Do you think there is more cheating than we think in live-streamed poker games?

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Reality Check: Mike Postle Isn’t the Only Player Cheating on Poker Live-Streams

Yes, there is plenty of cheating going on in live streamed live games. But online is totally secure and trustworthy. Nothing suspicious going on in those online poker rooms ladies and gents.

I suspect it is inevitable that allegations against others will be made. Even if they can’t be proved, the suspicion that there is widespread cheating is going to be hard to shake off.

No phones at the table is the starting point to rebuilding trust and confidence.

It is obviously possible, that other people have done this as well. However we need to remember, that it also require someone working in the casino to be in on the plot. and some casinos take more measures to protect the stream data, than Stones did. So without further and concrete evidence I think, it is a bit much to say, that this is a widespread problem.

Could not agree more with all three comments above.

I had already heard this idea of the 'possibility' of wider spread cheating put forward by a couple of senior poker players and to be frank, it really got on my nerves. As above, if anyone has hard evidence or facts, bring it forward otherwise could we dispense with the speculation and gossip?

I am sure the casino industry has its problems with security and theft but so does every industry - whether it is the restaurant industry, retail, banking, hospital staff trying to scam drugs etc. some staff will try to take advantage.

But this, to date, has been one flawed gambling room where the tourney director was out to lunch and none of the security protocols implemented in Nevada had been followed.

And as puzzlefish notes above "But online is totally secure and trustworthy. Nothing suspicious going on in those online poker rooms ladies and gents". Precisely, I accept that sort of comes with the territory regarding on-line play (if we are talking dubiosity) - and factor that in to how far I extend myself.

Any 'possibility' of cheating during live streams (a tiny fraction of live games) could be closed immediately if all electronic items such as phones and headphones were immediately banned from RFID tables, that simple.

Originally Posted by DS3

Any 'possibility' of cheating during live streams (a tiny fraction of live games) could be closed immediately if all electronic items such as phones and headphones were immediately banned from RFID tables, that simple.

Agree with this, but it might be easier said than done. Bluetooth earbuds are getting pretty small nowadays and we would also have to ban hoodies, hats, and anything that covers ears to prevent people from hiding them.

I can easily see a scenario where the player has his phone hidden in his pocket and connected to a call where an accomplice is dictating hole cards to him in real time via a Bluetooth earbud. You would never be able to tell by looking at him because you never see him touch his phone and the conversation is one-way only.

Originally Posted by Propane Goat

I can easily see a scenario where the player has his phone hidden in his pocket and connected to a call where an accomplice is dictating hole cards to him in real time via a Bluetooth earbud. You would never be able to tell by looking at him because you never see him touch his phone and the conversation is one-way only.

It is reasonable to forbid players bringing electronic devises to the table including cellphones to at least make this kind of cheating more difficult. Besides players should also not be allowed to get advice during play from their coach, and that alone is enough reason to get rid of cellphones.

In retrospect its fairly crazy, that phones have been allowed in streamed games - even final tables where millions of dollars are at stake. Not only can players sit and watch the stream with delay, but the coach can also send advice like "he has been bluffing 3 out of 4 times with this line".

Besides that the other end of the chain has to be protected. The editing room must be locked, and staff working in teams and rotated, so that a single employee can not do this alone. Just like most companies will not allow a single employee to transfer 5 million dollars to another bank account. Its pretty standard procedure in accounting, that at least two people need to confirm large transfers.

Rather than ban electronic devices all together, why not make it a poker rule that any device brought to and used at the table during the game can be inspected at the request of any player with the oversight of management.

Originally Posted by Propane Goat

Agree with this, but it might be easier said than done. Bluetooth earbuds are getting pretty small nowadays and we would also have to ban hoodies, hats, and anything that covers ears to prevent people from hiding them.

I can easily see a scenario where the player has his phone hidden in his pocket and connected to a call where an accomplice is dictating hole cards to him in real time via a Bluetooth earbud. You would never be able to tell by looking at him because you never see him touch his phone and the conversation is one-way only.

I agree with this. As technology improves, there will just become more innovative ways to do things including cheating.

Cheating in poker has been talked about for a long time.Playing online you can get to the table to the scammers who play from the same room with different computers.the more information they have on the distribution of the greater the chances to beat you.Yes they are caught by the security Department but that does not make them less.Money makes a man a demon.In offline I would, too, banned phones if from me would this depended.All luck friends!

Originally Posted by ChickenArise

Rather than ban electronic devices all together, why not make it a poker rule that any device brought to and used at the table during the game can be inspected at the request of any player with the oversight of management.

I dont think, this is enough. Then I have to ask for an inspection, if I think, someone might be coaching you via text messages during play. And if we are having a friendly game, that is kind of a social no-no. Besides you can also just delete the text messages right after reading them, and what use is the inspection then?

I understand, that a lot of people have gone dependent on their phones and being on social media 24 hours a day. But honestly maybe this is the time to say "enough is enough" and force people to put them away, at least when they are playing a streamed live game.

Originally Posted by sharipov8090

Cheating in poker has been talked about for a long time.Playing online you can get to the table to the scammers who play from the same room with different computers.the more information they have on the distribution of the greater the chances to beat you.Yes they are caught by the security Department but that does not make them less.Money makes a man a demon.In offline I would, too, banned phones if from me would this depended.All luck friends!

In online poker you dont exactly need to sit in the same room to collude. There are plenty of ways to communicate ranging from an old fashioned phone call over chatting (outside the poker site) to video conferences. However it is easily detected by the poker site, if the same people always play together, and play in a different way against each other. And even as a player its not that difficult to spot a "team", if they do it with any kind of regularity.

Am i the only one surprised this has gotten this big? Its all over the news as well it seems.

PropaneGoat-

Essentially I agree of course. A clever and determined crook (for that is what they would be) would utilize advancing technology and try to be a step ahead.

But-let's at least start by making the feasibility of cheating a much more difficult hill to climb. As Fundiver points out, the recommended set up for RFID tables is behind two security walls...the first being the general tech operation with the first layer of security. Then a 'deeper' separate RFID room with additional security, where personnel are strictly limited and communication devices are never allowed at any time (claimed by the WSOP and PokerGo etc. as in place).

With this in place, ban all phones and even headphones for all live streams. If needs be, inspect ears for tiny ear buds (terms and conditions can be set by the tourney organizer).

Could/would someone attempt to circumvent this system? Yes. But they would need to be a different breed of criminal than the petty con artists who took advantage of a wide open system at Stones.

I'm sure there's plenty

The way I figure it, if anyone other than myself can know my cards in realtime, there is a possibility of cheating. Not even a huge fan of the WSOP hole cams... but they at least have a brand so valuable that even 10 million is not enough for trusted people to risk it.

Just imagine something like this was done at live at the bike.

This is simply ridiculous.

I was raised in the poker world, I worked for the wso and wsop.

ANY PERSON who knows Mike and his playing style knows that the hands shown are perfectly typical for him.

Postle has paid his Bill's for about 16 years in the industry of poker. That's not cheating kids. That's skill. Tunica, Biloxi, Las Vegas, the list goes on and on.

If he is cheating than it is it what it is. But stop pointing the finger at a skilled player unless you have proof.

Stop being haters.

Im no techie but data mining stock market cheats have been around for years , no stretch to think 733T #AX aint happening i n poker streaming in my mind. Dosent need to be an inside job. Probably is though. Bruce Grobelar.

In my mind if cheating is indeed occurring the way the accusers say it is in streamed poker games then the exact same thing is possible and "probably" happening in online poker games.

If the cards can be "tapped" by an individual and passed on to players...then all poker involving electronics is a sham.

There has to be ways to keep the electronic information jumbled until it is needed for the commentators to talk about.

Good luck !

This whole scandal makes me never want to play with rfid cards

Originally Posted by Poker_Mike

In my mind if cheating is indeed occurring the way the accusers say it is in streamed poker games then the exact same thing is possible and "probably" happening in online poker games.

It has happened in online poker. Just google "Ultimate Bet" or "Absolute Poker", if you want to know more. These two poker sites were merged, and is the only known case of online superusers. I think, its fair to say, that all major poker sites go to lenght to ensure, they are not ****ed the same way by their employees, as these two sites were.

i dont even care about the mike postle thing if im not ever going to play against him. i have read and saw all kinds ogf stories about the online sites we play at. im still not completely convinced the sites or the other players are all on the up and up. i still play allthe time eitherway. u can say they do or u can say they dont people are gonna believe what they want to believe. afterall can it completely be proven either way?

I would have thought playing live at a casino would regulate fair play. But with the Postle scandal don’t really trust casinos. I’m always on the look out for possible collusion with players. Particularly ones that seems like they hang out as friends. Wife/husband teams I look to see if there are hand signals. Taking longer than expected and checking cell phones. I think phones should be banned as well or at least be on the rail for others to observe if there any funny business

I had this very thought about live streamed games this surely can't be the only instance. The truth will come out and technology will change to combat this

if you can prove cheating prove it, othewise you shouldn't ruin someones reputation without proof thats not fair, how does he prove he'snot cheating

Yes I sure of it
Infested with criminals

Cheating is part of human nature. Wives cheat on their husbands and vice versa, disregarding their wedding vows in exchange for some sexual gratification, officials sell government secrets to foreign powers, but somehow we expect a bunch of degenerate gamblers to abide by the highest ethical standards

Originally Posted by paulyd

Just imagine something like this was done at live at the bike.

I can't imagine such thing, my heart could not withstand a tragedy of that magnitude

I think yes i think this is very well possible and with the technic getting better and better there might be even more cheating in the future. It will be difficult to prevent this