jj facing shove 3-bet

[un-diluted]

to nitty if i fold here? Granted, it's a dollar rebuy sat., but almost 2 hrs. in. The min. raise - shove screams AA to me, esp. since from utg. First min raise I have seen from this guy, and he's not playing many hands


pokerstars Game #19277049563: Tournament #98319410, $1.00+$0.10 Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (150/300) - 2008/08/01 - 15:41:36 (ET)
Table '98319410 35' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: FCRIA3 (1600 in chips)
Seat 2: un-diluted (10750 in chips)
Seat 3: Teddi63 (2210 in chips)
Seat 4: laanooe (22420 in chips)
Seat 5: ptmarkg (11680 in chips)
Seat 6: Adabarus (13452 in chips)
Seat 7: Grave^Choice (17460 in chips)
Seat 8: PLEBSTER (8535 in chips)
Seat 9: latin_g2005 (12630 in chips)
FCRIA3: posts the ante 25
un-diluted: posts the ante 25
Teddi63: posts the ante 25
laanooe: posts the ante 25
ptmarkg: posts the ante 25
Adabarus: posts the ante 25
Grave^Choice: posts the ante 25
PLEBSTER: posts the ante 25
latin_g2005: posts the ante 25
Teddi63: posts small blind 150
laanooe: posts big blind 300
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to un-diluted [Jc Jh]
ptmarkg: raises 300 to 600
Adabarus: folds
Grave^Choice: folds
PLEBSTER: folds
latin_g2005: folds
FCRIA3: folds
un-diluted: raises 1200 to 1800
Teddi63: folds
laanooe: folds
ptmarkg: raises 9855 to 11655 and is all-in
un-diluted: ????

 

[straytangent]

That's the tricky thing about JJ. It's sooooooooo hard to play them. There's not much you can do other than follow your gut instict. For all you know he could just have AK or AQ. =\

 

[switch0723]

In a standard tourny a min raise shove utg is usually a big pair or a,k so your crushed by his range. Although this is a dollarment so he could possibly be doing this with less.

How close are you to the seat and can you coast in?? That will affect decision

 

[un-diluted]

yeah, not too close. about 120 left, 35 or so seats.

 

[switch0723]

sigh i really don'y know. I think i probably fold but i have no conclusive reason why, it just feels slightly better

 

[HeroCall]

I think you gotta fold here, your at best 50 50 IMO and you still have plenty of chips to work with.

Another question here is I dont know why you only raise 1200 more if your trying to push him out of the hand almost any hand with 2 overs is gonna call your measely raise.

Also your on the button and noone else has called! Why raise when you can just take a flop in position with a monster?

 

[ncmtngirl79]

um i think i call a raise here not reraise, is this a limit tournament...scratch that reraise all in. you allready have a good idea that he has avery good hand possibly even your jj beat, but why not just call, hope to hit a set, be careful of a high board, and only lose a min raise versus the decision of putting all your chips on the line. Basically you put yourself in the situation by reraising min, i think your options are to call or reraise all in, even though you are close to the finish... all in all i think a flat call was the best option here. However, since he reraised all in, and you are not sure when in doubt fold, not like you don't have plenty of chips to make it in the money!

 

[Henreiman]

Gotta fold...lets think about the possibilities; what is he going to threebet with?

AA, KK, QQ (maybe), AKs (maybe), AQs (doubt it)...anything less, I just don't see it. Three betting shows enormous strength, and unless this is a complete donk, he either has you dominated or its a race...lay it down, pick a better spot

 

[Lemlywinks]

Gotta fold...lets think about the possibilities; what is he going to threebet with?

AA, KK, QQ (maybe), AKs (maybe), AQs (doubt it)...anything less, I just don't see it. Three betting shows enormous strength, and unless this is a complete donk, he either has you dominated or its a race...lay it down, pick a better spot

Couldn't have said it better myself. Like affor mentioned, you are dominated my his range. Your gut here is telling you something, and I would listen to it. Run away from this hand and pray that next time you get JJ, an overpair isn't lurking

 

[CfPoker]

I fold as well. You're probably either racing AK or crushed by QQ+.

I'd have been tempted to flat call pf and go set mining, or hoping to see no overcards. Against an UTG min raise like that I doubt he's folding to your raise. If he calls then you may as well have limped because you don't really know much more about his hand. And if he reraises you're in this situation where you need to give him credit for a bigger hand.

 

[phoebepussy]

The guys not playing many hands , his min raise looks suspicious ,you think he might have AA
sounds like you have a read on the guy , you are obviously watching your opponents rather than just playing you own hand sure JJ looks pretty but you think you are beat and you are not committed so fold accept that you will never know whether you were right and move on

 

[shinedown.45]

I would fold to a particularly tight player that limps then comes over the top of your raise.
He's not a short stack, so his move is not out of desparation.
This is not where you want to risk your tourney.
Fold and wait for a better spot, you still have time.

 

[hockeyaddict]

I would of folded because of the size of his bet and from what ur saying hes really tight might have the edge of qq kk or aa on u.

 

[chadherczeg]

My favorite poker saying actually involves JJ, it goes " there are three ways to play jacks and they are all wrong ". i think this fits well with your question though because, no matter what you do here you are at best a coinflip. If you just call you have to fold the flop if you don't set up. If you raise you could very well be behind or at best gambling. So my true reccomendation is, if you aren't getting 10-1 implied odds on a double up then fold and if you are just call and hope the flop comes J high. hopefully this helps.

 

[un-diluted]

Well, I appreciate all the input.
I folded, so we'll never know what villain had.

I am glad I asked, now I'm sure it was the right play

 

[vincemcnabb]

Hmmmmm..I would probably fold because you still have some chips to play with...and you're AT BEST in a coinflip scenario...but then again it is a $1 tourney..he might have 8's-9's-10's as well

 

[-newbielicious-]

u should probably fold if 3 ppl are in the pot... with out a doubt some1 prob has AA or KK or QQ... and if not then u probably will lose when an ace king or queen hits on the board.. so fold.

 

[pimpinalovabkln]

u should probably fold if 3 ppl are in the pot... with out a doubt some1 prob has AA or KK or QQ... and if not then u probably will lose when an ace king or queen hits on the board.. so fold.

why does someone have to have pocket queens kings or aces..... maybe they have ace 9 per say or even an under pair...

 

[tpb221]

I'd fold to his shove, but I would have just called his $600. JJ are tough to play. You said his min raise was screaming AA to you. See the flop cheap. If you hit-crush him, if AKQ show up on the fllop, look to get out.

 

[katharine]

Oh how I hate JJ. I lose so much money with them. Folding was definitely the right call. I read somewhere that if not HU Chris Ferguson will usually only limp with them. When you combine your read, you made the right call.

I wanted to see if I could pull up some quotes from the pros on this matter but it seems JJ is too sticky of a hand for anyone to have an opnion on!

 

[Dwilius]

Well, I appreciate all the input.
I folded, so we'll never know what villain had.

I am glad I asked, now I'm sure it was the right play

The OP said this 8 months ago. Its one thing to bump interesting topics (although its best to start new ones) but there are new hand analysis threads every day. Please try posting in those.

 

[Debi]

deleted the bump posts