Analysis of the hand that took me out (First CC buy=in)

[RichKo]

I think I played this correctly, just got unlucky. No, I don't think of this as a bad beat or have any animosity towards my opponent, thats just how poker works sometimes. Just want to hear some opinions on the way I played my hand. By the way this is not only my first CC Buy in...it's the first time I posted a hand for analysis.

Stage #1338828547 Tourney ID 2115133 Holdem Multi Normal Tournament No Limit $40 - 2008-12-01 19:36:38 (ET)
Table: 3 (real money) Seat #2 is the dealer
Seat 1 - SKYMAGIC ($1340 in chips)
Seat 2 - RICHKO ($1560 in chips)
Seat 5 - PKRPLR4116 ($3737.50 in chips)
Seat 6 - CARDSCHATKQD ($2400 in chips)
Seat 8 - LEAPIN LIZZ ($2770 in chips)
Seat 9 - DJ11_ ($3062.50 in chips)
PKRPLR4116 - Posts small blind $20
CARDSCHATKQD - Posts big blind $40
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to RICHKO [Kh As]
LEAPIN LIZZ - Folds
DJ11_ - Raises $160 to $160
SKYMAGIC - Folds
RICHKO - Raises $320 to $320
PKRPLR4116 - Folds
CARDSCHATKQD - Folds
DJ11_ - Calls $160
*** FLOP *** [3d 9h 4h]
DJ11_ - Bets $700
RICHKO - All-In(Raise) $1240 to $1240
DJ11_ - Calls $540
*** TURN *** [3d 9h 4h] [6d]
*** RIVER *** [3d 9h 4h 6d] [10d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
RICHKO - Shows [Kh As] (ace high)
DJ11_ - Shows [10h Ah] (One pair, tens)
DJ11_ Collects $3180 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total Pot($3180)
Board [3d 9h 4h 6d 10d]
Seat 1: SKYMAGIC Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 2: RICHKO (dealer) HI:lost with ace high [Kh As - P:As,P:Kh,B:10d,B:9h,B:6d]
Seat 5: PKRPLR4116 (small blind) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 6: CARDSCHATKQD (big blind) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 8: LEAPIN LIZZ Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 9: DJ11_ won Total ($3180) HI$3180) with One pair, tens [10h Ah - P:10h,B:10d,P:Ah,B:9h,B:6d]



Should I have reraised more preflop, or just shoved. I hate to shove AK, just cause I think its overplayed way to much, but I'm thinking it might not have mattered anyway.??

 

[Jillychemung]

What were your reads? Why did you assume that DJ11 didn't have a pocket pair? DJ probably put you on a small pocket pair with your minraise preflop. With your stack size if you are going to stack with AKo you would be better off doing it preflop. With DJ11 bet on the flop there was no way he was going to fold to your AI, I'll wager his 700 bet was expressly chosen to get you to push.

 

[GeoffLacey]

I don't understand your shove on the flop. You have Ace high. Did you think he'd fold thinking that you had an overpair? I just think it's unnecessary BB is only $40, you have plenty left

 

[diamond_06_06]

Yeah you don't have much fold equity on the flop, you could very easily be behind and drawing to 6 outs. No push, just fold save your $1240 and move on to the next hand.

 

[RichKo]

I'll wager his 700 bet was expressly chosen to get you to push.

I don't understand this at all...please explain your reasoning. Technically he would'nt want me to push, because I was ahead till the river card.

 

[S93]

Your never geting DJ to fold on the flop after the 700 bet and your almost never ahead either, so why r u shoving?
imo you got lucky he had the drawy part of his range and not a made hand.
Also prf your never geting him out with such a small raise and your just giving him plenty of implied odds.

Highlights
-Bet more prf
-Fold on the flop since you have 0% fold equity and are almost never ahead of his range
-Hide results in analysis section

 

[diamond_06_06]

I don't understand this at all...please explain your reasoning. Technically he would'nt want me to push, because I was ahead till the river card.

Maybe he didn't bet hoping you would push, but he did bet enough so that he would be getting the correct odds (with his nut flush draw and 2 overcards) to call if you did push.

Oh and you were not ahead till the river card. You were only a 54% to 43% favourite on the flop with a 6% chance to split, and on the turn you only had a 7% chance to win.

 

[RichKo]

Your never geting DJ to fold on the flop after the 700 bet and your almost never ahead either, so why r u shoving?
imo you got lucky he had the drawy part of his range and not a made hand.
Also prf your never geting him out with such a small raise and your just giving him plenty of implied odds.

Highlights
-Bet more prf
-Fold on the flop since you have 0% fold equity and are almost never ahead of his range
-Hide results in analysis section

Thanks for the feedback.

Maybe he didn't bet hoping you would push, but he did bet enough so that he would be getting the correct odds (with his nut flush draw and 2 overcards) to call if you did push.

Oh and you were not ahead till the river card. You were only a 54% to 43% favourite on the flop with a 6% chance to split, and on the turn you only had a 7% chance to win.

Just wondering where the turn number came from, I understand your flop percentages, which 54 is bigger than 43 so in my eyes ...its not much, but I am ahead, and then according to the odds calculator here , on the turn I am a 73% to 27% to win...its not till the 10 hit on the river that I lost. I'm trying to study more on odds ond possibilities etc, and just trying to see where your coming from.

 

[The Shrog]

Highlights
-Bet more prf
-Fold on the flop since you have 0% fold equity and are almost never ahead of his range
-Hide results in analysis section

All of this.

 

[diamond_06_06]

Thanks for the feedback.





Just wondering where the turn number came from, I understand your flop percentages, which 54 is bigger than 43 so in my eyes ...its not much, but I am ahead, and then according to the odds calculator here , on the turn I am a 73% to 27% to win...its not till the 10 hit on the river that I lost. I'm trying to study more on odds ond possibilities etc, and just trying to see where your coming from.

Yeah sorry brain snap I must have skimmed over the hand. I read it as the 10 hitting on the turn. so disregard that bit, my bad. But I still believe it should have been folded before the turn.

 

[nevadanick]

that was a bad beat hit one of his three outs to k.o you from the tournament lol that is poker though lol what a cruel game.

Where do you get '3' outs? DJ had a nut flush draw from the flop and the 3 10's.

Also - what is 'bad beat' about having nothing more than an Ace high beat by the showdown? Next thing we know, 3,9o will suffer a 'bad beat' when the 4,8o hits his 4 on the river ....

and I do agree with several others -- should have been folded on the flop to the 700 bet. No justification for the push, other than pushing Lady Luck.

 

[ncscout]

I agree with something you said in the original post : ace king off are over played a lot. I would have not even considered shoving preflop. I would have had to fold after the flop to the 700 bet because at this point all you have are 2 big cards.

 

[Jillychemung]

With DJ11 bet on the flop there was no way he was going to fold to your AI, I'll wager his 700 bet was expressly chosen to get you to push.

I don't understand this at all...please explain your reasoning. Technically he would'nt want me to push, because I was ahead till the river card.

After the Flop the pot is 700 and you have 1240 left and DJ has 2742 left. DJ has the nut flush draw and should be counting at least 3 more outs for overcards, so 12 outs but he may already be ahead based on his estimation of your range. So we can expect that DJ would be willing to stack on this hand at this point. Now how would DJ best be able to get your stack committed at this point? An overbet of 1240 may allow you to get away. A pot bet of 700 makes it look like DJ was only looking at the pot and not your stack but also makes it so that if you decide to call you are now committed. To me this looks like a good bet size.

Now this could also be a big bluff by DJ if his reads are that you will recognize that the pot bet would commit your stack and you wouldn't commit unless you had at least top pair or an overpair. But I doubt it since 'we' haven't played with you enough to get this level of read.

Realize this is all setup by your weak minraise preflop and DJ 1st to act position.

Ask yourself what was your plan preflop with the minraise if
1) DJ shoved over your minraise
2) DJ called your minraise and then shoved on a flop that missed you
3) DJ called your minraise and then checked on a flop that missed you
4) DJ called your minraise and then bet on a flop that missed you
5) DJ called your minraise and then shoved on a flop that hit you
etc.
Did you have in mind what you were going to do in each of these cases? If not I'd say you were not prepared to play the hand. You should be going into every hand with a plan for what happens on different flops and different opponent actions. Use your time bank and prepare yourself for your hands.

 

[Inscore77]

I don't understand this at all...please explain your reasoning. Technically he would'nt want me to push, because I was ahead till the river card.

You're being result oriented. I dont understand your shove with nothing but A high, in spots like this sets are possible, and other pairs are likely. Just fold

 

[RichKo]

I wouldn't go all-in there unless I had Q6o. Just joking

LOL

 

[RichKo]

You're being result oriented. I dont understand your shove with nothing but A high, in spots like this sets are possible, and other pairs are likely. Just fold

I know I screwed up with my crappy min reraise, If I was gonna shove, I should have done it there, and I figured my ace high, good at the time, I was putting him on a flush draw, not a big pair. With the preflop raise, and then the call of the reraise I figured if I was right about the flush draw, they were big cards, and they didnt connect on the small flop. I know in a cash game the odds for him to call were great, but I just didnt figure he would risk the tourney on a draw. Main thing, I do realize I screwed up the preflop play for sho, which made everything pretty much go downhill from there.

 

[Jillychemung]

Main thing, I do realize I screwed up the preflop play for sho, which made everything pretty much go downhill from there.

^^^^ This is great!!!


Now think back about the hand range you put him on preflop with this action

*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to RICHKO [Kh As]
LEAPIN LIZZ - Folds
DJ11_ - Raises $160 to $160
SKYMAGIC - Folds
RICHKO - Raises $320 to $320
PKRPLR4116 - Folds
CARDSCHATKQD - Folds
DJ11_ - Calls $160

and ask yourself, truthfully , how a pot sized bet that commits you changes that range.

 

[Inscore77]

^^^^ This is great!!!


Now think back about the hand range you put him on preflop with this action

*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to RICHKO [Kh As]
LEAPIN LIZZ - Folds
DJ11_ - Raises $160 to $160
SKYMAGIC - Folds
RICHKO - Raises $320 to $320
PKRPLR4116 - Folds
CARDSCHATKQD - Folds
DJ11_ - Calls $160

and ask yourself, truthfully , how a pot sized bet that commits you changes that range.

Seeing how its DJ, you could probably put him on 32 and be correct

Lol seriously though, mid pocket pairs fall right into this range, and it is possible he has connected to hit a set. Just get away from the AK in this spot, I know you were ahead when the money went in, but without being result oriented villain is going to flip a made hand 95% of the time here

 

[switch0723]

Pretty much everything has been covered, but i've played with DJ quite a lot, and i shove a,k pre against him, and def shove over his flop bet, but thats because we know each other quite well, you don't soo much so shoving that flop isn't great