$109 NL HE MTT: 77 in UTG, get in 3-bet pot with 3 callers?

[Andyreas]

Game

Hold'em

Game Format

No Limit

Table Format

MTT

Buy-in

109

Currency

$

Hey forum,

I'd like to get some feedback on this hand.

I think I made a few mistakes here but happy to hear your thoughts on this.

I open 77 from UTG and get 3-bet by UTG+1. So I prepared to fold but BN calls and BB calls, so based on pot odds, I decide to call. Is there already a mistake here?

I tried to input the hand to the Converter but I only get error messages, so please have a look at this link:

Hand2Note

hand2note.com

Obviously I got trapped by two players but happy to hear your thoughts.

 

[PokerEdge]

Hi!
Preflop I would raise a bit more, about 2.2.
It also depends on which stage of the tournament you are in, if there is icm,
and how tight or aggressive the table is, but I think all in can also be a good game.
The call after that is definitely good.
The flop is fine, but I would also check the turn. There are four of you, plus the big blind could get stuck in a lot.
If I absolutely wanted to open it, then approx. with 25%, I fold when raising, and chech or fold on the river.

 

[fundiver199]

Preflop
Opening is fine but I would fold to the 3-bet. You are opening UTG and getting 3-bet by the player next to act. This is waaaay stronger than, if you opened on CO and got 3-bet by BTN, so you dont need to defend nearly as wide. You are also not deep enough to setmine here, so 77 is a really bad hand to call a 3-bet with out of position.

Also note, that the fact, two players have cold called the 3-bet, mean, you should be folding more and not less. Its a big misconception, that we should defend wider in multiway pots, weather its defending our blinds or defending to a 3-bet. Yes we are getting better pot odds, but we also have less equity against multible opponents, and when we are out of position, they have all the advantages not us.

Finally cold calling a 3-bet is an extremely strong play, and usually we should be putting the opponents on a very narrow range like maybe TT+, AK, AQs. And of course 77 is crushed by such ranges. There is even a big risk of getting oversetted multiway, when we finally do hit a set. Obviously both these guys were calling way to wide, but you likely did not have any way to know this in advance.

Flop
Standard check.

Turn
I understand, why you jammed, when everyone checks and show weakness. But thats exactly why, its sooo important to just fold pre. It protects you from getting into a sticky spot like this, where you can potentially make some very expensive mistakes.

Results
Obviously a completely crazy hand, where the guy cold calling a 3-bet OOP with 54 offsuit makes a straight and scoops a massive pot from someone cold calling with AT and then overplaying their top pair. Its the kind of hand, which fuel "rigged" theories for sure. If I did not know any better, I would think, this was a freeroll or at least a micro stakes game. The fact, this can also happen in a $109 MTT show, that poker is far from dead

 

[Andyreas]

Thank you guys, as always highly appreciated. 🤗

Also note, that the fact, two players have cold called the 3-bet, mean, you should be folding more and not less. Its a big misconception, that we should defend wider in multiway pots

Thank you for this. I will try to keep it in mind. 🤓

you likely did not have any way to know this in advance.

Fair point. I only knew that BB was a LAG, so I really didn't assume a regular 3-bet range for him but no reads about BN or UTG+1 indeed.

But thats exactly why, its sooo important to just fold pre. It protects you from getting into a sticky spot like this, where you can potentially make some very expensive mistakes

Indeed. I have made a few bad experiences but obviously not too many, yet. 🤣

If I did not know any better, I would think, this was a freeroll or at least a micro stakes game. The fact, this can also happen in a $109 MTT show, that poker is far from dead

It was the Main Event on BOL, so I assume there's all sort of players there. Some gained their seat in a sattie like me or some probably spent 100$ for fun on their Sunday as weekend activity.

 

[vardann]

it seems to me that fundiver199 analyzes hands so professionally that he at least teaches mathematics at the university, and in the evenings at a private school he teaches people to play poker, bravo, once again I read his analysis and once again I am surprised at the knowledge of this person

 

[fundiver199]

Fair point. I only knew that BB was a LAG, so I really didn't assume a regular 3-bet range for him but no reads about BN or UTG+1 indeed.

LAG means "Loose AGgressive", but just because, someone is very loose, does not mean, they are a LAG. LAG is generally a winning playing style, and most players, who are very loose, are long term losers. So more realistically this player was a whale or a maniac, which are the two main types of recreational players.

It was the Main Event on BOL, so I assume there's all sort of players there. Some gained their seat in a sattie like me or some probably spent 100$ for fun on their Sunday as weekend activity.

Sounds reasonable, and maybe BOL is actually as soft, as some people say

 

[fundiver199]

it seems to me that fundiver199 analyzes hands so professionally that he at least teaches mathematics at the university, and in the evenings at a private school he teaches people to play poker, bravo, once again I read his analysis and once again I am surprised at the knowledge of this person

Very flattering but I am just an engineer not a math teacher

 

[Andyreas]

LAG means "Loose AGgressive", but just because, someone is very loose, does not mean, they are a LAG.

I know. But I would say the LAG stamp fit to him. He was playing many hands, raising a lot and became CL quickly. But he wasn't a total maniac, I'd say.

Sounds reasonable, and maybe BOL is actually as soft, as some people say

Well, I don't play there very long so far but indeed. The player pool is quite fishy, containing also some sharks though. But I don't have super results there so far because the fish also tend to get lucky sometimes. 😅

But hopefully in the long run, I will. 🤓

 

[fundiver199]

I know. But I would say the LAG stamp fit to him. He was playing many hands, raising a lot and became CL quickly. But he wasn't a total maniac, I'd say.

Of course its only one hand. But unless he did some kind of misclick, I dont see, how a winning player would ever cold call a 3-bet out of position with 54o. Thats just way to loose chip leader or not. Its also not aggressive. If he had thrown it in as a cold 4-bet, then ok maybe once in a while with a specific read, but it can never be a good call. For starters he is not closing the action, and you should mainly by continuing by 4-bet jamming rather than calling with your stack size.

 

[Andyreas]

Of course its only one hand. But unless he did some kind of misclick, I dont see, how a winning player would ever cold call a 3-bet out of position with 54o. Thats just way to loose chip leader or not. Its also not aggressive.

I see your point and agree on that.

I put that label onto him due to the previous hands mainly.

But also those weren't many, like 15-20. So he could be whatever type. 😅

 

[fundiver199]

I put that label onto him due to the previous hands mainly. But also those weren't many, like 15-20. So he could be whatever type. 😅

Which is why, its important to pay attention to, what people show down, when we only have a small sample on them. Even just a single hand, which is as far out of line as this one, would be enough for me to replace a "LAG" label with a "fish" label. At least until more solid evidence point in a different direction.

 

[Andyreas]

Which is why, its important to pay attention to, what people show down, when we only have a small sample on them. Even just a single hand, which is as far out of line as this one, would be enough for me to replace a "LAG" label with a "fish" label. At least until more solid evidence point in a different direction.

Hmm. I think you keep editing your post. 😅

I agree on both statements and I also try to change labels accordingly when I get the chance to. 🤓

Maybe you're right. He was more fishy than LAG. I would have to check all his hands in the HUD again. I didn't observe everything to full detail as I was multitabling.

 

[fundiver199]

Hmm. I think you keep editing your post. 😅

Guilty as charged

I didn't observe everything to full detail as I was multitabling.

It might be a decent idea to not multitable, if you are playing an MTT, which is much more expensive than your normal buyin.

 

[Andyreas]

It might be a decent idea to not multitable, if you are playing an MTT, which is much more expensive than your normal buyin.

Guilty as well. 😇

I thought the same but I got bored quickly as my strategy is to play tight in such a tourney and therefore I don't get a lot of action. 🙈

 

[dallam]

Its free to say that both BTN and BB according to their possible range are totally junkies. I agree, this is a very cold 3-bet and from that position especially only better hands than ours, in best case AKs AQs AKo but nothing more beatable hands. And with 30bb left its just valid to have the big boys fight over to this, in fact, anytime at a 8-max could fold this one if MP moved in with a 3-bet cause the position and range issues. (Bounties could make exception, but many factors needs to click to be able to make this call).

Also you choosed to put your whole stack in at Turn so at this point QQ,KK,AA should 4bet shove pre, the only hand is JJ you could have, which goes all-in on flop. So if you not have A10s / J10s / 910s ( but they would also put some strenght on flop prob.) then the only option to see it as you did a bluff cause I doubt 22 or 33 would open min-bet and make a call & the cards you could have here more likely 66, 44, 55, and the 77-99 stuff I believe. And if that's the case, any 10x can make a call. Moreover, as we see now,they do play 54o as well, so. Its just hush to us.

GL!

 

[StealTheButton]

If we look at the stack sizes alone Hero is not deep enough to try and hit a set because 600 is 20% of his stack, but preflop he is getting about 5.1 to 1 to make the call. With pot odds and implied odds I agree this is a call. However, I am a tight ass and I'm probably not raising with 7 7 until MP +1. Unfortunately with 3 other players this is check and fold unless you hit your set. With 3 other players there is just too great a change that somebody has something, especially cold calling the 3 bet. Though 54 is about the last hand I would have put any player on.