every single day, I grind few dollars easily through .05/.1 cash game and register for tournament right away. And then I start playing like a jackass/retard and donk out. In other words, I never take daily dollars, $1000 guarantee rebuys, seriously. Only type of tournaments I take seriously are sng but I rarely play sng too nowadays. I mostly play cash games. Only tournaments I enjoy playing are cc freerolls and sometimes cc buy-in tournaments. I have a lot to thank cardschat. I've promised debi that since I negated my losses with help of cardschat and i'm on profit, if I reach 1000, I'm donating some funds to cardschat.

I'll tell you why I do not take daily dollar seriously. If you can look up my stats, you'll see that only cash I made was $20 from daily dollar. I grinded my ass off for 6 hours in daily dollar only to get 39th place and 20 dollars. In other words, I was very disappointed. I made up my mind and use this strategy. I either play like a super/ultra jackass/donkey who's extremely lucky and pull Jamie Gold throughout the tournament and go deep OR bust out early and get it over with by going back to cash games. Most of the time, I bust out early and go back to cash games.
 
PoKeRFoRNiA

PoKeRFoRNiA

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Oh, and sometimes, I join daily dollar for free since I use those stupid ftp points to enter daily dollar satellite, donk it out to 2nd or 1st place and get free entry to daily dollars.
 
nevadanick

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Then based on what you wrote above, the 'jackass strategy' is not profitable. You did ask in your OP for advice on playing that kind of strategy.

Mine is.... simply... don't expect it to be profitable.

Tight-agg with a few well placed bolder moves based on stack and position works well and can be profitable. Not sure what you're trying to accomplish with this thread. You start out with it being good strategy, learning to control it, then not controlling it, then losing with it, then winning with it, then not winning with it at all ... :confused: :confused: :confused:
 
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LizzyJ

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I played ultra jackass in a freeroll with about 2500 people and top place won a hefy $5.00

I went all on every hand and ended up chip leader for most of the tournament and made everyone extremely upset. The comments were soooooooo bad. lol.
 
pdutty

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I played ultra jackass in a freeroll with about 2500 people and top place won a hefy $5.00

I went all on every hand and ended up chip leader for most of the tournament and made everyone extremely upset. The comments were soooooooo bad. lol.

Well this strategy does work well for Freerolls since you have nothing to lose but an energy to get in that tournament. :rolleyes:
 
Poker Orifice

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When are you playing next? Can you please pm so I can reg. for the same game?
 
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LizzyJ

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Well this strategy does work well for Freerolls since you have nothing to lose but an energy to get in that tournament. :rolleyes:


well actually I had to leave so I figured I'd just go all in on the first hand and it would be over with. Evryone went all in and I won and then I had this monster chips lead. Kept going all in and kept winning. lol. Go figure.
 
PoKeRFoRNiA

PoKeRFoRNiA

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Then based on what you wrote above, the 'jackass strategy' is not profitable. You did ask in your OP for advice on playing that kind of strategy.

Mine is.... simply... don't expect it to be profitable.

Tight-agg with a few well placed bolder moves based on stack and position works well and can be profitable. Not sure what you're trying to accomplish with this thread. You start out with it being good strategy, learning to control it, then not controlling it, then losing with it, then winning with it, then not winning with it at all ... :confused: :confused: :confused:

I'm trying to see if there's a way to be profitable with jackass strategy because I know players like Phil Ivey, Erick Lindgren, Daniel Negreanu, Patrik Antonius, Tom Dwan who play like jackass, raising with rags, outplaying their opponent by bluffs frequently. I just think that someone with very good instincts and very good skills in poker can have extremely profitable result using this method but on the other hand, if someone has no instincts or suck at poker and try this, they'll go broke very easily. I just think I suck at using this strategy and believe that there's a way to train myself to become better using this method.
 
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cAPSLOCK

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I know players like Phil Ivey, Erick Lindgren, Daniel Negreanu, Patrik Antonius, Tom Dwan who play like jackass, raising with rags, outplaying their opponent by bluffs frequently.


Part of the reason they are capable of "raising with rags, outplaying their opponent by bluffs" is they are intimately aware of what cards their opponents will be playing under various circumstances.

Trying to employ the "jackass strategy" before you understand these intricacies is a recipe for disaster.

Another way to say it is: You have to be significantly better than ALL of you opponents post flop before playing like a jackass pre flop will ever be profitable.
 
cardplayer52

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this is workable strategy but you need to adjust some basic concepts. playing total junk hands is not a sound strategy. but however showing down a junk hand once in a while at showdown can be very profitably in future hands. you really only need to show one down people will pay off for a while to come. instead of playing total garbage play hands such a suited gappers and and connectors. Another major thing is the bet sizing. you might try to make different raise sizes. make a big 3bet take down the pot and show that 46s. the next few times you got a big hand make a huge over bet. the trick here is to try to get more money in with stronger hands. another thing about this stategy is you have to pay attention to the dynamic it creates. if that nit desides to limp UTG after you raised 6 hands in a row. you can rest assrured he get the goods. if you ask me this sounds alot like the stategy stu unger used to use good luck with it. but knowing when to change gears and avoiding traps is not an easy task.
 
spiderman637

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that wont give u profit at longtime pal..
its just a short time fest..
the onbly strong point in ur play is "ur reraise", which puts ur opponents brain on dilemma and mayyyyy be he folds...
other than that, its just luck for you..
i dont recommend this type of play...
sorry !!!
 
cardplayer52

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I tried playing in 10 cent re-buy tournament on full tilt $1000 guaranteed prize. I was doing well earlier today. I was chip leader upto 20k while everyone starts with 1000. I fell in love with my image so much, I was cracking up when I was inducing bluffs and run of luck. There was a pot where I raised with 35o and then when flop came out AA9. I check-raised all-in and everybody folded. I induced my bluff and was laughing so hard behind my screen. I raised with Jack 5 offsuit and flopped two pairs, I was doing same thing and I built my chips. I fell in love with this image so much, later, I was going wreckless and lost control, and got eliminated easily. I need very good discipline and have to know when to slow down and play tight. I knew exactly when to stop(when I was chip leader over 20k while average chipstack was 3k). But I fell in love with bluffs and being jackass so much, I just couldn't stop. I need to work on lot of things for playing loose-aggressive.

you need to be aware of what the average stack size will be when the bubble bursts. take the dailt dollar for eg. there's usually about 7k players with 3k in starting chips and 1080 get paid. so the average stack when in the money will be around 19.5k if its early and your sitting on a stack of 20k there no reason to bust before getting deep in the money. this doesnt mean being a total nit but smaller bets can foten threaten larger ones in the future. try keeping the bluffs close to 1/3 of the villains stack. that way you can save chips if they desid to come over the top of you. often a smaller raises get more repect. here's one try building a big pot then making a minumum bet of the river. this gives you huge odds when it works and you will shocked how often it does.
 
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witl69

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I dont think the jackass strategy is for me at all but if you can figure it out and make it work for you then good luck to you I hope that you enjoy it and make it profitable to you and your bankroll
 
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LizzyJ

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Well I tried jackassin' (lol) for 10 straight tournaments and didn't win a hand. Those hyper turbo 1 cent tourney's at PS is prime breeding ground for jackassin'(lol)
 
FREEROLLSFTW

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i hate this strategy when I only play premium hands. Especially on a board like K 9 3, getting busted by 9-3. I cannot try out this strategy cuz im still new to poker
 
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eddy2009

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I have tried this in freerolls a few times. Basically I start off with this "jackass" or playing like I don't give a shit strategy. If I sm able to build up a decent stack I will then tighten my game up much more. I also will show more hands when I am doing this.

I do that also, but I will always have somthing like top pair or 2 pair... it always seems to work but sadlly only for somthing like the first 30 minutes.

What do u normally have?
 
PoKeRFoRNiA

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check out Lex Veldhuis. Best jackass strategy ever performed in main event.
 
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Lonsdaleite

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I think this can be an effective strategy. When you are playing at a tight table, you can make money by stealing the blinds and getting paid off on your monsters when you hit. The trick is knowing when to be loose and when to be tight. TAG is the most profitable poker because in general you play against loose players who will pay off top pair or an over pair.

Ivey, Negreanu, Antonious, and Durr are players who kill other Pros. Their loose style is able to take advantage of tighter players. Tighter players will lay down the best hand; therefore, bluffs are successful more often.

LAG poker can't win in low limit games because that is the way everyone else is playing.
 
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bilgert

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Super LAG styles when done at low limit tables tend to be boom or bust endeavors. It works when the rest of the table is tight, but since you'll find people who will reshove or call your all-in on draws, weak pairs, etc, you'll often find your bluffs exposed and/or resucked out on.

If you read Gus Hansen's "Every Hand Revealed" book, it actually gives you a pretty good insight into his seemingly LAG style. There is actually a method to his madness, but it also shows that he is willing to gamble.
 
Leo 50

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The players you used as an example are not playing 'jackass' poker.
They are making calculated moves based on the action at the table, the betting patterns of the others and their position in the hand.
And probably dozens of other factors only he knows

If Ivey enters a pot with 3-5os he is doing it with the intention of stealing that pot either on the flop or some other street. He is also prepared to dump the hand if he meets with resistance post flop.

You need to realize that what you see on TV as 'jackass' poker is far from it.

If you want to use this approach to poker be prepared to spend a lot of your BR for your education.

:cool:
 
JimmyBrizzy

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I'm trying to see if there's a way to be profitable with jackass strategy because I know players like Phil Ivey, Erick Lindgren, Daniel Negreanu, Patrik Antonius, Tom Dwan who play like jackass, raising with rags, outplaying their opponent by bluffs frequently. I just think that someone with very good instincts and very good skills in poker can have extremely profitable result using this method but on the other hand, if someone has no instincts or suck at poker and try this, they'll go broke very easily. I just think I suck at using this strategy and believe that there's a way to train myself to become better using this method.

Just keep playing as many hands and tournaments possible until you get good at it
 
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bluespadepoker

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Those micro limit donkaments have such a high variance it could lead you to believe it's a profitable strategy, but over the long run, it's a loser. If you're getting your money in with the worst odds, eventually, it will catch up to you.
 
RichKo

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check out Lex Veldhuis. Best jackass strategy ever performed in main event.

Also check the fact that he busted before the money in the main event. Very early if I remember correctly.

Although you may be playing what you call "jackass" style, stop comparing it to Ivey, Durr, etc. style. They just don't play any cards and always just bluff their way through. They have excellent post flop skills and are very good at putting their opponents on hands. They also win by knowing when they are beat, and extracting maximum value out of winning hands. And yes I have seen them bluff alot (TV of course) but I'm sure they have info/reads that get them to that point.
 
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