$1.75 NLHE STT Turbo: first level, JJ in middle position, facing huge UTG raise

[cjatud2012]

So this seems like a simple spot I guess, but it's just not something you usually see. This is the second hand, villain is unknown.

PokerStars - $1.50+$0.25|10/20 NL (9 max) - Holdem - 9 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

LP: 1,400.00
CO: 1,640.00
BTN: 1,460.00
SB: 1,500.00
BB: 1,500.00
UTG: 1,500.00
UTG+1: 1,500.00
Hero (MP): 1,500.00
MP+1: 1,500.00

SB posts SB 10.00, BB posts BB 20.00

Pre Flop: (30.00) Hero has J:spade: J:diamond:

UTG raises to 100.00, fold, Hero ???

 

[Xavier]

Fold.
But with QQ i'D raise.

 

[the lab man]

Fold.
But with QQ i'D raise.

I would fold too.... would you call with A/K????

 

[ben_rhyno]

Thread full of nits already

 

[cjatud2012]

can you guise elaborate a little on your plays please?

 

[ben_rhyno]

Ok I probably flat in position, we are 75BBs deep and have close enough odds to set mine for 6.7% of our stack, as well as probably being ahead here already, so at least a call

 

[Xavier]

I would fold too.... would you call with A/K????

Probably just call with AK.
Reraising with AK I think is OK but can often get us in a coinflip (which we don't want) if he shoves afterward, or we end up in an awkward spot if he flats and then miss the flop.

I guess because this a $1 sit n go flatting could be OK.
I normally play $10 sit n gos, and in those an UTG 5bb raise at the first level, generally means a range of only AK,AQ,88+ for the regs, and against that range JJ doesn't look particulary strong.

 

[ben_rhyno]

JJ is ahead of this opening range

 

[ben_rhyno]

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 52.883% 51.98% 00.90% 61419580 1061561.00 { JsJd }
Hand 1: 47.117% 46.22% 00.90% 54606274 1061561.00 { 88+, AQs+, AQo+ }

 

[baudib1]

I don't see this raise as being huge but I think folding is perfectly fine.

 

[cjatud2012]

Probably just call with AK.
Reraising with AK I think is OK but can often get us in a coinflip (which we don't want) if he shoves afterward, or we end up in an awkward spot if he flats and then miss the flop.

I guess because this a $1 sit n go flatting could be OK.
I normally play $10 sit n gos, and in those an UTG 5bb raise at the first level, generally means a range of only AK,AQ,88+ for the regs, and against that range JJ doesn't look particulary strong.

Well if his range is stronger shouldn't we actually be more inclined to set-mine, because we're more likely to get paid off when we hit?

 

[baudib1]

are you folding to a cbet on a 623 rainbow flop?

 

[Tammy]

I'll throw my hat in, even though I don't put near as much time in analyzing my game as you guys. I'm flatting here for the set mine. It's early, so your stack is still healthy, and with the absolute ridiculous play I see in these games, I'm feeling pretty good about JJ.

And no, I'm not folding to c-bet on a 623 rainbow flop.

 

[cjatud2012]

are you folding to a cbet on a 623 rainbow flop?

I might call one street (is that spewy?), but I'm not looking to get it all-in.

 

[baudib1]

If you're not folding on an undercard flop, you're not set-mining.

 

[ben_rhyno]

are you folding to a cbet on a 623 rainbow flop?

No because AK and AQ make up more of villains range than QQ/KK/AA

 

[cjatud2012]

If you're not folding on an undercard flop, you're not set-mining.

Well yes, that's what I meant to say

 

[Tammy]

If you're not folding on an undercard flop, you're not set-mining.

Didn't think of it that way, but yes, I guess you're right.

Am I so totally wrong to be happy to get the chips in if villain pushes it on the flop that baudib is suggesting?

 

[cjatud2012]

Didn't think of it that way, but yes, I guess you're right.

Am I so totally wrong to be happy to get the chips in if villain pushes it on the flop that baudib is suggesting?

It's kind of like a reverse implied odds situation I guess - if that's the flop, he bets and we shove, we fold out his AK/AQ (which isn't an awful result because they both have a non-negligible amount of equity, even though we're still ahead), but most of the rest of his range that continues here beats us, save for TT/99, maybe 88. So that's why I thought maybe calling one street would be a good plan, because then we could fold to a turn barrel.

But if he did check to us on the turn I don't know whether we should check or bet, there doesn't really seem like a point in betting at that point, other than to keep him from leading the river. Although maybe that's not such a bad result, as long as the river isn't a scare card.

I dunno, talking this through makes this line sound like a very expensive way to get to a cheap showdown probably not optimal.