Bad heads up play, or just out drawn?

Shady Vision

Shady Vision

Rock Star
Joined
Jul 9, 2006
Total posts
152
OK, this is quite a bit longer than your standard Hand Analysis, but I'd really like some input about this. I was very confident going into HU with my chip lead, then devastated when I lost.


***** Hand History for Game 4845708646 *****
amaranthe finished in third place and won $40.
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:06:57 EDT 2006
Table Speed (real money) -- Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (3020)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (16980)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Knight_mare1 posts small blind (400)
Shady_Vision posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ 5d, Tc ]
Knight_mare1 calls (400)
Shady_Vision: gl
Shady_Vision raises (800) to 1600
Knight_mare1 raises (1600) to 2400
Shady_Vision calls (800)
** Dealing Flop ** : [ Qd, 3h, 9c ]
Shady_Vision bets (800)
Knight_mare1 calls (595)
Knight_mare1 is all-In.
** Dealing Turn ** : [ Jc ]
** Dealing River ** : [ As ]
Creating Main Pot with $6040 with Knight_mare1
** Summary **
Main Pot: 6040 | Side Pot 1: 205
Board: [ Qd 3h 9c Jc As ]

Knight_mare1 balance 6040, bet 3020, collected 6040, net +3020 [ 9s Ah ] [ two pairs, aces and nines -- Ah,As,Qd,9s,9c ]
Shady_Vision balance 13960, bet 3225, collected 205, lost -3020 [ 5d Tc ] [ high card ace -- As,Qd,Jc,Tc,9c ]

***** Hand History for Game 4845709898 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:07:29 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 8 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (6040)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (13960)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts small blind (400)
Knight_mare1 posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ 8c, 5h ]
Shady_Vision folds.
** Summary **
Main Pot: 1250

Knight_mare1 balance 6465, bet 825, collected 1250, net +425
Shady_Vision balance 13535, lost 425 (folded)

***** Hand History for Game 4845710269 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:07:38 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (6465)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (13535)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Knight_mare1 posts small blind (400)
Shady_Vision posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ 8d, 7c ]
Knight_mare1 calls (400)
Shady_Vision checks.
** Dealing Flop ** : [ Kh, Qd, 6d ]
Shady_Vision checks.
Knight_mare1 bets (1800)
Shady_Vision folds.
** Summary **
Main Pot: 3450
Board: [ Kh Qd 6d ]

Knight_mare1 balance 7290, bet 2625, collected 3450, net +825
Shady_Vision balance 12710, lost 825 (folded)



TURNING POINT
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
***** Hand History for Game 4845710910 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:07:55 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 8 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (7290)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (12710)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts small blind (400)
Knight_mare1 posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ Th, Ts ]
Shady_Vision calls (400)
Knight_mare1 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** : [ 5c, 2c, 3c ]
Knight_mare1 bets (1500)
Shady_Vision raises (11885) to 11885
Shady_Vision is all-In.
Knight_mare1 calls (4965)
Knight_mare1 is all-In.
** Dealing Turn ** : [ 5h ]
** Dealing River ** : [ Qs ]
Creating Main Pot with $14580 with Knight_mare1
Creating Side Pot 1 with $5420 with Shady_Vision
** Summary **
Main Pot: 14580 | Side Pot 1: 5420
Board: [ 5c 2c 3c 5h Qs ]

Knight_mare1 balance 14580, bet 7290, collected 14580, net +7290 [ Qd 4d ] [ two pairs, queens and fives -- Qd,Qs,5c,5h,4d ]
Shady_Vision balance 5420, bet 12710, collected 5420, lost -7290 [ Th Ts ] [ two pairs, tens and fives -- Qs,Th,Ts,5c,5h ]


***** Hand History for Game 4845711952 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:08:22 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (14580)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (5420)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Knight_mare1 posts small blind (400)
Shady_Vision posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ Td, 4d ]
Knight_mare1 folds.
** Summary **
Main Pot: 1250

Knight_mare1 balance 14155, lost 425 (folded)
Shady_Vision balance 5845, bet 825, collected 1250, net +425

***** Hand History for Game 4845712407 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:08:34 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 8 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (14155)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (5845)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts small blind (400)
Knight_mare1 posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ 4h, 9s ]
Shady_Vision folds.
** Summary **
Main Pot: 1250

Knight_mare1 balance 14580, bet 825, collected 1250, net +425
Shady_Vision balance 5420, lost 425 (folded)

***** Hand History for Game 4845712728 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:08:42 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (14580)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (5420)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Knight_mare1 posts small blind (400)
Shady_Vision posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ Ts, 8s ]
Knight_mare1 calls (400)
Shady_Vision raises (4595) to 5395
Shady_Vision is all-In.
Knight_mare1 folds.
Creating Main Pot with $6245 with Shady_Vision
** Summary **
Main Pot: 6245

Knight_mare1 balance 13755, lost 825 (folded)
Shady_Vision balance 6245, bet 5420, collected 6245, net +825

***** Hand History for Game 4845713411 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:09:00 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 8 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (13755)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (6245)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts small blind (400)
Knight_mare1 posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ Kh, 8h ]
Shady_Vision calls (400)
Knight_mare1 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** : [ 5c, 9s, 3d ]
Knight_mare1 bets (3500)
Shady_Vision folds.
** Summary **
Main Pot: 5150
Board: [ 5c 9s 3d ]

Knight_mare1 balance 14580, bet 4325, collected 5150, net +825
Shady_Vision balance 5420, lost 825 (folded)

***** Hand History for Game 4845714175 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:09:19 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (14580)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (5420)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Knight_mare1 posts small blind (400)
Shady_Vision posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ 9h, Js ]
Knight_mare1 folds.
** Summary **
Main Pot: 1250

Knight_mare1 balance 14155, lost 425 (folded)
Shady_Vision balance 5845, bet 825, collected 1250, net +425

***** Hand History for Game 4845714532 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:09:28 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 8 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (14155)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (5845)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts small blind (400)
Knight_mare1 posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ 2d, 8h ]
Shady_Vision folds.
** Summary **
Main Pot: 1250

Knight_mare1 balance 14580, bet 825, collected 1250, net +425
Shady_Vision balance 5420, lost 425 (folded)

***** Hand History for Game 4845714818 *****
0/0 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 26741467) - Mon Jul 31 09:09:35 EDT 2006
Table Speed (Real Money) -- Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 2
Seat 5: Knight_mare1 (14580)
Seat 8: Shady_Vision (5420)
Knight_mare1 posts ante (25)
Shady_Vision posts ante (25)
Knight_mare1 posts small blind (400)
Shady_Vision posts big blind (800)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Shady_Vision [ Js, 8c ]
Knight_mare1 calls (400)
Shady_Vision raises (800) to 1600
Knight_mare1 raises (6400) to 7200
Shady_Vision calls (3795)
Shady_Vision is all-In.
Creating Main Pot with $10840 with Shady_Vision
** Dealing Flop ** : [ As, Qc, Th ]
** Dealing Turn ** : [ 2h ]
** Dealing River ** : [ Jc ]
** Summary **
Main Pot: 10840 | Side Pot 1: 1805
Board: [ As Qc Th 2h Jc ]

Knight_mare1 balance 20000, bet 7225, collected 12645, net +5420 [ Kd 6s ] [ a straight, ten to ace -- As,Kd,Qc,Jc,Th ]
Shady_Vision balance 0, lost 5420 [ Js 8c ] [ a pair of jacks -- As,Qc,Js,Jc,Th ]
 
H

hellwolves

Guest
Joined
Aug 1, 2006
Total posts
8
on the turning point, you should have bet pre-flop, give it was completely dumb of him to go all-in w/ absolutely nothing but still, pushing pre-flop would have told him you had sumthing and would have make him more prone to folding after completely missing the flop
 
Effexor

Effexor

Cardschat Elite
Joined
May 13, 2006
Total posts
1,773
Please take this as constructive criticism.

Heads up, the value of over cards like Aces and Kings goes up, same with pocket pairs. Suited cards and connectors and such, the value goes down.

Raising with T5 offsuit was a bad play. check, see a flop and go from there.
Limping in with pocket 10's was bad, define your hand by raising PF.
Limping in with K8suited was bad, raise up your aces and kings PF.
Raising with J8 offsuit??? why not check and see a flop and go from there.

On the hand you had TT, I don't mind the all in call the villian made, he had an open ended straight draw, plus 1 over card for 11 likely outs. He had the odds to call there.
 
spore

spore

Rock Star
Joined
May 4, 2006
Total posts
491
The points effexor made are pretty much what i was thinking whilst reading these hands. However, i might argue that limping with pocket tens heads up is not always a bad idea. you can get paid off huge if you hit a set.. or get a decent chunk if they pair an undercard.

However, i disagree with your last point. he didn't quite have the odds to call the all-in, he was just slightly under even-money, not horrible.. HOWEVER, the real story is the fact that he could have easily been up against a flush draw.. with 3 clubs on the flop, or a made flush/straight. his overcard outs could have been dead as well if he was up against AA/KK or almost any Q with a flush draw. BAD call, imho.
 
Effexor

Effexor

Cardschat Elite
Joined
May 13, 2006
Total posts
1,773
spore said:
However, i disagree with your last point. he didn't quite have the odds to call the all-in, he was just slightly under even-money, not horrible..

He called 4965 and the pot was just shy of 10,000, thats better than even money right? Isn't that 2-1? Assuming he had 11 clean outs (debatable I know) that would put him at 45% to win, and he was getting 2-1 on his money making it a good pot odds bet? Or if you consider the ultimate pot being almost 15,000, calling 5k to win 15k is 3-1.

I can never remember if you count your bet as part of the pot or not.

Not to derail the OP, still working on my pot odds myself ( if it's not obvious )
 
Y

ybab113

Rising Star
Joined
Aug 4, 2006
Total posts
7
i agree with eff all the way...the value does adjust accordingly...i have played countless hours of headsup with my bro...eventually pockets would own anytime sum1 has AK...it rounds out...that tt you need to make a stand...but that 105 was weird...when i started reading this i was about to be like...what is he thinking...don;t worry we all make mistakes lol
 
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