***December SNG Thread***

[Jillychemung]

LOL Donks

poker stars $5.00+$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t10/t20 Blinds - 7 players

BTN: t1450 72.50 BBs
SB: t1400 70 BBs
Hero (BB): t1470 73.50 BBs
UTG: t3280 164 BBs
UTG+1: t1480 74 BBs
MP: t1520 76 BBs
CO: t1360 68 BBs

Pre Flop: (t30) Hero is BB with Q:club: T:diamond:
3 folds, CO calls t20, BTN raises to t80, 2 folds, CO raises to t1360 all in, BTN calls t1280

BTN shows A:club: A:spade:
CO shows 9:diamond: 2:heart:

Flop: (t2750) 9:club: 9:spade: 9:heart:
Turn: (t2750) A:diamond:
River: (t2750) A:heart:

 

[ManicLombax]

^^^ Outstanding!!

 

[MrEpic94]

why is everyone making profit goals? we cant control the amount of mone we make :/

 

[cjatud2012]

why is everyone making profit goals? we cant control the amount of mone we make :/

very astute observation, we may have found ourselves a winner here

I think it just helps one's mindset to be in the black, helps a person from tilting, etc. It just feels good to have profit. But you are very correct, our goal should be not to profit, but to make the best possible decisions, and with that the profit should come (in the long run, anyway).

And Jilly, holy crap that is the most awesome hand ever. What a roller coaster hand.

 

[Rldetheflop]

why is everyone making profit goals? we cant control the amount of mone we make :/

well for me its because that is why I play poker to make money.

And while I do agree that we cannot control variance If we put in enough volume during the month profit/no profit can be a partial indicator of our play.

in other words if we play 200 games during the month and dont profit it means very little but if we play 1000 games with no profit we probably have developed some leaks in our game.

 

[zackryan28]

why is everyone making profit goals? we cant control the amount of mone we make :/

Agreed. Just try to make the best decisions you can, and the +Roi% will come.
My only goal is to work on tilting. Today, I somehow had Aces on 4 separate tables in a matter of 5 minutes (I was 8 tabling) and they all got beat by: 89o, 10's, 4's, and K's. I totally lost it, even though I was doing well at the other tables. Gotta learn to control that.

 

[MrEpic94]

how is everyones mont going?

played 28 games, alot less than i had hoped to get through.

 

[Debi]

I have played over 100 turbos so far. I was way ahead til last night where every bad beat I have missed in the past week came to pay me a visit lol.

I am still up for the month though -hopefully can make up last night tonight.

I lost my cash back bonus at FT for Dec but they said if I earn 2000 ftp's between Dec 3rd and Dec 30th I will get it back for Jan. That shouldn't be a problem playing turbos. I am going for the gold so need to earn 125 a day for 25 days anyway - which will make the 2000 a breeze. I have made it all 4 days so far.

 

[Lofwyr]

Re: check or raise on the AK -> I guess I prefer raise because I'd rather play AKo from OOP against one opponent and with a smaller SPR than OOP against 3 w/large SPR, even if I felt I was much better than all 3 potential villains post-flop. Especially considering AKo is going to be a solid favorite here most of the time pre-flop.

Poker Stars $11+$1 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t500/t1000 Blinds + t100 - 8 players - View hand 1059610
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

UTG+1: t4205 M = 1.83
MP1: t3590 M = 1.56
MP2: t17722 M = 7.71
CO: t41538 M = 18.06
Hero (BTN): t15565 M = 6.77
SB: t3266 M = 1.42
BB: t2890 M = 1.26
UTG: t9793 M = 4.26

Pre Flop: (t2300) Hero is BTN with 9

9

2 folds, MP1 raises to t3490 all in, 1 fold, CO raises to t5980, Hero ???

I believe this is just in the money for a $12/180. I think 16 or 17 players left. CO villain has been very active but the only other 3-bet I'd seen was when he had QQ. That being said, I assume his range for making this move is a reasonable amount wider than a tight QQ+/AK type thing.

I had also 3-bet over his steals on more than one occasion and he'd laid the hand down, so he wasn't committed to calling from just making a standard raise.

In addition to this villain the table had been somewhat aggressive, but not so much that I didn't have steal spots.

 

[ManicLombax]

I believe this is just in the money for a $12/180. I think 16 or 17 players left. CO villain has been very active but the only other 3-bet I'd seen was when he had QQ. That being said, I assume his range for making this move is a reasonable amount wider than a tight QQ+/AK type thing.

I had also 3-bet over his steals on more than one occasion and he'd laid the hand down, so he wasn't committed to calling from just making a standard raise.

In addition to this villain the table had been somewhat aggressive, but not so much that I didn't have steal spots.

Thinking about the min-raise from CO here. You'd think if he had a really big hand and wanted action he might call in hopes someone would overcall behind him. Could be he's trying to discourage action and isolate the small stack. I'd think best case you're flipping here, but you could have more than 33% equity if of one of them has a smaller pair. Or if they both have overcards you could have more than 33% if their hands interfere with each other.

With your M < 7 I might just ship it here. You're likely being called by CO but the only way you're out is if he beats you. If the small stack beats you but you beat CO you still win the big side pot.

 

[cardplayer52]

I should of known around the 6bet but for sure after the 8bet shove. Such a cooler but about the most fun i've had in a poker hand yet. oh well merry xmas.


***** Hand History for Game 26143888888 ***** (Full Tilt)
Tourney Hand NL Texas Hold'em - Sunday, December 05, 01:09:56 ET 2010
Table 5 050 Sit Go (202848044) Table 1 (real money)
Seat 9 is the button
Seat 1: Sxitzo ( $1640.00 USD )
Seat 2: vlad0512FTP ( $2325.00 USD )
Seat 4: PrincessaFiona ( $1475.00 USD )
Seat 5: chem_prof ( $2730.00 USD )
Seat 6: KANMIKE1961 ( $855.00 USD )
Seat 7: GaNDaLFViTi8 ( $1640.00 USD )
Seat 8: cardplayer52 ( $1395.00 USD )
Seat 9: GOODTIMES3 ( $1440.00 USD )
Sxitzo posts small blind [$20.00 USD].
vlad0512FTP posts big blind [$40.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to cardplayer52 [ Tc Td ]
PrincessaFiona calls [$40.00 USD]
chem_prof folds
KANMIKE1961 folds
GaNDaLFViTi8 raises [$160.00 USD]
cardplayer52 calls [$160.00 USD]
GOODTIMES3 folds
Sxitzo calls [$140.00 USD]
vlad0512FTP folds
PrincessaFiona folds
** Dealing Flop ** [ As, Ts, Ah ]
Sxitzo checks
GaNDaLFViTi8 checks
cardplayer52 bets [$40.00 USD]
Sxitzo folds
GaNDaLFViTi8 raises [$120.00 USD]
cardplayer52 raises [$160.00 USD]
GaNDaLFViTi8 raises [$230.00 USD]
cardplayer52 raises [$300.00 USD]
GaNDaLFViTi8 raises [$450.00 USD]
cardplayer52 raises [$600.00 USD]
GaNDaLFViTi8 raises [$680.00 USD]
cardplayer52 calls [$135.00 USD]
GaNDaLFViTi8 shows [Ad, Ac ]
cardplayer52 shows [Tc, Td ]
GaNDaLFViTi8 wins $245.00 USD
** Dealing Turn ** [ Kh ]
** Dealing River ** [ 7c ]
GaNDaLFViTi8 wins $3030.00 USD from main pot

 

[WiZZiM]

how is everyones mont going?

played 28 games, alot less than i had hoped to get through.

Less than stellar.

Was up around $500 in a few days and lost most of it in the last few days, the swingy $16's are brutal .

 

[Clambake420]

Terrible...almost time to reload. Im getting pretty frustrated. Every time im either the short stack or the big stack stealing blinds with decent cards (ie A9, 89s, 44+ hands like that) i always run into the BB waking up with a monster and busto for me. Running bad and playing bad... the worst combination.

 

[MrEpic94]

Less than stellar.

Was up around $500 in a few days and lost most of it in the last few days, the swingy $16's are brutal .

yeah, 10% roi is ridiculously good in these so I can image varience being worse than a wife

 

[Jillychemung]

Tournaments are still crap but I've been able to play a few sessions long enough to add in a few 45's to the mix. Obv running good but one can wish for the whole month to run this way

 

[WiZZiM]

yeah, 10% roi is ridiculously good in these so I can image varience being worse than a wife

I aspire to achieve 5-7% in those games.

 

[cardplayer52]

So far so good but I know that can change in a heartbeat.

 

[JLtrooper]

Well, after quite a long hiatus (college is getting in the way of poker ha), here's what I plan on for December:

1) I will be starting with $100 on PS, and I plan on playing the 9-man $3.40 turbos. These seem like the best value, since its only ~13% rake, as opposed to ~17% that the $1.75 offers. I am also aware that I am slightly underrolled, but I have decent experience with these and don't suspect it will be an issue. *fingers crossed*

2) Play 1k+ sngs

3) Don't go broke. Being able to move up in stakes would be nice too.

 

[MrEpic94]

I aspire to achieve 5-7% in those games.

I just dont know how you handle the massive varience for a 5% roi. Are you sure your hourly wouldnt be better in 18mans or something different?

 

[WiZZiM]

I just dont know how you handle the massive varience for a 5% roi. Are you sure your hourly wouldnt be better in 18mans or something different?

Not sure, i haven't played many MT SNGs. I do plan to start playing the 45 man games within a few months, but i need to get my 9 man STT game up to a level i'm happy with first, i believe in sticking to one game and trying to master it, instead of playing many games at a mediocre level.

Even with a 5% ROI the hourly would be pretty good. You do have to mass multitable though (not my forte). I'll have to play a few thousand before i can start pinning down a $/hour figure, but we will see.

 

[MrEpic94]

^^ how many tables do you play?

 

[OzExorcist]

I just dont know how you handle the massive varience for a 5% roi. Are you sure your hourly wouldnt be better in 18mans or something different?

I've never had a serious go at anything above the single tables either but I'm left wondering: how does adding more players to a game lower the variance?

 

[MrEpic94]

I've never had a serious go at anything above the single tables either but I'm left wondering: how does adding more players to a game lower the variance?

i said handle the varience for a 5% roi. Adding more players makes having a higher roi easier. ofcourse there is the other extreme where there is so many players varience is ridiculously massive (MTT). But for say 18 or 45 man SNGs I would imagine that luck would even out reletively quickly maybe a few thousand games or so, similar to STT.

 

[WiZZiM]

^^ how many tables do you play?

15 now, but i'm still ironing out a few leaks. Once i have my game to a level i'm happy with i'll be adding more tables, i think i can only go to a maximum of 20-25 though.

I've never had a serious go at anything above the single tables either but I'm left wondering: how does adding more players to a game lower the variance?

Don't think he said/meant it like that. You will have more variance in the 18 mans, but you can also expect a higher ROI. But since i'm aiming for a 5-7% ROI there will be a lot of variance anyway. So what he's essetially asking is why don't i play the 18 mans with weaker competition with probably similar amounts of variance. Basically, the more leaks you have, the lower your ROI will be and the MORE variance you will encounter. (Differant playing styles will also have an effect on this).

So he might be suggesting that i have a bigger skill edge in the 18 mans, so i can expect still a high amount of variance, but a much bigger ROI and probably a higher $/hour.



And to answer Epic's question earlier in more detail.


A) I feel that playing one format and mastering it can be very beneficial. I also believe that getting a very good idea of how to play 9 man STT's can lead to spending less time learning other formats. All you need to do to play the 45's is just adjust a few ranges earlier, the ITM game is differant, but easier to learn with a 9 man STT background.

B) I've always aspired to play the $16's where i see a lot of these online grinders play. If i can manage to prove to myself that i can play at that level, then there's nothing stopping me playing higher.

c) While i'm aiming for a low but decent ROI of 5-7%, i'm hoping that i can do better, but i like to make goals achieveable. No point in saying i want 15% ROI. Also the rake is a big issue, you get an extrememly good rake % at the $16's.

D) While i think i have an edge over most of the breakeven regs. I also think that most of the really good ones will have the edge over me in the games. However i still think i can pick up on edges that nearly all the regs don't use.

The big one being table selection. I have a script setup so i can sharkscope thousands of names to help with table selection. It's really hard to implement it as there are just a ton of regs there, and a lot of them load over the top of each other, but with a lot of work it can be done.

 

[Lofwyr]

I've never had a serious go at anything above the single tables either but I'm left wondering: how does adding more players to a game lower the variance?

Variance is like a combination of things really. With more players you definitely increase the variance. Players of similar skill levels to you will increase variance. Certain spots in tournaments will lead to higher variance - like taking spots you think are slightly favorable flips, it's +ev but 50/50ish so luck will swing those around all the time on you. On the other side of that, higher ROI will lower variance in a sort of cushion type way.

5-7% in the 9-man is a good win-rate, but it's so low that it doesn't cushion against variance much. It's just a favorable coin-flip. One of the reasons the ROI is so low in 9-mans is because the field is small and you're playing against more skilled players more often on a more flat payout structure. As you go up in field-size you'll have more donkeys and a payout structure that favors skilled players a bit more (people aiming for #1 and not ITM) Thus you can get higher ROI...the overall variance is still going to be higher though via the field-size element.