Building from a baby bankroll

D0nk3y Hunt3r

D0nk3y Hunt3r

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First of all, it's playing according to our bank, we should always keep that in mind when we can't play a $10 tournament if we have a $20 bankroll.
Well, with such bankroll you can actually play two of them :cool:.
The thing is, if, for example, you are involved in some promotions, you can use it for shots immediately. For example, there are daily freebies on ggpoker, you can win, around $1-$3 maybe, you could immediately go to 2NL cash or register to $2 tournament.
 
reeseflamees

reeseflamees

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yes I think you are all right, I ve played various games and not same results
But definitly I wil separe poker MTT from bets
 
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danhewitt1986

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This was the first post I ever read here and how I stumbled across this site. Having read every page and others input as well I decided to join the site. It may have been written years ago but wanted to say thank you to @OzExorcist for the post. Very enlightening to me on the fundamentals of using the small bankroll that I have.
 
azforlife

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Lots of valid points in this one! I'd only add that posting about your wins/losses will also keep you accountable minus the extra pressure you put on yourself! I equate it to running a stream & talking out your thought process, how that actually helps you minus the stress! Overall I agree with the variance delusion most of us run into when we play MTTs when we're no where near being properly rolled for the games so playing cash is actually more sensical than firing up another MTT. Thanks for sharing! I'm sure many will find your post useful!
 
Atararo14

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It's an interesting subject. I think it's better to build a bankroll from small capital or freerolls than to spend your money every time.

I'm not against making a deposit but before doing so, I find it necessary to try with freerolls to understand the management of this money.

The problem I've had before with this is that at first I was motivated and had the patience to build a bankroll from pennies but at some point I felt like earning more and there I lost everything.

The continuity of patience and bankroll management is an essential key to success.
 
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fundiver199

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Still lots of good advice towards the end of this article. I do however disagree slightly with the author about his bullet point "be militant and conservative about BRM". I think, this is a good advice but not until you have moved somewhat up in stakes. The author talk about starting from a very small amount so not being properly bankrolled for the lowest limit and therefore needing to rely on luck. And it does not make a lot of sense to go directly from that situation to being a bankroll nit, while you are still playing the low end of the micros.

If we choose to play cash games, we want to get to 10NL as fast as possible, and this will not happen, if we continue playing 2NL, until we have 250$, which is needed for a 50 BI bankroll for 5NL. In fact we will be spending an eternity at 2NL, and this will slow down our development, because the opponents are absolutely terrible, and we might end up losing motivating and give up. And there is no need to be so conservative. If we are a winning player, we are highly unlikely to ever lose 40-50 BIs at 2NL, so anything above 80-100$ can perfectly reasonably be used for taking shots at 5NL.

Same thing with tournaments. If we choose to play SnGs, we really want to get to 5$ games as fast as possible, and this will not happen, if we stick to 1$ games, until we have 200$, which we need in order to follow the common advice of always having at least 100 BIs for the next level, before we move up. With SnGs a much more reasonable approach is to move up, when we have 100 BIs for the current limit and then back down again, if we drop below that.

As for MTTs I agree with the author about staying away from those, while our bankroll is very small. In my opinion MTTs are not really worth our time, until we are bankrolled for at least 3,3$ games and preferably up to 5,5$ games. Only then is there a reasonable selection of games to choose from, so that we can put together a meaningfull MTT session.

Finally I want to add, that if we have the option to make at least some deposit, then that is almost always a better idea than trying to build up a bankroll from essentially nothing. There are faster ways to earn money than playing 2NL cash or 1$ SnGs. Or for that matter freerolls. So unless we want to play these games for either fun or practice, maybe its better to just pop some more money into the account and move up. If MTTs are our favourite game, its completely reasonable to start with a 500$ deposit, if we have the financial ability to do so.
 
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vitormh

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Great post, building experience and bankroll with freerolls and micro-stakes, and getting more solid play!
 
CollYan

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It's one thing to form a bankroll from CC freerolls at platinum level and PS freerrolls quite another.
 
Rubycon

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Indeed a high class post from the threadmaker. Personally I don’t believe that it is even slightly possible to build solid funds from a baby bankroll. As the saying goes: All you need is a chip and a chair. Sounds good, but it won’t endure a reality check. The only one who actually did it is Annette Obrestad in the early 2000s.
 
Jardel Barros

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I started to build a bankroll with 20 dollars and freeroll tournament prizes
 
Real_KiNdZiUs

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Thanks for this article ! It's really good and I got few ideas for myself why I stopped moving forward with a poker.
 
christovam

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Very interesting, especially the question of luck that we sometimes forget that it participates, to a certain extent, of course.
 
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walrusjulius

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We get a lot of discussion on here around what to do when you're trying to build a bankroll from a small amount. Maybe you've just had a freeroll cash, maybe a friend's been kind enough to transfer you a small amount or maybe you've deposited in the past and you've only got a few bucks left. How do we take that amount and turn it into a real bankroll?

There are tips everywhere including here: Building a Bankroll from Nothing

What I've tried to do below is dump the bulk of my experience on the subject into one post. For those wondering about my credentials, I've been playing for the past couple of years on a roll built from freeroll cashes. I'll warn readers from the outset, I don't have any easy answers or shortcuts. But I think what's written here might be helpful in at least dispelling some of the myths and crazy ideas people have about undertaking this task and hopefully keep them on track while they're attempting it.

THERE IS NO MAGIC BULLET

There's loads of discussion on this point - time after time people have asked "What's the BEST game to play with a bankroll of (insert tiny amount here)?"

The truth is there IS no answer to that question. Everybody's different and we all have different strengths and weaknesses as players. I might have built a roll playing nothing but small stakes limit mixed games. Does that mean it's going to work for you? Dear gawd no! That'd be suicide for most people, since most people don't have the first clue how to play mixed games.

That's an extreme example, I know. It should be obvious to most people that if they suck at mixed games then they shouldn't be putting any of their baby bankroll on a mixed game table.

But there's other advice that sounds more reasonable but can be just as dangerous. How often have we heard, for example, that limit hold 'em is a great way to build a bankroll because it doesn't carry the risk of losing your whole stack in one hand like NLHE does? I know there's more than one lesson in the Full Tilt Academy that suggests it and it sounds perfectly reasonable, but guess what? If you suck at LHE, slowly but surely (and maybe not even that slowly) you're still going to lose your roll.

My point is, there is no magic bullet. There's no one game where everybody who plays it surely but steadily builds a roll. Far and away the best game to play is the one that YOU are best at. That might be LHE, it might be STTs, it might be $2NL 6-max. It doesn't matter. What matters is that YOU play YOUR best game, not someone else's.

I have an exeption to this rule regarding certain games NOT to play, BTW, which I'll discuss in a minute. But for the moment, let's move on to...

PICK A GAME AND STICK TO IT

Once you've settled on your best game, I'm recommending that you stick to it and play nothing else. A lot of people talk about how they played STTs for a little while and had some small wins, then they tried LHE for a while then lost the rest of their bankroll playing HU cash games.

There's a couple of reasons I think you should play just one game. The first is that we want to leverage our skill as best we can. It makes sense that our skill advantage will be biggest when we're playing our best game. The second reason is that we'll learn more when we concentrate on just one game. If we skip from game to game to game we won't be improving much at any of them because we won't be playing them for long enough. If we stick to one game not only are we maximising our skill edge, we're also maximising our chances to get better at the game, increase our skill edge and build our roll.

There'll be time for dabbling in mixed games and learning new things later, after we've built a stable roll.

YOU HAVE TO GET LUCKY

This is the bit that's going to hurt for some people. Even when we stick to just playing our best game, we're STILL going to need to get lucky in order to build our roll. By definition we've probably got less than good BRM dictates we should have to play in the lowest stakes games. If you're starting off with enough for just one buy in obviously you'll need to get very lucky - you'll need to win in the first game you play in and then keep winning in quite a number after that so that you've got some breathing room.

Even if you start off with, say, 10 or more buy ins though you'll still need a bit of luck to avoid a downswing that wipes out your roll. They happen all the time to players with full size rolls and there's nothing that says it can't happen to us either.

What I'm saying is remember that luck plays a part. Pick your best game and play your best. If you still wind up busto, don't dwell on it or let it get you down. Just pick yourself up, start over and hope for a little more luck next time.

FOR CRYING OUT LOUD, STOP PLAYING MTTs!

Here's the bit where I'm going to contradict myself.

If I were to tell you I'd just made $10 from a freeroll and I was going to take it straight to a PLO cash game table to start trying to build a roll from it, how many people would think I was mad?

I think it might be more than a few. A select few of them will have prior knowledge of how much I suck at PLO. But others, even without that knowledge, would likely point out that the variance in PLO can be a killer and I'd be better off playing something with a more stable return. They'd probably be right too.

But here's the thing - a lot of those same people probably wouldn't bat an eyelid if I said I was going to take that $10 and play the Daily Dollar or something with it. Which is a funny thing, because as far as variance goes things don't really get much more swingy than multi-table tournaments. You certainly want a lot more than 20-30 buy ins to be rolled for them.

As discussed above, we already need to get very lucky to build a roll from nothing. We don't need to compound our problems by stacking variance against us - instead, we need to concentrate on games that offer us at least some chance of grinding a slow but steady path upwards. That usually means ring games or single-table SnGs and I'm recommending that, at least for the initial stages, you steer clear of MTTs and the horrible swings they bring. Even if you think they're your best game.

BE MILITANT AND CONSERVATIVE ABOUT BRM

In the beginning we're already going to be playing with bad BRM. There's not a lot we can do about it if we're not even rolled for the lowest stakes other than play our best and hope we run our roll up to a point where we ARE properly rolled for the level we're playing.

For that to happen though we have to be militant about the stakes we play. No playing in some random MTT or forum game or whatever, even as a one-off, unless we're rolled for it. Things like that are luxuries that we'll have later when we've built a stable roll.

We also need to be conservative with our bankroll. Most systems will tell you that if you've got 20-30 buy-ins for a given level you're rolled for it. I'm going to suggest you consider yourself "rolled" for a level when you've got 50 or more, that you don't move up in levels until you've got that much or more for the new level and that you move straight back down if you run bad at the new level. We worked hard to build that roll, we have to protect it as best we can from variance. Don't be ashamed of being a bankroll nit.

DON'T GET HUNG UP ON BONUSES

Free money is a beautiful thing. We all love it, and it's especially attractive when you don't have very much of it to start with.

Free money in the form of bonuses, however, usually comes with strings attached and those strings are almost always having to grind out x amount of frequent player points in real money games. Unlocked right, bonuses can be a fantastic way to pad your earnings and move your bankroll along faster. But done wrong they can send you hurtling backwards.

Take the recent Rush Week promo at Full Tilt. Anybody could participate, and to unlock the bronze level $10 bonus you had to grind out 10 FTPs a day on the Rush tables for seven days straight. Pretty sweet deal, right? Maybe, maybe not. If you're not rolled for the minimum $5NL that you'd need to play to earn the points, or if you're not any good at Rush, then taking this bonus on would be a terrible idea - chances are you'll end up losing more than you stood to win in bonuses and you might jeopardise your whole bankroll in the process.

The same goes for other things people consider doing to unlock other bonuses, like adding more tables than they're comfortable with to run points up faster or playing at higher stakes than they're rolled for. It's a slippery slope, I'm suggesting you just avoid it altogether.

As long as there's competition between online poker sites there'll be bonuses, so there's always another one somewhere around the corner. Stick with the plan, work through the bonuses that you can get safely by just and just playing your normal game at your normal limits and ignore the ones you can't get.

STOP TALKING AND START DOING
(OR "NOBODY ACTUALLY READS YOUR BLOG ANYWAY SO WHY STRESS YOURSELF")


Sometimes I don't know whether to laugh or cry. We've all seen it - someone comes along on a board or starts a blog talking a whole lot about how they're going to build a roll from nothing or how they've got this freeroll cash and they're going to run it up and make loads of money. Some of the dedicated ones even give us day by day or game by game updates for a short period... until the inevitable post where they tell us they're busto either because they played bad, they didn't follow BRM, they had to withdraw all their money for some inane reason or, my personal favourite, the donks ate their bankroll.

Save yourself the time and embarassment by talking less and DOING more. Use the time to actually review your games, rather than telling the world about every single bad beat you ever get. Post actual problem hands for analysis and ask meaningful questions that might help you improve your game, rather than telling everyone about every tiny fluctuation in your bankroll.

You're also putting unnecessary pressure on yourself. Chances are somewhere in the back of your mind there's a though along the lines of "What will I be telling my readers after this session?" and that can have an adverse effect on your game. So stop talking and start doing instead.

That's it, for the moment at least. Run good y'all.
.45 $ from zero by two days
 
apLike

apLike

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I think that the concept of bank/roll management is more suitable for experienced players. Beginners should not bother with too many rules and restrictions. In general, you can start with freerolls.
 
Davider77777

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I was start with zero dollars
Then I played in coin poker free Rolls I won Little bit of dollars...😉💰
Then I'm Play in pokerstars but there i was win only 2 dollars
And then I choose GG poker ...
End there i was Play Day after Day week after week and in one month I won 93$...
for me it's lots of dollars . .
From zero to 93$!!!
You know money do a money 💰💰💰
But one day I was drunk and I don'play rationally like always and I loose everything in roulette,😭😭😭
 
exer888

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Magic bullet :D :D If i only had that one so i can use it in 25k$ high roller. :D
 
luckyfish98

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it is very difficult to do something or win in poker when there is little money, even big and rich professional poker players often lose, but of course you can manage to get a lot of profit from a few dollars
 
ratbat615

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I think 🤔 this is one of the most important post to read for all players . I personally love ❤️ the sit and go one table strategy.
 
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brian0532

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In that moment for me is dificult build a bankroll
 
sidd4rt4

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better play more tourney of 1% of your bankroll than 2 o 3 or all your bankroll
 
Bankroll Building - Bankroll Management
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