Flopped 2 pair and lost... did I mess this up?

[PurgatoryD]

Hey all!

Well, I just finished 88 out of 103 in the FT $200 freeroll. I lost it all in one hand... my only thought is that maybe I should have just pushed all in after the flop. Sometimes you just get a bad beat, but maybe I could have taken this if I hadn't let it get to the river. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
dave


Stacks:
* SB with 3135
* BB with 1590
* UTG with 1875
* MP with 1440
* CO with 3205
* BTN with 2555

Blinds:
Site: full tilt poker
* * Dealt to BB:2♣ Q♣
Preflop:
* * 1 players fold.
* * UTG calls [40]
* * 4 players fold.
* * SB calls [20]
* * Hero checks
* * Total folds this street: 5
* * Potsize: 120
Flop:
* * K♦ 2♥ Q♦
* * SB checks
* * Hero checks
* * UTG bets [70]
* * 1 players fold.
* * Hero raises to 140
* * UTG raises to 300
* * Hero raises to 460
* * UTG calls [160]
* * Total folds this street: 1
* * Potsize: 1040
Turn:
* * 4♣
* * Hero bets [400]
* * UTG calls [400]
* * Potsize: 1840
River:
* * 8♣
* * Hero bets [690, and is all in]
* * UTG calls [690]
Results:
* * Hero shows :
* * 2♣ Q♣
* * UTG shows :
* * 8♦ K♥
* * UTG wins the pot (3,220) with two pair, Kings and Eights

Poker Hand Converter By Cardschat.com Poker Forum

 

[vpb0i]

Urg, so so i guess, i mean why not all in on flop when he reraise you? sometime getting value out of your hand back fires like a ..... to me if you not gonna all on flop then you gotta all in on turn, even so, you got pretty unlucky, cause you obv check into the flop, but its a kooler.

 

[RickH2005]

Kinda!

I dunno--I don't think I'd of checked 1st after the flop---I think i'd of bet at least 2xs BB, maybe 3xs--UTG obviosly has pr Ks, an'you with the 2 pr woulda showed some strength, better than the pr Ks--but instead you check raise--an' he bumps again--that tells me he has high pair on the board--Ks--an' he's not backin' down because of the ck-raise--He thinks he has you beat--BUT he seems to be forgetting you MAY have pkt pair--but your betting doesn't show a real strong hand--the ck/raise tells him you may be tryin' to scare him out! But he ain't budgeing--you only got a 16% or so of hitting the boat--an' he knows you ain't got pkt As or youlda bet 'em, at least I HOPE youlda bet 'em! I dunno--ya gotta know when to hold 'em-know when to fold 'em--I'd have bet or folded--not checked! But who am I to say what's right or wrong--I was fightin' with my girlfriend(Again!) and wound up knocked out in 97th place pushin' all-in w/ three 8s onna board and holdin' A-5 off-knowin' villain had the Q that matched the other Q along with the set 8s onna board!An' I wouldn' call it a BB-niether of y'all had power hands! Just 1 a lil' bit better than the other!

 

[phoebepussy]

well maybe you should go all in on the flop but in a free roll with top pair your opponent may call anyway,
with top and bottom pair your hand is vunerable and easily counterfeited, yes the flop is good for you but the reraise could have meant you were already beat

personally i would reraise villains small flop raise by 300-350 and if he comes over the top I would (wrongly in this case) assume i'm beat and toss it away

 

[Razor_King]

Hmmmmmmmmm, i think that on the flop you had a very good 2 pair and were extremly strong. As this is a tourny when the guy re raised you, you should have raised all in because personally i would have put him on something like AK which he would have called with. Plus this is early in the tourny so donks may still be in it and they are your ATMs!!!

RK

 

[PurgatoryD]

Hey guys, thanks for your input. I think after the turn I was a 90% favorite (I think he had 5 outs). Whether slow playing was good or not, I got most of my chips in there being a 90% favorite. On the one hand, I think, what more can I do? But on the other, I think, even at a 90% favorite, I lose that enough to think I'd rather not have to play the hand. As was pointed out, this was a freeroll, and he had top pair, so I probably wasn't going to get him out anyhow.

Thanks agian, I appreciate the input!
dave

 

[c9h13no3]

Shove the flop. Wtf is this re-min-raise crap. After your opponent min-raises, its so rare that he folds. Just stick it in.

 

[PurgatoryD]

Wtf is this re-min-raise crap.

LOL! Well, I didn't want to lose him. But in hindsight, I would have been better off losing him. Yeah, next time, I'm going to shove all in. I always say that after a loss doing a slow play, but this time I really mean it!

Thanks,
dave

 

[Mr Alacran]

Min re-raises suck. I mean, they truly suck. If you don't want to lose your customer, still you should bet more. Random guy is calling a 3 bet all day long if he's willing to call the minbet.

 

[PurgatoryD]

Min re-raises suck. I mean, they truly suck.

I keep reading that more and more. Sigh. Still so much to learn.

dave

 

[kaiWalk]

Min raising and slow playing are for solid made hands where your opponent has little chance of catching up. You were facing flush & straight draws & that is the worst possible situation to give someone odds to call. Your min raise on the turn gave him almost 5:1 on his money and you had no way to put him on a hand yet.

At this stage of a tourney, you could be facing ATC. Low suited connectors almost had calling odds from your bet.

In your place, I'd have either made a pot-sized bet on the flop, or checked to see how the table bets. 1-2 bb & I'd come over the top (more than the minimum), anything more & I'd lay it down.

Personally, I've seen my 2 pr's counterfeited too often to find them attractive, unless they're top two, higher than 7 & not straight-able (I like that word).

 

[PurgatoryD]

Hey guys,

Thanks for the additional comments. After taking everything in, I've decided that I definitely messed up the betting. Regardless of whether or not I would have actually won, I should have committed earlier or just checked my way all the way through. Slow playing without the nuts is just inviting someone to river you.

dave

 

[JustRaiseTheBlinds]

You make a small raise on the flop imo.
After that, your opponent raises you 160 for a total of 300.
You raise hem just 160. That's an easy call.
You had to raise more here.
To something like 800.
Your turn/river bets are oke. But you also could go allin on the turn.
The river is just a rat.

My advice is to be more aggressive and make the pot more expensive if you have a made hand.

 

[Cowboy8112]

I think you messed up calling with a Q2 out of position to start with. It really should have been in the muck pile. That being said, yes as soon as you hit to pair you should have pushed, not all in but to get a good feel of where your cards were, all in on the turn. imo

 

[Wonka22]

I think you messed up calling with a Q2 out of position to start with. It really should have been in the muck pile. That being said, yes as soon as you hit to pair you should have pushed, not all in but to get a good feel of where your cards were, all in on the turn. imo

Huh?? what??? Out of position?? She was big blind...she checked..she didn't call.

Anyhow....after his reraise, yes, I think all in, or fold.....Hindsight being 20/20, he had top pair, freeroll, he probably had you on a king with a lower kicker or a queen and he could beat you....I'm not sure he'd have folded.....the problem is, it's a freeroll and you can get all your money in best, but there are a lot of places you could be beat..flush straight and sadly, even if you go all in someone may be willing to call.

 

[asianpride54]

The only reason why you lost is because you weren't agressive enough frmo the flop. I know it hard not to slow play two pair in poker but most profesional poker player don't slow play because they know that there is a good chance thatyour opponent might catch somethign in the turn or the river so they bet a good size bet and then see what there opponent is at. But at your position you had really no control of the hnd because it seemed like your opponent thought he had the best hand and wouldn't quit the hand no matter the size of the pot or bet.

 

[Pothole]

The only reason why you lost is because you weren't agressive enough frmo the flop. I know it hard not to slow play two pair in poker but most profesional poker player don't slow play because they know that there is a good chance thatyour opponent might catch somethign in the turn or the river so they bet a good size bet and then see what there opponent is at. But at your position you had really no control of the hnd because it seemed like your opponent thought he had the best hand and wouldn't quit the hand no matter the size of the pot or bet.

So the flop is 3 spades and you get check raised all in by a known solid tight player and your holding the A of spades, your thoughts?

 

[asianpride54]

well it depends how much money he has and how much money i have if I could afford it i would call because the nut flush i like to gamble also i would take into account how many players are in the table to see how many outs there is how many possible spades there is and if my oppoent has any possible spades. That is my thought I would call if there was 6 player in the table and if I had 150% more money than the opponent that raised all in.

 

[BelgoSuisse]

i like to gamble

Then maybe poker is not your game? Decisions should be made based on EV, not the thrill of gambling.