Are MTTs really good for the bankroll?

Beriac

Beriac

Guest
People (well, some people) seem to talk about MTTs like they're a very helpful bankroll builder. Maybe I am missing something, but I don't see it?

To me, different kinds of games have differing payoff distributions: Heads Up games are more like coin flips (not saying they are coin flips, but more like a coin flip than a ring game, let's say), Ring Games are more of a grind, SNGs are kind of in the middle, and MTTs... well to me, they seem like a long-shot.

The way the payments are distributed, finishing in the very low levels of cash placement doesn't seem all that lucrative, so you have to cash well into the money to really justify the time, entry fee, and risk.

Don't get me wrong, I love MTTs, but it seems to me that they're more about playing a fun tournament and hopefully taking home a big prize rather than reliably building a bankroll.

Thoughts?
 
starfall

starfall

Visionary
They can be a good way to build a bankroll just as other styles of game - with MTTs, you may go for longer without a payout, and your bankroll has to be big enough to handle that, but if you're good enough the payouts when you do place will cover the buyins and more
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

Legend
MTTs are surprisingly easy to place in.
Most see them as a long shot because just looking at the number of entrants makes you feel like you'll never be able to outlast 300 people!, but in reality all you're doing is playing a 10-handed game, and outlasting everyone you're sitting with.
Playing a tight aggressive game, then loosening up is really such an easy way to hit money.
I think hitting final table once every couple weeks is well worth your time and buy-in fee.
For $10 risk, there is potential to win $2000 in 3 hours if you play your cards right.
Sure payouts are few and far between, but when you hit them, boy do they pay well :)
I'm actually currently playing MTTs solely in hopes of giving my BR a nice boost :) - been coming quite close; keep bubbling out (at least its with a big stack as opposed to blinding out though)
 
Beriac

Beriac

Guest
Fair enough. I guess I always thought of "bankroll builders" as being games where you could slowly but surely build your "stack".
 
titans4ever

titans4ever

Legend
I can't think of another way to make $1 into $240 in 5 hours playing poker unless you are MyNetBets. The payoff at the end is great for the money you put in but the odds of getting a higher finish is less. You can make it into the money reasonable often but the big payouts come once in awhile. SnG's you can get into the money more often but the payoff is less at the top.

$1 MTT at stars w/ say 2000 people you can win up to $200-300.
$1 SnG at stars w/ 45 people, first is $14 You will have to win 16 of them to make the same money.

One decent finish can really bost your bankroll but dryspells happen more often since it only takes one mistake to take you out of the tournament.
 
Beriac

Beriac

Guest
Interesting perspective. I guess I never thought of it as just continually outlasting your table of 10. Maybe I'll start adding them to the schedule. Thanks for the insights.
 
T

Threesixes

Visionary
I find my way into the money pretty easily too. I have definitely made money on them. The way I see it, the more hands played, the more skill has the advantage over chance.
 
H

Hurricane09

Enthusiast
I usually use the SNGs to build my bankroll in order to me to play a MTT without worrying about it if I don't place. The money's there and I may as well take my shot at it. Then, after 3 hours and a profit of $1.00 (lol - I always seem to lose out right when I hit the money), I play a few more SNGs and plot my next MTT domination. It's a vicious cycle.
 
A

Allsopp

Guest
doing well in MTT's is directly linked to two factors:

1. how good a player you are.

2. how big your balls are.

i find it very easy to place in MTT's but that comes with ALOT of practice. thats why you shouldn't be complaining about losing them, you should be playing lots of low buy in MTT's to gain experience in how to play them. thats how i got so good at them.

if i play an MTT and dont make the final table these days i am PISSED OFF with myself. simply because - its very easy to make a final table in a tournament so long as there are no more than 200-300 entrants.

chucks theory of outlasting the table is a great way of thinking. however MTT success is all about changing gears. to be successful in them you have to take down alot of pots through whatever means necessary. engage bluffs and know when to escape from them if you get into trouble.

you need to go from tight aggressive to loose aggressive maniac in the space of a hand to make your opponents scared of taking you on.

the tactic i use for doing well in MTT's is, climb into the top 10 early and fight to stay there. if you use this tactic you wont go far wrong. its easy to boss your table if your sat in a top 10 position because people constantly check the standings on websites and being high up at any point throughout the tournament commands respect.

how often have you resisted taking on a commanding stack for fear of getting called?
 
A

Allsopp

Guest
ohh and to answer the thread! MTT's essentially aren't great for bankroll but great for lifestyle.

cash games will give you a bankroll and help you maintain it.

MTT's will:

buy you cars.
pay your bills.
put food on the table.
buy you holidays.

etc etc etc

being a good MTT player is almost essential for long term poker success. because you always have to have funds from big MTT wins to fall back on when you hit a bad run.
 
t1riel

t1riel

Legend
Well, if you place high enough in them, defintely. When you play in a MTT you can AT LEAST double your buy-in if you place so if you are good at MTTs, go for it!
 
Effexor

Effexor

Cardschat Elite
I think MTT's are good for the bankroll. The TV coverage that poker gets these days has flooded these tournys with horrid poker players, so if you can get past the all-in / bad beat from chasers stage, it's fairly easy to do well.

MTT's tend to work well for solid consistant players that are patient.
 
starfall

starfall

Visionary
I think theres some differences worth noting about MTTs compared to other variants. In ring games, a basic tight, aggressive style can gradually build up a bankroll. Similarly this style can get you into the money in an SnG, with the time taken being short enough that even if you're not that experienced short-handed you can just get very aggressive, and make it more luck who gets the top 2 places, rather than short-handed playing skill.
Both ring games and SnGs can be profitable mainly playing your cards, rather than your reads on your opponents.
With an MTT, however, being a mediocre, tight player is just not enough. That will maybe get you to the early money placings before you're blinded out, and you'll have played for 2-3 hours for very little money, and no profit once you factor in the times you miss the money. This means sometimes not playing based on your cards but based on position and table psychology.

I suspect that being a significantly profitable MTT player requires the most skill, because you're playing more against better players in the later stages, and must adapt your strategy for the changing feel of the table. One of the skills it does require for the good payouts is short-handed playing skill, so it is useful to have played a number of SnGs first, which will give you more of an idea how play changes on the bubble, and how you need to play short-handed, and once you are getting some firsts in the SnGs and are making a profit, then is probably more the time to consider playing the MTTs.
 
MyNetBets

MyNetBets

Enthusiast
titans4ever said:
I can't think of another way to make $1 into $240 in 5 hours playing poker unless you are MyNetBets. The payoff at the end is great for the money you put in but the odds of getting a higher finish is less. You can make it into the money reasonable often but the big payouts come once in awhile. SnG's you can get into the money more often but the payoff is less at the top.

$1 MTT at stars w/ say 2000 people you can win up to $200-300.
$1 SnG at stars w/ 45 people, first is $14 You will have to win 16 of them to make the same money.

One decent finish can really bost your bankroll but dryspells happen more often since it only takes one mistake to take you out of the tournament.
LOL man its great how you remeber me:hello:
 
A

AKTAR

Rising Star
My way of dealing with building this so called bankroll is to play ring-sng and mtt. No certain order, but using all three to help me learn and play well. I try not to play on one site for more than a couple days. I am building some money this way, kind of the turtle headed toward the finish line.
 
cali420fornia

cali420fornia

Guest
i do the same thing when i get into the money. i grind it out for like 3 hours and then when i get in the money i mess it up.

i had a pretty good result tuesday night placing low in a 4000 entrant freeroll but i have never had the privaledge of placing low in a buy in MTT.
 
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