$Freeroll NLHE MTT: A10s in the BTN

[mariussica88]

Would you guys shove here with 20BB? This players are tight players pre-flop and passive post-flop.

pokerstars - 4000/8000 Ante 800 NL - Holdem - 8 players


BB: 1,006,671 (125.8 bb)
UTG: 376,030 (47 bb)
UTG+1: 192,272 (24 bb)
MP: 927,557 (115.9 bb)
MP+1: 352,540 (44.1 bb)
CO: 547,506 (68.4 bb)
Hero (BTN): 159,902 (20 bb)
SB: 665,162 (83.1 bb)

8 players post ante of 800, SB posts 4,000, BB posts 8,000

Pre Flop: (pot: 18,400) Hero has
UTG raises to 16,000, fold, MP calls 16,000, 2 folds, Hero calls 16,000, SB calls 12,000, BB calls 8,000

Flop: (86,400, 5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero checks

Turn: (86,400, 5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero checks

River: (86,400, 5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero checks

Results: 86,400 pot (0 rake)
Final Board:

Spoiler

SB shows : (Two Pair, Kings and Fives)
(Pre 26%, Flop 25%, Turn 18%)

UTG shows : (Two Pair, Kings and Fives)
(Pre 28%, Flop 31%, Turn 35%)

MP shows : (Two Pair, Kings and Sixes)
(Pre 19%, Flop 19%, Turn 10%)

BB mucks : (Two Pair, Kings and Fives)
(Pre 15%, Flop 11%, Turn 10%)

Hero mucks : (Two Pair, Kings and Fives)
(Pre 13%, Flop 14%, Turn 27%)

MP wins 86,400

 

[Tigroslav]

Yeah its a fine shove.
Open raise 2,5xish also fine.

I would prefer the shove though as they have big stacks to go fishing.

 

[eetenor]

Would you guys shove here with 20BB? This players are tight players pre-flop and passive post-flop.

PokerStars - 4000/8000 Ante 800 NL - Holdem - 8 players


BB: 1,006,671 (125.8 bb)
UTG: 376,030 (47 bb)
UTG+1: 192,272 (24 bb)
MP: 927,557 (115.9 bb)
MP+1: 352,540 (44.1 bb)
CO: 547,506 (68.4 bb)
Hero (BTN): 159,902 (20 bb)
SB: 665,162 (83.1 bb)

8 players post ante of 800, SB posts 4,000, BB posts 8,000

Pre Flop: (pot: 18,400) Hero has
UTG raises to 16,000, fold, MP calls 16,000, 2 folds, Hero calls 16,000, SB calls 12,000, BB calls 8,000

Flop: (86,400, 5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero checks

Turn: (86,400, 5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero checks

River: (86,400, 5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero checks

Results: 86,400 pot (0 rake)
Final Board:

Spoiler

SB shows : (Two Pair, Kings and Fives)
(Pre 26%, Flop 25%, Turn 18%)

UTG shows : (Two Pair, Kings and Fives)
(Pre 28%, Flop 31%, Turn 35%)

MP shows : (Two Pair, Kings and Sixes)
(Pre 19%, Flop 19%, Turn 10%)

BB mucks : (Two Pair, Kings and Fives)
(Pre 15%, Flop 11%, Turn 10%)

Hero mucks : (Two Pair, Kings and Fives)
(Pre 13%, Flop 14%, Turn 27%)

MP wins 86,400

Thank you for posting

Avoided looking at results. Stopped at preflop

Your read was they are TAG pre then Passive post this is 100% call or fold. The raise came from UTG their range is way ahead of ATs so shoving is EV suicide. equity realization is gold vs this player type especially at 20bb.

Looking at full hand now.

UTG had AQ that is why AT is an EV suicide shove.
Side note we are not looking to stack off post flop with AT top pair only vs TAG preflop passive post flop players.

Ok great call 5 way perfect- great equity realization opportunity.

Flop checked to us passive as always- no Diamond on paired board so no back door draw- this is the world's best spot for a 1bb bet by you. Would you not have bet 1bb Kx? What card comes on the turn that lets us stack off with KX and be winning? Squeeze some profit when you have the nuts and open up your bluffs.

It is 1 BB to clean up your odds and lets us get to a showdown and potentially lets us bluff if the AQ is the only caller. EZ fold to any action by your V as well after we bet 1bb as they are passive.

This spot vs these V was made for the 1bb bet.

Hope this helps.

 

[mariussica88]

1BB bet?

Thank you for posting

Flop checked to us passive as always- no Diamond on paired board so no back door draw- this is the world's best spot for a 1bb bet by you. Would you not have bet 1bb Kx? What card comes on the turn that lets us stack off with KX and be winning? Squeeze some profit when you have the nuts and open up your bluffs.

It is 1 BB to clean up your odds and lets us get to a showdown and potentially lets us bluff if the AQ is the only caller. EZ fold to any action by your V as well after we bet 1bb as they are passive.

This spot vs these V was made for the 1bb bet.

Hope this helps.

Thank you for your reply, it's interesting to see how the more experienced players think.

Isn't 1BB a to small bet to throw of their hand even the passive players? And if 1 or 2 V call the 1BB bet what then on the turn?

 

[fundiver199]

I dont think, 3-bet shoving as a bluff is very appealing here, and ATs is definitely a bluff against an UTG open. I dont expect UTG to fold often enough, since its a freeroll, and he has more than twice your stack. And even when UTG fold, I expect to get called quite a bit by MP, since he has a really massive stack and can afford to gamble. So on balance I either play the hand exactly, like you did, or simply fold preflop and move on to the next hand. You were kind of lucky to avoid an A high flop here, because then you most likely go broke to his better kicker.

 

[eetenor]

Thank you for your reply, it's interesting to see how the more experienced players think.

Isn't 1BB a to small bet to throw of their hand even the passive players? And if 1 or 2 V call the 1BB bet what then on the turn?

Thank you for responding

The 1bb bet gets the winner to fold -why would they call 64 on KK5- 1 BB means you win half this pot. That is what I meant when I said you clean up your outs.

The 1bb bet can be a K or a 5 so when the turn is the 5 we can bet as a bluff to get other AX to fold and even some pairs by passive players.

The reason we bet 1bb on the flop is it looks like we want to be called the other players have to then think they will be facing a shove at some point. So calling turn with AQ means calling 3 bets to bluff catch not 1 or 2

We will not get this bluff through all the time but the success rate goes up if we bet flop because of the courage factor. Everyone in this hand was afraid of the Kx we want to leverage that fear vs passive players because if they play back it is just an easy fold.

One of the biggest factors low stakes players over look is the bets to come leverage bet. When we bet flop we are saying more bets to come go ahead call this one but what about the next one.

Why 1bb not 3bb again the bets to come factor we only have 18bb 1bb is just as dangerous as 3bb because when we bet we indicate we will be playing for stacks.

Also when we check turn if that is what we choose to do it does not mean we do not have a K so we can shove river for value and as a bluff based on SPR.

It is ok to bust out of this tournament running a bluff in this spot. This is the spot where we can max pressure decent players into folding small pairs and other AX maybe even get QQ to fold if the UTG is weak enough after all QQ loses to a K and a 5 and 66 all of which are in your range and you might 1bb bet all of them on flop.

As it was it is very unlikely AQ calls a river bluff shove. If we win this pot we increase our stack 50% we are the shortest stack this is when you push your skill edge you have the reads now learn how to attack based on those reads.

When we use read based bluffs we will lose sometimes but in this spot UTG has to call 40% of his range for us to not be +EV to bluff in this spot. if we are not losing in these spots it is because we are not trying to win often enough.

Hope this helps