$0,25 NL HE MTT:

[Andyreas]

Game

Hold'em

Game Format

No Limit

Table Format

MTT

Buy-in

0,25

Currency

$

Hey gals and guys,

I wanted to get some feedback on this hand I played.

I was in the SB and everyone folded to me. I was holding Q8o and decided to bet 3bb. I would have been fine with stealing the BB but BB called. On the flop, I hit middle pair, so I decided to bet. BB called again. On the turn, villian bet 1/3 of the pot. What would have been the correct move in this case?

Would you have played the hand at all? Sure, Q8o is a mediocre hand but since everyone folded, I think it's reasonable to give it a shot, no?

pokerstars, $0.23 + $0.02 - Hold'em No Limit - 25/50 (6 ante) - 8 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

Waiheke Wiz (UTG): 1,892 (38 bb)
REDBLUEPURPLE (UTG+1): 1,703 (34 bb)
Andru1963 (MP): 3,219 (64 bb)
Dibelpokerdjiq (MP+1): 6,258 (125 bb)
Ath3ri (CO): 1,310 (26 bb)
saskie19 (BU): 1,380 (28 bb)
AndyreasDE (SB): 3,014 (60 bb)
hanher94 (BB): 1,683 (34 bb)

Pre-Flop: (123) Hero (AndyreasDE) is SB with Q♥ 8♣
6 players fold, AndyreasDE (SB) raises to 150, hanher94 (BB) calls 100

Flop: (348) 8♥ K♥ 4♣ (2 players)
AndyreasDE (SB) bets 174, hanher94 (BB) calls 174

Turn: (696) 2♣ (2 players)
AndyreasDE (SB) checks, hanher94 (BB) bets 237, AndyreasDE (SB) calls 237

River: (1,170) K♦ (2 players)
AndyreasDE (SB) checks, hanher94 (BB) bets 200, AndyreasDE (SB) calls 200

Total pot: 1,570

Showdown:
hanher94 (BB) shows K♣ Q♠ (three of a kind, Kings)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 76%, Flop: 87%, Turn: 95%, River: 100%)

AndyreasDE (SB) mucks Q♥ 8♣ (two pair, Kings and Eights)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 24%, Flop: 13%, Turn: 5%, River: 0%)

hanher94 (BB) wins 1,570

 

[fundiver199]

Preflop
SB is the one seat, where open limping is fine, when there is an ante in play. But when you are the big stack like here, it is also fine to raise it up and apply some pressure.

Flop
I think, its fine to bet the flop with second pair. Blind vs. blind ranges are very wide, so this is a much stronger hand, than if you had opened from early or mid position, and he defended.

Turn
2 of clubs is a total brick, that never helped him, so you are in a great spot here to catch some bluffs and try to get to showdown without bloating the pot to much. Check-calling is perfect, since your hand is to weak to bet all 3 streets for value.

River
Kd is another great card for you, because now its less likely, he has a K, and if he does, you were behind already, so its not like, it changed anything. Even so I might still have found a fold, if he had bombed the river by moving all-in, which would basically be a pot sized bet. When he only bet 200 into a pot of 1.170 it does look like, you are being milked for value. But you are getting almost 7:1, so you only need to be good 13% of the time, and people do some really weird things especially in a low buyin like this. Like betting bottom pair for no reason or trying to bluff with a sizing, that almost always get called.

Results
Just a bit of a cooler blind vs. blind. You played the hand well and lost the minimum.

 

[IADaveMark]

Normally I would have been wary after the call on the flop. Really wary after the bet on the turn and certainly annoyed after the bet on the flop. I would have tended to eject even on the turn but the bet sizes were so small, it made for reasonable bluff-catching.

 

[300HPGOD]

Pre flop I think you can go any way (even fold) based on villains tendencies and how aggressive they are. Normally I would be calling or raising and without any info on villain some mix of call pre and raise is fine.

On the flop we have a pair and a backdoor flush that has some value to it (Queen high) so I would be betting here and trying to continue a story that I am strong. Again, this does depend on villains call tendencies and aggression but not getting into FPS or anything like that we should be betting 40% and seeing if we can take it down. You bet half pot and slight nitpick but you could have gone a little smaller than that and still potentially got the job done. Villain probably still thinks we are wide just as we think villain is wide (although pre flop raising does narrow a bit) so I believe this call can still have a lot of floats in it.

On the turn, this is where I disagree with other posters so far as I would bet again here. The second club does now keep a lot more of the potential floats from the flop in to call a turn bet which we are ahead of. Villain can still have a king here but with that second club coming changes the hand and now we have a bigger value target. I would bet about 40-45% pot here and see. I am not getting anything better to fold but again I feel like villains calls pre flop have probably a decent amount of suited hands and there are now two flush draws which I can extract from. I would think 99-QQ, and AA is 3 betting pre so I am not worried about bigger pairs but only Kx. If the turn card was a non club I would be much more on board with check calling. As played I would be a little worried that villain bet behind our check since I would be thinking villains that are wide would check behind there even with their draws. Not enough to scare me out of the hand but it would have me thinking a bit.

Let me start by saying if the hand played bet flop and bet turn by you I would be checking every river that came out. I would be checking to induce a bluff and thinking villain isnt going to call 3 streets with too much of anything that we beat. When the King comes out, which is a great card, I would follow that plan and check here (as played this is a check as well) and let villain bluff. They wont be calling with worse anyway and its now more unlikely they have a King. Given the sizing villain makes it on the river I would be calling pretty quickly here. It is a value town bet but they could have made it larger and we would still be calling so I would be happy with the sizing I faced and make the call.

I think you played the hand well even though I would bet the turn with that second club but that is up for debate. The king on the river is fairly bad luck as it puts us in more of the mindset that we are ahead.

 

[fundiver199]

On the turn, this is where I disagree with other posters so far as I would bet again here.

Just for the record I dont think, betting turn is bad in any way. With second pair good kicker we still have the best hand most of the time, so the only thing, we should not be looking to do, is to check-fold. As for betting or check-calling, its largely about stylistic preference, and if the opponent is a regular, we have played with a lot, its best to mix it up to be less predictable. Regardless which line, we take, we lose 3 bets on this runout, and as we both agree, we actually lost the minimum, because Villain sized so small on the river. And while not the most interesting or sexy thing in the world, letting other players make sizing mistakes and miss out on value is actually one of the ways, we gain a long term edge.

 

[Matt_Burns88]

Personally, I prefer a limp from the small blind with these types of hands (along with AA and KK). If the BB calls you're out of position for the rest of the hand and most of the time going to have a marginal made hand or complete air. So I much prefer playing a smaller pot. So instead of a 7bb pot, you would only have a 3bb pot.

As played, the bet on the flop is absolutely fine, although I would probably opt for around 1/3 pot rather than 1/2 . BvB middle pair on this type of board will often be the best hand and any kind. Note if you'd limped preflop, the pot would now be 6bb.

I would not check the turn here. The 2♣️ is pretty much a blank, so you're still likely in front. Checking gives the initiative to your opponent. He can either check and see a free card with his straight and flush draws, or he can semi bluff and put the pressure on you. Along with of course all his value bets. Note if you'd limped preflop, the pot would now be 10bb.

I would check the river once he calls two streets (or bets turn). His bet on the river screams strength to me, but he's giving you such good odds you need to be right to call less than 1 in 7 times to be profitable, I think you have to call. I would be making a note on this guy though. Betting 1/6 on the river with what is effectively always the nuts, with the way the hand played out is a very exploitable play and you will find yourself being able to save your 4bbs here very often. Note if you'd limped preflop, the pot would now be 13-14bb; in the end you lost around 15bb instead of around 6-7bb if you'd limped.