AJs in MTT vs super tight shortstack

[ChuckTs]

pokerstars GAME #8078079321: TOURNAMENT #41231089, $4.00+$0.40 HOLD'EM NO LIMIT - LEVEL X (400/800) - 2007/01/22 - 23:49:15 (ET)
Table '41231089 4' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: lmalford (11392 in chips)
Seat 2: doublace (22820 in chips)
Seat 3: Teriak (8580 in chips)
Seat 4: lakmflx (8760 in chips)
Seat 5: ChuckTs (7180 in chips)
Seat 6: Pimp_I_Am (26715 in chips)
Seat 8: juljulos (5100 in chips)
Seat 9: poorpokey101 (21995 in chips)
lmalford: posts the ante 50
doublace: posts the ante 50
Teriak: posts the ante 50
lakmflx: posts the ante 50
ChuckTs: posts the ante 50
Pimp_I_Am: posts the ante 50
juljulos: posts the ante 50
poorpokey101: posts the ante 50
lmalford: posts small blind 400
doublace: posts big blind 800
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ChuckTs [Js As]
Teriak: folds
lakmflx: raises 3200 to 4000
ChuckTs:....


I was going to push %100 had he not raised.

lakmflx is a very tight player (10/7/3), but is now also shortstacked and has been making several moves recently. Really not sure if I'm ahead of his range...

 

[stormswa]

well

you have to call more then 1/2 your stack from a pretty early position with alot to act behind you with a guy raising all in UTG+1 .


Fold you can wait for better spot.

 

[Dingodaddy23]

wow 10/7/3 thats tight... i'd think I'd just pitch it, especially with all the action left behind you to act. I mean he just put half his stack in, is he really doing this with a worse ace or something like KQ? I think you're probably a race at best, big dog to AK/AQ at worst.

 

[stormswa]

oh

didnt notice the guy wasnt all in, now im even more sure you should fold.

 

[mrsnake3695]

He should have a large range, any ace, any pair etc. but you only dominate ace-10 or lower, everything else either dominates you or is basically a coin flip. I also am leary of a short stack betting half his stack and not pushing, that seems like a big hand that wants money in the pot and also wants action. He will obviously call any raise and will be hard to bluff out post flop if he has anything at all. Fold and pretend you had 2-7 os.

 

[stormswa]

ok

fold and tell him you had JJ actually whenever anyone asks always say you have JJ or pick a hand and that is always the hand you always fold. So basically never ask me in a game what I folded because you will get one answer JJ.

 

[mrsnake3695]

LOL, if you tell him you had JJ you are telling the table you are incredibly weak as JJ has to push here with a short stack.

 

[Stefanicov]

Personally i call here but then i am a loose player prob best bet is to fold

 

[ChuckTs]

I just plain never talk about my hand or show it either.

In the end, I fold and it's folded all around so I don't get to see what he holds anyways :/

I think the fact that I was a little card dead and this was the best hand I'd seen in a while made it *that* much harder to fold.

 

[Dorkus Malorkus]

Pretty easy fold.

Shoving gives you no fold equity against villain here, so you're essentially calling an EP shove from someone who while a little shortstacked still doesn't have to be making a move with an incredibly wide range. You have AJs, which is a marginal hand, and there is always the possibility, albeit slight, that someone behind you wakes up with a real monster. Just fold it.

 

[stormswa]

K

LOL, if you tell him you had JJ you are telling the table you are incredibly weak as JJ has to push here with a short stack.

I dont see a problem with this? The table thinking im weak is exactly what I want. DUH

but that brings up a interesting point, JJ does not have to shove here, you have 2 giant stacks in the blinds and still in terrible position. If either of them wake up with a hand you are gone, again I dont put myself at that much risk with that little bit of information. Now in later position alot changes but Chuck is in horrible position.

chuck is also a small stack and if he pushes all in it might give the blinds odds to call with less then premiem hands so they might be able to call with that AQ or something along that line. If I have JJ I want to be the one making the origional raise.

 

[Dorkus Malorkus]

I dont see a problem with this? The table thinking im weak is exactly what I want. DUH

umm why

 

[stormswa]

because

umm why

I would rather have a weak table image then a tight one? Most players would want a weak table image so you get paid off when you have a big hand. If you have a tight table image then no one will play back at you and you dont get paid off.


I actually said always say you had JJ as a joke that has actually become a what table image post so lets go with it!! are you actually saying you want the table to know you are tight solid so you can start stealing or something like that? Dont know I think I would rather them think im some crazy maniac lag style player then tighten up and take big pot then them thinking im tight solid player and stealing some blinds.

 

[Dorkus Malorkus]

with 9bbs this is irrelevant. you are not worried about 'getting paid off when you have a big hand' as much as you are about shoving preflop and getting everyone to fold or winning a race/getting lucky.

when you have so little room for maneuver table image is actually pretty irrelevant, although you should actually prefer to be perceived as tight because you gain a little fold equity, and in these spots fold equity is far more important than 'getting paid off with a big hand', simply because you're not likely to get a big hand before you really have to start shoving with whatever you've got.

 

[stormswa]

ok

with 9bbs this is irrelevant. you are not worried about 'getting paid off when you have a big hand' as much as you are about shoving preflop and getting everyone to fold or winning a race/getting lucky.

when you have so little room for maneuver table image is actually pretty irrelevant, although you should actually prefer to be perceived as tight because you gain a little fold equity, and in these spots fold equity is far more important than 'getting paid off with a big hand', simply because you're not likely to get a big hand before you really have to start shoving with whatever you've got.

agree with that, I was just talking about your image in general not in this exact situation. This thread got little off track because of my attempt at humor, damn this internet and its inability to show sarcasm!!!!

I'm actually very quite when I play now a days and just put my IPOD on and ignore everyone, if someone asks me something I usually ignore them.

of course you image should of been defined well before this point in the tourney for Chuck.

 

[ChuckTs]

Pretty easy fold.

Shoving gives you no fold equity against villain here, so you're essentially calling an EP shove from someone who while a little shortstacked still doesn't have to be making a move with an incredibly wide range. You have AJs, which is a marginal hand, and there is always the possibility, albeit slight, that someone behind you wakes up with a real monster. Just fold it.

But it was sooted

 

[mrsnake3695]

See, now that was sarcasm we can get.

 

[stormswa]

See, now that was sarcasm we can get.

what can I say Chuck is my hero!

 

[alan1983]

I would rather have a weak table image then a tight one? Most players would want a weak table image so you get paid off when you have a big hand. If you have a tight table image then no one will play back at you and you dont get paid off.


I actually said always say you had JJ as a joke that has actually become a what table image post so lets go with it!! are you actually saying you want the table to know you are tight solid so you can start stealing or something like that? Dont know I think I would rather them think im some crazy maniac lag style player then tighten up and take big pot then them thinking im tight solid player and stealing some blinds.

Doesnt saying you folded JJ imply youre being tight? How does saying saying you folded JJ mean youre being LAG?

 

[stormswa]

it dosent

Doesnt saying you folded JJ imply youre being tight? How does saying saying you folded JJ mean youre being LAG?

it dosent but not knowing the correct play would show you are weak player, which I still dont think folding JJ in that spot would be incorrect. I would rather wait a couple hands till the blinds passed me and I had position.