another tough hand

A

admb0m

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Another MTT with blinds 50/100. I have AA in position #2. I raise to 520. #7 calls and the bb calls. The flop is Q42 all diamonds and the bb comes out betting 1000. I have A diamonds. I have 6000 chips, bb has 7500. What are some opinions on my next move? And any guesses on what he holds?
 
Bombjack

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Well, a smooth call isn't a bad option. Clearly you're not worried about the flush draw. Good chance your opponent has a Queen and is trying to stop you drawing if you have a diamond. By smooth calling it just looks like you're on a diamond draw. When the diamond doesn't hit on the turn, your opponent has to bet again to price you out, then you push. If it is a diamond, you're now holding the nuts, and you hope your opponent was betting a draw.
 
A

admb0m

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by the way, 79 people left out of 700 or so. 63 places paid. avg stack 10,000.
 
A

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i had hoped to get more feedback but here's the rest. I push and he calls showing 42 hearts and i dont catch a diamond. out of the tourney again by a stupid caller.
 
shinedown.45

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i had hoped to get more feedback but here's the rest. I push and he calls showing 42 hearts and i dont catch a diamond. out of the tourney again by a stupid caller.
When that happens to me I feel like quiting the game of Poker all together
 
zebranky

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welcome to donk-world

Nothing you can do about that one, man.

The odds of anyone who is willing to play a 24 into your PF raise even surviving to be near the bubble is amazingly small. You would cripple your game if you start considering these wild out-of-the-blue sort of plays as legitimate. The donk got REALLY lucky (both in this hand, and in surviving to get to this hand).


BTW - I strongly disagree with the all-in push with that flop. Consider your opponents bet. He bet around 2/3 the pot, giving you almost 3:1 on your money to call. He's already indicating, by this bet alone, that he is trying to price-out any drawing hand, but that he's not sure if anyone already has the flush (if he had the flush, he would bet lower to keep you in). The problem for you is that you have to put him on either a set or two pair - both of which leave you drawing to win (either an A or for the flush).
I would say smooth call - keep him guessing - or even raise to 2000. Yes, you've committed almost 1/2 your chips, but it gives you the option of backing away if he pushes all-in after you, but still makes a clear statement of strength. If you see the turn, he acts before you anyway, so re-evaluate depending on what comes out.
 
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EH, dont be results oriented, this is an easy push
 
zebranky

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EH, dont be results oriented, this is an easy push

I don't think its results-orientated - but I would agree that I'm being a little bit cautious - which I think is appropriate near the bubble. I know the theory to start pushing even harder near the bubble because everyone else is cautious. I disagree, because that aggression often has people betting into hands that they're already dominated.
AA is good - it is the best PF hand, and still one of the best on most possible flops - but as soon as the flop comes down without an A, I think the goal with AA is not getting the "money in the middle," but rather to take down the pot without too much risk. I have all too mcuh experience from earlier days of getting's A's busted because I still somehow believed A's were invincible on the flop.
 
mrsnake3695

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Once again I am going to disagree with the majority here. I disagree that the BBs play was donkish. Look at it from his perspective. There is almost 1100 in the pot and it costs him 420 to call and see a flop with suited connectors (granted small one gapers). He's getting almost 3-1 which is very good with these cards. It's the kind of hand he can bust someone with if he hits and get away from easily if he doesn't. And he does have alot of chips compared to the blinds so some gambles every now and then when the situation is right is a good thing. We must remember this is a large MTT. You must take chances to accumulate chips if you want to win. Depending on my reads or how I think the players see me at the time, I might very well make the same call under these circumstances. Don't automatically assume that someone that calls with a "weak" hand is a donk. I doubt if you would call Daniel Negranu a donk and I suspect he would have played this exactly the way the BB did here.
 
zebranky

zebranky

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Once again I am going to disagree with the majority here. I disagree that the BBs play was donkish. Look at it from his perspective. There is almost 1100 in the pot and it costs him 420 to call and see a flop with suited connectors (granted small one gapers). He's getting almost 3-1 which is very good with these cards. It's the kind of hand he can bust someone with if he hits and get away from easily if he doesn't. And he does have alot of chips compared to the blinds so some gambles every now and then when the situation is right is a good thing. We must remember this is a large MTT. You must take chances to accumulate chips if you want to win. Depending on my reads or how I think the players see me at the time, I might very well make the same call under these circumstances. Don't automatically assume that someone that calls with a "weak" hand is a donk. I doubt if you would call Daniel Negranu a donk and I suspect he would have played this exactly the way the BB did here.

I see your point here, but I still think its a bad call on the BB regardless. Maybe if he had middle suited-connectors - 78, for example, I could see the logic. The trouble with playing 24 is that you HAVE to flop 2 pair or better to make a hand worth playing - and given that the odds of that are a lot less than 3:1 (or 9:1 for that matter), I don't think its a good long-term stategy. I think I would call it a bad play for Negranu - while he has played (and won) with low-suited hands, I can't recall him playing it into a PF that was strongly bet and called already.

Of course, having said that - and here's your Negranu moment - he won the hand, so obviously his chips speak louder than my wordst!
 
ChuckTs

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I see your point here, but I still think its a bad call on the BB regardless. Maybe if he had middle suited-connectors - 78, for example, I could see the logic. The trouble with playing 24 is that you HAVE to flop 2 pair or better to make a hand worth playing - and given that the odds of that are a lot less than 3:1 (or 9:1 for that matter), I don't think its a good long-term stategy. I think I would call it a bad play for Negranu - while he has played (and won) with low-suited hands, I can't recall him playing it into a PF that was strongly bet and called already.

Two words for you zebranky: implied odds.

First thing I want to say is that 42 is way too low for me personally to gamble with. I draw my line with suited connectors a little higher, but I do agree with snake's point. One theory about MTTs is that you have to gamble to win big and separate yourself from the pack, and playing decieving hands like suited connectors is a great way to get paid off big time.

You want your opponent to be holding a big pair or a set when you hit an even bigger hand. You want to see those 5BB bets in front of you from tight players when you're holding suited connectors. 3:1 is plenty when you can get paid off for your whole stack; your implied odds make up for the lack of pot odds your get preflop when you actually do hit your hand.

Then again, I follow the rule of never gambling with these types of hands with more than %5 of your stack, and with the speed of online tourneys and their low-M situations, I probably don't play even 78s in this situation as neither villain nor you have enough chips to make it worthwhile to call for him.
 
joosebuck

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even if he lucked into 2 pair you are a favorite, get the money in. there is fold equity if he has a brain and notices the 3 diamonds.

35% from the flush, and what - another 25-30% from the chance of the board pairing and giving you higher 2p or you catching an ace?
 
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