Playing the Small Blind (Day 19 Course Discussion)

monkey23

monkey23

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 10, 2015
Total posts
507
Chips
0
If you want to look at any specific small blind hands/situations, feel free to post them here.


I just played a hand in the sb against only the button. I had A3 clubs.

The button bet into the blinds as normal...i have 2 choices...call or raise...fold is not an option.

The bb is a nit...and will probably fold...and they did.

How can I maximise my (potential) winnings against the button...?? If i raise, they will 80% fold...so i would win their 2.5 bb pre-bet...but i am a greedy monkey..i want more...so i call.

I get a lucky flop...2 clubs...no face cards. The button might have got lucky with a 30% flop hit...but 70% says they didnt....so i check...and as expected, the button makes a c-bet...i raise with my nut draw...and the button folds....i take down an extra 3 bbs.

I could have easily floated the button's flop bet..maybe i should have..i was probably ahead anyways...and if they also have 2 clubs and a club hits the turn, then o happy day....but if they have 2 clubs also, then they would probably call my raise anyhow...or even reraise me...which could put me in a tricky spot on later streets.

but i am not tooooooo greedy ;)
 
Collin Moshman

Collin Moshman

Poker Expert
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Total posts
1,317
Awards
3
Chips
2
I just played a hand in the sb against only the button. I had A3 clubs.

The button bet into the blinds as normal...i have 2 choices...call or raise...fold is not an option.

The bb is a nit...and will probably fold...and they did.

How can I maximise my (potential) winnings against the button...?? If i raise, they will 80% fold...so i would win their 2.5 bb pre-bet...but i am a greedy monkey..i want more...so i call.

I get a lucky flop...2 clubs...no face cards. The button might have got lucky with a 30% flop hit...but 70% says they didnt....so i check...and as expected, the button makes a c-bet...i raise with my nut draw...and the button folds....i take down an extra 3 bbs.

I could have easily floated the button's flop bet..maybe i should have..i was probably ahead anyways...and if they also have 2 clubs and a club hits the turn, then o happy day....but if they have 2 clubs also, then they would probably call my raise anyhow...or even reraise me...which could put me in a tricky spot on later streets.

but i am not tooooooo greedy ;)

If you think your opponent will fold 80% of the time to a normal sized 3-bet here, that would be a pretty appealing option to me :) Either way though, great work playing your draw aggressively and winning a decent pot here!
 
monkey23

monkey23

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 10, 2015
Total posts
507
Chips
0
If you think your opponent will fold 80% of the time to a normal sized 3-bet here, that would be a pretty appealing option to me :)

you make an excellent point here...yup...why not indeed...it's a good spot...and 3-betting is a profitable play i think...%wise
but if its the 20 % I get called....A + rag doesnt play that well o.o.p. post flop to a 3-bet call imo.

worse..if they actually have a hand..if i get 4-bet...then i probably have to fold and i am just spewing chips.

o.o.p. i prefer to play small pots.
 
Pichman189

Pichman189

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 9, 2020
Total posts
89
Awards
1
Chips
0
If you think your opponent will fold 80% of the time to a normal sized 3-bet here, that would be a pretty appealing option to me :) Either way though, great work playing your draw aggressively and winning a decent pot here!

I've noticed that when I tried to steal from the small blind before, if everyone folds to me, the big blind 4 bets 50% of the time. Is this normal practice?)
 
Katie Dozier

Katie Dozier

Poker Expert
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Total posts
1,331
Awards
2
Chips
0
I've noticed that when I tried to steal from the small blind before, if everyone folds to me, the big blind 4 bets 50% of the time. Is this normal practice?)

That’s going to come down to sample size and won’t hold true in the long run, unless you’re raising only maniacs :)
 
Pichman189

Pichman189

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 9, 2020
Total posts
89
Awards
1
Chips
0
That’s going to come down to sample size and won’t hold true in the long run, unless you’re raising only maniacs :)

If you think your opponent will fold 80% of the time to a normal sized 3-bet here, that would be a pretty appealing option to me :) Either way though, great work playing your draw aggressively and winning a decent pot here!




In principle, against maniacs 9 9 + I can already safely all-in, as a rule they have nothing, I also like to limp 2 aces against maniacs in the small blind, they immediately raise and I all-in) and it is no longer clear who deceived whom)) It's a shame when a maniac makes a mistake with a button and presses the check (
I have to pretend. I made a mistake. my bankroll went up from $ 13 to $ 45 in SNG tournaments $ 0.25 45 max (500 tournaments) and then I thought that I could zoom nl 5) in general, the course really works and SNG 0.25 I seem to beat. And zoom is a very dispersive discipline, I don't know why I went there, I lost my all bankroll.
Now, as a real poker player, I will rise from freerolls) from 0 to 1000 $ the first goal.



By the way, 888 has the same sad story, I won $ 45 in MTT and lost it into a snap cash games. Apparently I wanted variety and I went into the wrong discipline.
Since 2011, according to the schedule, I see that I lost the most money in the cache (including the zoom). And the SNG is less dispersive discipline. Advise how to slowly but surely grow up your bankroll with minimal risk. Freerolls first, then SNGs?
target from 0 to 1000 $. I play cash badly.
What do you think? Need professional advice
 
Collin Moshman

Collin Moshman

Poker Expert
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Total posts
1,317
Awards
3
Chips
2
Freerolls and then SNGs are a good plan. Some advice:

** Try to always have 100 buyins for the sit and go's you're playing

** Focus on making sure you're beating the current level before moving up

** Study a lot and make sure you're seeing clear mistakes your opponents are making that you can capitalize on
 
imnoobpoker

imnoobpoker

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 10, 2017
Total posts
404
Awards
1
Chips
1
The small blind is a very interesting spot. When limping into a game, you know you will have to go first after the flop. This can be an advantage, but also know when to check after the flop.

Thank you for this lesson, will try to limp in more from the small blind into a game. Not a huge fan of raise the big blind after everyone folds. Experienced to many times that the big blind will re-raise again.
 
F

Floki360

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Jan 25, 2021
Total posts
6
Chips
0
Great stuff!

Those hand examples are just awesome. When I think about it, I did so much mistakes in the past.

All in front I like Katie with the agressive betting style and yeah it works 2/3 of the time almost or lets say 60%.

Thank you and I would love to see more lessons like that here at cc.

Regards

Floki360 ( Dirk)
 
Collin Moshman

Collin Moshman

Poker Expert
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Total posts
1,317
Awards
3
Chips
2
Those hand examples are just awesome. When I think about it, I did so much mistakes in the past.

All in front I like Katie with the agressive betting style and yeah it works 2/3 of the time almost or lets say 60%.

Thank you and I would love to see more lessons like that here at cc.

Regards

Floki360 ( Dirk)



Thanks Floki! And I definitely agree about Katie’s aggressive betting style :)
 
Katie Dozier

Katie Dozier

Poker Expert
Silver Level
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Total posts
1,331
Awards
2
Chips
0
Those hand examples are just awesome. When I think about it, I did so much mistakes in the past.

All in front I like Katie with the agressive betting style and yeah it works 2/3 of the time almost or lets say 60%.

Thank you and I would love to see more lessons like that here at cc.

Regards

Floki360 ( Dirk)



That’s awesome Dirk—thanks for sharing! :)
 
xOneCoolHandx

xOneCoolHandx

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
Jul 15, 2015
Total posts
1,803
Awards
20
US
Chips
169
Quiz

1. limp
2. bet
3. bet

GREAT VIDEO. Not a lot of courses really discuss SB play as thoroughly as you did here and explain the reasons behind it...they give you a chart and say "Do this." Great jpb both of you!
 
Collin Moshman

Collin Moshman

Poker Expert
Silver Level
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Total posts
1,317
Awards
3
Chips
2
1. limp
2. bet
3. bet

GREAT VIDEO. Not a lot of courses really discuss SB play as thoroughly as you did here and explain the reasons behind it...they give you a chart and say "Do this." Great jpb both of you!



Thanks xOne, we appreciate that and great progress on the course!
 
barbados

barbados

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
May 23, 2019
Total posts
1,528
Awards
5
BY
Chips
343
In general, a good strategy for playing with a small blind will mainly consist in discarding your cards more often than playing them. If you are going to enter the hand from a small blind position, then you will need a strong enough starting hand so that it can compensate for the fact that you will be playing without a post-flop position. And please - do not save on the nerves of your rivals. Spend them boldly. They're not yours anyway.:cool:
 
mariussica88

mariussica88

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
May 8, 2017
Total posts
1,083
Awards
3
RO
Chips
243
Finished Day 19...11 to go

Usually if I don't have a hand to raise pre-flop in SB I fold, but I will try to call some more and play aggressive post-flop against 1 or max 2 opponents.
 
Oranaro

Oranaro

Rock Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 7, 2022
Total posts
160
Awards
2
Chips
3
I always fold the SB, and raised it to steal the blind, I never really intended to play the limping card there. It's a rare situation when there is no raising going on , and I could even fold AJo on the SB. I'll try to limp more and see how it goes, thank you!
 
Ragonesi

Ragonesi

Rock Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Jan 3, 2022
Total posts
156
Awards
1
Chips
0
I have in the majority of time limped on the small blind against the big bling only or the button regardless of my cards and I can say 90% it worked but I took some bad beats.

With this chapter it made me think about my strategy of range cards to do it with and the momento of the tournament.

Cards Chat is awesome simply...
 
BetterThanAvgButNotByMuch

BetterThanAvgButNotByMuch

Visionary
Bronze Level
Joined
Jan 1, 2022
Total posts
811
Awards
1
Chips
110
Just need to do W2, D 18 to finish the 3rd week.

Week Day 3, Day 19 Small Blind

You act first in every street while in the SB so will out of position every time so you should be careful playing this position.

EBook Tidbits:
"If we face a prior raise, we should play similarly to other positions by tightening up our range relative to hands we would have opened" because you're out of position". Ok.

"Facing Limp(s) in the small blind, complete the small blind with a very wide range". Gotta be careful with this and they give examples of baby straight and flush cards like 43s because you're getting good odds to call so that's ok but you can't play trash hands and you need discipline to get away from hands with bad kickers and need to know when its worthwhile to chase a draw that Collin went over in a previous lesson.

"If everyone folds to you in the small blind, complete most hands you play" No, this is where too many play too many hands they shouldn't play and get into trouble and can't get away from top pair with trash kicker and all sorts of trouble their experience cannot cover and waste too many chips by calling with trash.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Video Tidbits:

The 95 commentating makes zero sense to this old school player and is dead money to me. The small blind is probably the spot where most players have the worst ROI from any position and defending with the hand range they are suggesting is sign that you're not willing to let go of hands. The blinds are part of the community, its not the individual's money although a lot folks think that way. When you think of it as your money then you are setting yourself up for disaster.

This defending a blind with a trash hand like 95 will get 90% of players in trouble and you'll play too many hands that they shouldn't play and you'll be out of position. This stuff DRIVES ME CRAZY. LIMPING with the SB is CRAZY. This might work in the higher levels where you see a flop, bet it and the BB will fold but most folks won't be playing that caliber player and trying to hit 2 pair with a trash hand against a calling station is giving away money that will kill your ROI.

Another reason why Math can be used to justify silly nonsense. Calling with 95 or some trash hand because you're get 3-5 callers is giving money away. And even if you hit the 9 somebody playing A9, 98 will take you out. And do you really want to play a big pot with 95, anyway? This "new" poker makes zero sense to me.

I thought they were kidding then I see them highlighting 10 4 and anything lol the new holdem, lol.

The pair of ducks or small pairs example makes zero sense. At best you're coin flipping with 2 overs or your dominated when you don't need to with how much you have relative to the blinds in your stack and when you look that you're all in and get knocked out amd your response is "I had a pair of 2s or some silly low pair" is crazy. Think about it, take any 5 random cards and lay them out in a row and how many times does a pair of 2s or 3s the best hand? lol Its that simple to think about but people want to nuke this into something else and justify things that make zero sense besides playing an aggressive style that again, will get a lot of folks playing too many hands that don't have experience or discipline to get away from and put them on track to becoming a losing player fast.

The best part of the lesson goes back to a previous lesson where you need a plan to cover what you're going to do before you enter the pot and you have a response already prepared with a reason behind it however your opponent responds.

64o in the SB is an easy FOLD. And putting close to 10% of their stack on that hand is silly. Please no more, lol.LOL.
 
C

Chase

Rock Star
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 10, 2022
Total posts
234
Awards
1
Chips
0
Small blind play - not my cup of tea except in specific circumstances. Great place to donk bet on the flop against weak-tight players. But against strong players it seems a great place to get into trouble very quickly.

So, yes, limping is great if I can. bluffing is good if I can. It all seems to come back to whether I'm playing against recreational players or regs. They both seem to have predictable patterns and catering to those patterns (ref: hand reading and logic lesson) is still the magic sauce.
 
Atararo14

Atararo14

Visionary
Bronze Level
Joined
May 28, 2020
Total posts
711
Awards
5
MA
Chips
262
Finished Day 19

I find this lesson interesting like the previous ones. Thanks Cardschat.

The quiz answers :

1. We have :6d4::4c4: we are small bling and everyone folds before us, I think it's a marginal hand and it's correct to call. At the same time I see that it's not a strong hand to raise.

2. On the flop, we have an open ended straight draw, so it's correct to bet semi-bluff.

3. On the turn, :as4: is a good card in our favor because the big blind doesn't often have A, in addition there is a flush draw, so it's a spot that can scare our opponent and the continuation bet is a good decision.
 
Eduard0Felipe

Eduard0Felipe

Visionary
Bronze Level
Joined
Nov 23, 2022
Total posts
715
Awards
2
BR
Chips
96
Two shots with two ends, heavy shots included, well done, successfully exemplified what was already being said, play draws aggressively as usual, another great lesson, many thanks Collin!


19/30.
 
Gutshot Gus

Gutshot Gus

Visionary
Platinum Level
Joined
Oct 15, 2021
Total posts
735
Awards
4
Chips
629
I usually try to mix it up with the small blind. I don't like limping because then I will have to play out of position.
I prefer to raise and win the big blind right there and aviod the out of position problem. Unless I have a monster hand I want to be in position.
 
S

sumdumguy

Rock Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Jun 6, 2013
Total posts
257
Awards
3
Chips
108
I am satisfied with the course, and in this forum I clarify all doubts without asking, since I am not the only one with those doubts. I am still in the course until the end! Thank you CardsChat.
 
Gh0stL

Gh0stL

Visionary
Platinum Level
Joined
Mar 26, 2016
Total posts
716
Awards
3
PE
Chips
347
Hi, day 19 finished.
Quiz
1. The hero should limp
2. The hero should bet
3. The hero should cbet

Ty.
 
Anamembu

Anamembu

Rock Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 22, 2019
Total posts
227
Awards
3
AR
Chips
166
Day 19 completed, The blinds are certainly unique positions in poker, as they involve a mandatory investment before seeing the cards. It's interesting to know how to make optimal decisions from the small blind, which is essential for maximizing the value of our hands and effectively managing our position. Thank you for the lesson.
 
Top