Ace RAG issue

[HalifaxLeafs]

I was wondering about the whole Ace RAg issue my self..
because i keep telling myself to be successful i shouldn't play Ace rag ..& definately NOT out of position..i should only play it in blinds or button..& if it doesn't hit the flop i fold it..quick..as i result i watch n see that after i fold it i miss alot of low str8s..so i dont know if im ripping myself off by not calling a postflop bet ..or if im playing sound poker & should keep doing what im doing..its kinda confusing ..any advice /tips?

 

[sketchpad]

its so easy to get away from if you decide to play it...and don't ever think that you folded the low straight, you folded a hand that had a very low chance of winning, unless of course you want to chase all the time for your 2-4 outer.
like you said, play sometimes in position, and of course out-of to mix things up a bit...

so no, no real advice, no real tips...I hate ace rag

 

[Steveg1976]

instead of counting the times you would have made a great winning hand count the times you wouldn't have . It will be a lot more than it wins.

 

[Hynes1986]

ACE RAG SUCKS BALLS


I'll respond just because im also from halifax and a leafs fan.GO LEAFS GO... I don't usually give advice but I know that there is no black and white answer here.. I think you should generally take it game for game or hand for hand... in alot of situations it's tricky to play your A Rag especially if it hits tp or trips if your not careful you could lose some $,

judging from your post I think your playing your cards too much vs playing your opponents "if it doesn't hit the flop i fold it..quick.."
try not to worry about what would have been so much also, just because you would have made a straight or w e doesn't make it a bad laydown.
hope this "advice" was helpful
this is why i never give any hahah

gl

 

[Jillychemung]

As Steve says, go thru your poker hand DB (you do save hand histories and run them thru PokerTracker, PokerOffice, HEM etc. don't you) and look at all of these Ace-rag hands and you'll have all the evidence you need that not playing Ace-rag is a good thing.

 

[ihavea4]

a lot of people do play ace rag, but most of the pros don't recommend it. i will sometimes play suited ace rag but only if it's cheap. if it's offsuit, i generally throw it away. i find that hoping for the ace to hit the flop usually only hurts me because the other guy with the ace has a much higher kicker.

 

[LizzyJ]

Ace-rag senarios:

1) A-rag suited: If I can limp in with all the other fish. I'm going for the flush ONLY. Anything else toss it.
2) A-rag unsuited: Early/middle/late in a tournament....toss
3) A-rag on the bubble AND high blinds/ante's: If I am on the button or cutoff, I shove. You need to steal. Need to be first to the pot. Can't wait for premium or you WILL be blinded out.
4) A-rag heads up(end of the SNG or tourney; super high blinds/antes): Shove.

 

[highway26776]

Throw em i say . From what I have seen the only thing that happens is you win a very small pot or lose a very big one to a bigger ace . Even if you see it for cheap wiith your blinds the best you can hope for is that you flop two more of your rag then your ace is top kicker.

 

[darkremixx]

Yeah, I ussually throw them away unless im on blinds. In ring play, i usually throw them away. in tournament play though, it maybe in your interest to see a cheap flop and then decide.

 

[KDS63]

All good comments, but it seems to me that the response from Hynes1986 has the most important info for the OP. There are no rules that work in all situations -- it always depends on how play has been going at your current table. I play A-rag sometimes but only cheap or if I think I can buy the blinds with a big raise preflop (the risk there, of course is that you might get called, not hit, and have to decide to go with a continuation or check).

 

[HalifaxLeafs]

ok..so Risky @ best..should be folded except certain circumstances when you feel lucky or hit flop...Thanks for the advice...i less thing to cross off my list..

Best of luck 2 every1

 

[PokerVic]

Here's a tip for anyone having trouble throwing away marginal hands preflop.

Everyone looks at the flop after they fold, then groans when they would've hit it big. Well, you also need to look at the action. Since most players play high cards, hitting a ace-rag straight means there's a good chance the other players didn't hit anything. In those situations, you aren't likely to get paid off. If those payoff hands are less likely, your expected value when playing rag hands goes down.

Coming into a pot with JT, on the other hand, has a greater chance to get paid if you hit a straight, as there will likely be someone else in the pot with paired facecards.

Afterall, you don't just want the best hand. You want the best hand when your opponents have strong hands that you can beat.

 

[potman1250]

depends how many people are sitting at the table. less people means your starting hand percentage goes up with ace rags. it becomes a playable hand. otherwise, you just need the discipline to fold hands.

 

[Benjammn]

Ace-rag senarios:

1) A-rag suited: If I can limp in with all the other fish. I'm going for the flush ONLY. Anything else toss it.
2) A-rag unsuited: Early/middle/late in a tournament....toss
3) A-rag on the bubble AND high blinds/ante's: If I am on the button or cutoff, I shove. You need to steal. Need to be first to the pot. Can't wait for premium or you WILL be blinded out.
4) A-rag heads up(end of the SNG or tourney; super high blinds/antes): Shove.

Those look the best to me. I have a hard time wanting to play A-rag just because I have to fold it sooooo often. It's the same as playing JJ almost. It's a hand that's good, but not good enough.

 

[Bengals_Boy]

Im not a big fan of a rag especiall anythin over a 5.It gets you stuck in a hand when the ace comes on the flop.your only hope with it really is to hit two pair on the flop unles there are not any substatial bets.I will limp with it but thats it.If its sooted it is a little bit different in my book but even then u are stating of the hand hoping and chasing somethin.

 

[RedskinRunner325]

instead of counting the times you would have made a great winning hand count the times you wouldn't have . It will be a lot more than it wins.

I think this here is really sound logic. The ones where you hit the straight stick in your mind and make you wonder why you never want to see your Arags through till the end, but all the times you limp and miss that you just forget show you just how rarely this hand will win a pot.

 

[admiral E]

yeah it is really kinda hard to say tough choice i guess. with the kicker and you cant ever tell about the river and 2 pair. some people go all in with any ace. so best hand loses

 

[Poker Orifice]

It really depends upon the situation you are referring to,.. hands have way different values depending upon the circumstances (ie. is it late stage bubble play of a sng and you're sitting on bigstack?... or on bubble of sitngo and you're the shortstack utg? Is it a cash table and you're in LP with 3 limpers, etc. etc. etc.
I think you need to break the question down a bit so that you can get a more accurate answer about how to play a particular hand.
In general,.. yah.. A-rag sucks. If you see someone entering a pot in EP with A-rag, for sure mark it down in notes (this is the kind of donk who is going to call you down light when push comes to shove in later stage sng play for example).
Is it MTT play you're referring to? A limped pot, you're in LP and are wondering if you should call? ... maybe.
Are you in LP and nobody has entered the pot?.... raise.
Still though it depends on too many factors to give a specific answer... ie. above, 'raise in LP if first in'... well.. maybe not if it's early levels of an mtt cuz then the blinds aren't worth it.
It's kind of situational... what's going on, who's in the hand, etc. etc.
Generally though it sucks cuz as you know, if your A hits the flop and you lead out and get called... what do you do on the turn? Is he calling you with mid pr... or what is he calling you with? Are you way behind right now or ahead?... who knows.... probably behind but maybe not.
If in doubt... dump it. I rarely play A-rag unless situation warrants it.. .ie. it's later stage of a sng or MTT. OR.. if it's suited and stacks are deep enough I'll perhaps call in LP or will call behind other limpers. I hate opening with a limp but depending on table, it might be the right thing to do.
Good advice above about, "don't think about the times you would've won with it had you played the hand,... think more along the lines of all the times you will lose with it." I was in a live tourney on weekend, avg. stack size on table was only 6bb's (yah.. it was a donkfest), EP limper, I have K-rag suited in SB (an easy laydown.. or maybe shove...but not on this table, they're limping AQ+). I contemplate calling (BB is an aggressive flop player). I fold,.. not wanting to shove (oh yah.. I have around 5bb..why am I so short?.. the entire table is, blinds have gone up exponentially). Flop comes K-K-A,.. groan.. of course EP had limped A-rag and BB got to see the flop for free with an A-rag also. They bet pot & call.. back & forth, split pot on river,.. sigh... I would've stacked them both. BUT... how many times would I have just been spewing off what little fold equity I may have had left?.. most of the time for sure.

 

[Tom1559]

I tend to stay away from A rag unless I am the SB. I rarely play it when I am on the button unless I have a lot more chips than the SB and BB. Chasing a straight after the flop can be costly and it is likely to happen a lot less times than you need to justify playing it. The problem with playing A rag is that if you do hit on the flop the BB might also have an A with a higher rag. If you do play it from the button or BB you must be aggresive.

 

[Behrens900]

Ace rag is garbage, and the only time I even consider playing Ax is when its suited and the pot is multi way or Im in a good position. It's easy to fold, although there are people who raise with Ax all the time and I swear it seems like they always win. :\

 

[pokermatch]

Let me give you some good advice. Ace Rags are horrriblleee. I wouldnt
even play them on the blinds!!! The reason for this is because there are
sooo many hands people will call that can beat you badddlly. Ace Rags are
probably the hands that cost most amateurs the biggest portion of their
roll. Think about it, Any kicker with an ace has the potential to eat you
alive, so you will be shivering for your life when you catch that ace, you
can never be certain if your a strong winner or a dead meat loser.

 

[deumsac]

I got Ace 4 (aka ace rag) suited two hands in a row last night. The first time, I was like "I read that ace rag is actually very weak, even when suited, and should be played only for the flush." The blinds were high, as this was a turbo freeroll. I folded, and the flop was A69, and the 6 and 9 were spades. So I was like darn. A guy bet big, and another guy folded to end the hand. Anyways, then next hand I was like "why not, let's play this hand!" I hit nothing, and called a minimum raise.

What is the probability of hitting two of the same suit to go with your two suited cards on the flop? How about getting a flush through the showdown (all 5 cards?) I've wondered about that; a friend told me it was about 8 percent for the latter question.

This is the second time I've seen advice saying that "think about the many times you lose with it, instead of the few times you win with it" (variation by pokerorifice above ) Maybe I should just start throwing them away. Is A8 Ace rag? I don't think A10 is, is it?

 

[pokertoi]

Usually I would dump ace rag depending on how many is in the pot. If there's one or two, i'd try to hit on the flop. If someone raises i might fold depending on my chip size, if i have more chips then i'd probably push to get them all in and hope they fold.

 

[phatmatt840]

Usually I would dump ace rag depending on how many is in the pot. If there's one or two, i'd try to hit on the flop. If someone raises i might fold depending on my chip size, if i have more chips then i'd probably push to get them all in and hope they fold.

I would take a similar approach, yet when the ace is suited it looks so pretty. I know that suited only raises the hand like 3%, just have a lack in discipline some times

 

[deumsac]

I would take a similar approach, yet when the ace is suited it looks so pretty. I know that suited only raises the hand like 3%, just have a lack in discipline some times

Yes I have that problem too; it looks much more pretty than it really is. I put that into a poker odds calculator with A2 diamonds and AA of the other two suits (pre-flop), and I was surprised at the 5.67% ish chance for A2 to win