Was this a bad shove? AKos

[ColinM03]

I won a seat playing a satellite into a $75 buying MTT.

I find I keep making mistakes around the 15BB-20BB range. In this hand I had 17.5 BB and reraised allin with AKos.

Hero: ColinM03

Money Type: Tournament chips
Blinds are now 200 / 400
Button is at seat 7
Seat 1: MookiWest - 19,913
Seat 2: mutchy1405 - 9,801
Seat 4: IIIIIII12III - 13,008
Seat 5: JeAnTyTImE - 6,874
Seat 6: elderchris31 - 34,371
Seat 7: DomSteff64 - 8,875
Seat 8: ColinM03 - 7,025
Shuffling Deck
Moving Button to seat 8
MookiWest posts ante of 25
mutchy1405 posts ante of 25
IIIIIII12III posts ante of 25
JeAnTyTImE posts ante of 25
elderchris31 posts ante of 25
DomSteff64 posts ante of 25
ColinM03 posts ante of 25
Pot sizes: 175
MookiWest posts small blind (200)
mutchy1405 posts big blind (400)
Dealing Cards
Dealing [A s][K h] to ColinM03
IIIIIII12III folds
JeAnTyTImE folds
elderchris31 folds
DomSteff64 raises to 800
ColinM03 raises to 7,000 (all-in)
MookiWest folds
mutchy1405 folds
DomSteff64 calls 7,000
Pot sizes: 14,775
DomSteff64 shows [A d][A c]
ColinM03 shows [A s][K h]
Dealing Flop [5 s][5 h][9 h]
Pot sizes: 14,775
Dealing Turn [9 d]
Pot sizes: 14,775
Dealing River [7 h]
Pot sizes: 14,775

In hindsight I was hoping he was raising with KQ, KJ, AQ, Ax, suited connectors in the cutoff looking to steal the blinds and would fold or make a bad call where I would dominate him. I guess I was card starved folding down my stack for over a hour and got overexcited with AK.

I'm also used to play $12 buyin MTTs with more donkeys who would call with a subpar hand in that position, as opposed to more skilled players in this $75 buyin tournament who know better hence there was little value to gain and a lot to lose with this push?

Recommendation please? I guess I should have flatted and played the hand in position. TY

 

[WiZZiM]

looks good to me. preflop you don't want to hope someone has something. But try and put them on a range of hands that they can have. If he's tight it might be AJ+ 55+ KJs+ or whatever it is. you flip vs some of it, dominate a lot of it, so get it in vs that rnage is fine. Sometimes you will come accross the top of his range, but other times he will just fold, or he will raise/call with AQ and you have him crushed.

Just because you lost the hand does not mean the play was a mistake. The biggest way decent players become bad players is that they change their play style based on the results they get. Poker is weird for learning because sometimes you don't get rewarded for hard work. Like in golf for example, if you practise you chipping extensively you will become better at chipping. However in poker, if you practise or study your play in 15-20BB range, you will get better sure, but your results still may not reflect that as there is the element of luck or variance that can affect it. Prime example above. you played it fine, you ran into a better hand, it happens..

 

[Jpetro]

I don't think it was really a bad play. I may have chosen to 3bet to 2k but I would still be calling his 4bet. Seems ok to me.

 

[Jacki Burkhart]

You can't really ever go wrong getting it all in preflop with AK if you have under 20bbs. in fact, even under 30 bbs there are a lot of times when you should just get it in if you can.

What are your options?

A) fold. NOPE! waaaaaaaaaay too nitty

B) flat call. This could induce a calling cascade where you're playing AK in a medium multiway pot. That's not necessarily terrible if you know how to play AK post flop. Because you have the button, I think this is sometimes an OK option right here.

C) re-raise to something like 1,800-2,100. So if you make it 2,000 and he reraises you it will be for your whole stack. Will you call or fold? If you already know you will call, then you should just shove first seizing max fold equity and making your decisions easier. If he flat calls the pot will be 4,775. and you will have 5,000 left behind. meaning any kind of Cbet on the flop will pot commit you and so if you make any kind of flop bet, it should just be a shove. If he checks, you should probably shove any flop. So if you're going to shove any flop you connect with plus any flop that he checks to you, then why not just shove preflop? that way you keep hands like AQ on the hook for their whole stack...

D)Shove preflop. This is the preferred move, IMO. AK is too strong to fold and to weak to slow play with. any time you can take down a medium pot with AK preflop you should be happy to so so. If you just win preflop that will increase your stack by about 4bbs or 23%. That is a good outcome.

He just happened to have a monster this time, no biggy. You played it well.

 

[joe777]

With no read on opponent,i would prefer flat the 3bet pre and reevaluate the situation on the flop.

 

[Dubstep]

I won a seat playing a satellite into a $75 buying MTT.

I find I keep making mistakes around the 15BB-20BB range. In this hand I had 17.5 BB and reraised allin with AKos.

That's all i needed to read lol. you cant make a mistake re raising all in with AK 15-20bb vs 1 opponent. Maybe only time it could be a mistake is if your at a hyper turbo final table and average stack is like 5bb and your 2nd up against 1st i think it could be correct to flat call and take the lower variance option. maybe im not sure. but that might be the only circumstance where you would want to flat call AK 15-20bb

 

[Dubstep]

If you already know you will call, then you should just shove first seizing max fold equity .

Not always, i think you can 3 bet if you think they will 4 bet with worse. for example they might have 55 and could fold to a re shove but if you 3 bet. They probly cant fold to the 3 bet bcus of the odds and don't feel comftable playing oop with 55 and still may think they have fold equity so they 4 bet jam.

 

[Debi]

You really have less than 14 bb's if you factor in the ante which you should do in this situation.

Unless you have some very good reads and post flop skills that you think will give you a big edge in this situation then you have to get it in all in pre-flop here.

You did the right thing - it just didn't go your way this time.

The biggest mistake I see players make with 15-20 bb's is spewing chips trying to make moves they can't afford to make.

I am with Jacki - there are times I would be getting it all in with even more than 20 bb's.

 

[Jacki Burkhart]

Not always, i think you can 3 bet if you think they will 4 bet with worse. for example they might have 55 and could fold to a re shove but if you 3 bet. They probly cant fold to the 3 bet bcus of the odds and don't feel comftable playing oop with 55 and still may think they have fold equity so they 4 bet jam.

3 betting to induce a light 4bet so you can snap call is essentially the same as slow playing your AK. It is my opinion that while a strong hand, AK is not strong enough to slow play preflop. The example you have of "inducing" a hand like 55 to 4bet shove is NOT the same as getting a worse hand to 4bet. They have 55% equity. You'd be better off causing the 55 to fold and pick up their dead money.

Just my opinion, of course...

 

[Dubstep]

Ok nice on jacki. but what about a hand like a10? where the odds are good enough to call but instead they prefer to jam?

 

[Dubstep]

Or something like that. you cant say no one will ever 4 bet with worse.. or can you? i don't know lol

 

[123andyp123]

Sure is a bad feeling when push with AK and they flip over AA.But isnt wasnt a mistake .And miss jackie is spot on here in my opinion at least.And i hope you keep playing the same .We cant change our play just because we lose (if we done it correctly that is) which you did here, keep it up Collin itll pay off in the long run .

 

[Jacki Burkhart]

Ok nice on jacki. but what about a hand like a10? where the odds are good enough to call but instead they prefer to jam?

You mean if hero has AT?

I think sometimes flatting on the button, sometimes folding if opener is a nit, and sometimes 3bet jamming if opener is a LAG.

The beauty of jamming AT is you may cause AJ or 55 to fold. (Which is a good outcome) But I will often take a pot in position with an ok but not great hand such as AT or 77 depending on openers image and range.

 

[Dubstep]

No villian

 

[Tgen]

good shove

 

[horizon12]

With low antes this bad shove when 18bb, minraise 2 bb enough , if we get 3bet we can shove our monster, but if we miss flop we can not much risk on whole stack, cbet 30% in flop enough if miss..

 

[Rldetheflop]

With low antes this bad shove when 18bb, minraise 2 bb enough , if we get 3bet we can shove our monster, but if we miss flop we can not much risk on whole stack, cbet 30% in flop enough if miss..

Pot has already been opened for a raise. a 3-bet Jam is my play here. Just unlucky.

Of course this is with absolutely no villain read.