Reaction Clonie Gowen's FTP law suit

[SavagePenguin]

I don't see how anybody with any business sense could possibly offer her a 1% stake in Full Tilt? I mean, she's an OK player (Zero wsop final tables; her best finish being 15/766 in this years $1,000 rebuy. No WPT final tables either.) who has the temporary attribute of being pretty.

Even if she wasn't paid cash, didn't Full Tilt has put millions into her entry fees? But her value is due to her looks/image (depreciating assets) *not* her skill. She's not a good long term investment. Nissan doesn't offer 1% of their company (an appreciating asset) to a showroom model, even if she does know a lot about cars.

 

[Crystal Blue]

I don't see how anybody with any business sense could possibly offer her a 1% stake in Full Tilt? I mean, she's an OK player (Zero WSOP final tables; her best finish being 15/766 in this years $1,000 rebuy. No WPT final tables either.) who has the temporary attribute of being pretty.

Even if she wasn't paid cash, didn't Full Tilt has put millions into her entry fees? But her value is due to her looks/image (depreciating assets) *not* her skill. She's not a good long term investment. Nissan doesn't offer 1% of their company (an appreciating asset) to a showroom model, even if she does know a lot about cars.

Don't forget, this apparent agreement was made in 2004 ( 4 years ago ) when things were really starting to take off.
Moneymaker won the ME in 2003, and Raymer took it down in 2004 and there was an enormous amount of activity going on with the big poker sites as a result of it.

Also, it could be argued FTP had no idea what kind of future results Clonie Gowen would ever post for the next 4 years. They were buying into what they perceived at that point in time and what they hoped for in the future.

There is nothing to say that Tiffany Michelle wont run bad for UB over the course of the next 4 years and have nothing much in the way of big results. As with Clonie and FTP even though it was 4 years ago, UB are buying into Tiffany based on the here and now, what happens further down the road can be very different.

 

[TiltMonkey999]

Thats unbelievable..You know..Stuff on the internet gets stirred around lately and there's really no way you can tell whats really going on..I'm going to wait and see how everything turns out..Wow..Offered 1%..that could present some bad publicity..But anyways shes not part of the FT Team anymore..has anybody noticed the rumor about David Benyamine..I have seen this new player MrB2USon on the pro tables and I have reason to believe that is David Benyamine on a new account..He is not in red bold so does that mean hes not a PRO?? Any input would be awesome..GREAT POST Take Care
Ray

 

[DrumDemon]

There is nothing to say that Tiffany Michelle wont run bad for Ultimatebet over the course of the next 4 years and have nothing much in the way of big results. As with Clonie and FTP even though it was 4 years ago, UB are buying into Tiffany based on the here and now, what happens further down the road can be very different.

That's true. Wasn't Dutch Boyd backed by UB at one point? I seem to remember seeing a UB pokerchip tattoo (or temporary one) on his hand when he beat Hachem for a bracelet.

 

[Genso Hikki]

Well how else would you describe someone who sues claiming they held part ownership in a company and had absolutely no proof? Crazy and idiot seem to be pretty accurate. Either she's a crazy idiot for failing to get it in writing and assuming others would believe her or she's a crazy idiot for making up the story to get publicity and/or money.

I would say something like it was an unfortunate situation, I believed the facts would bear out Full Tilt's position, and when the truth came out it would reflect badly on Clonie. But again, that's just me.

 

[jedimoose]

Even if you dont agree with what Negreanu said, you have to admit its refreshing to get a real answer to a hard question. Maybe with all the political stuff lately these "tell the people what they want to hear" answers have finally gotten to me. Nice to see someone not afraid to give an opinion and not give the typical "we'll see how it ends up" response. Kudos to Daniel for not being afraid to speak out enen when maybe he shouldnt have. Seems like a real bad move for Gowen here, no matter what she was owed. Pretty stong/respected list of players in the lawsuit filed, and none of them are hurting for $. If Clonies right she desrves something, but if Tilt is right i hope they just dont pay her to go away.

 

[SchlomoSmack]

There is no way they offered her 1% of the company and secondly, poker players are pretty damn smart if you ask me, atleast professional ones are(hehe) so why doesn't she have something in writting? If this is a 4 billion dolllar company as she says, then why did she do a deal on a handshake and apromise with them? It just doesn't make sense and it doesn't add up. Daniel Negraneu is right. This chick is crazy, and too bad. It's funny because daniel said she's gone ding bat crazy and that's she's acting like a nutsy ex-girlfriend. Well one of my ex girlfriends looks like clonie and I swear to god, she is ding bat crazy and had that nutsy ex-girlfriend Im not letting go-I'll throw eggs at your car kinda way. Haha it all adds up now.

Whatever. You'll see Clonie sporting a reefer poker hat soon. Hehe.

 

[ChipSnake]

Clonie Gowen's Lawsuit

Gowen's lawsuit may have merit as verbal contracts being binding and all, but the amount she is asking for is rediculous. I think she needs to get real about how much money she would have been paid in endorsements over the years because it probably wouldn't amount to 40 mill. Lawyers and how they have to be paid through the proceeds of a lawsuit make this whole case bad for poker. Both sides should be forced into a binding mediation court!

 

[Dorkus Malorkus]

Gowen's lawsuit may have merit as verbal contracts being binding and all, but the amount she is asking for is rediculous. I think she needs to get real about how much money she would have been paid in endorsements over the years because it probably wouldn't amount to 40 mill. Lawyers and how they have to be paid through the proceeds of a lawsuit make this whole case bad for poker. Both sides should be forced into a binding mediation court!

Eh, the $40mil has nothing to do with endorsements and suchlike - it's based on FTP being valued at $4billion and hence her being owed 1% of that. It's still a laughably high figure imo, but for different reasons.

I agree this is potentially horrible for poker though.

 

[mig2169]

U have to remember that all these pros are new to all this outside money they are getting. So who knows what went down with kid poker and fulltilt.

 

[cAPSLOCK]

I just want to see the poker after dark coming up with Gowen, Lederer, Juanda, Negreanu et all. THAT is gonna be a STEAMBOAT week.

They could call it the Full Tilt Feud show...

 

[itlegacy]

Any way this is resolved, doubt I'd even be interested in part ownership until the internet gaming is resolved ... waste of money and effort in the current economy. All this does not bode well for those valient efforts.

 

[zachvac]

Any way this is resolved, doubt I'd even be interested in part ownership until the internet gaming is resolved ... waste of money and effort in the current economy. All this does not bode well for those valient efforts.

Or you could just get it in writing.

 

[Genso Hikki]

Or you could just get it in writing.

There's so little REAL information coming out about this - but one thing I'd like know is what kinds of written contracts the other Pros on Team Full Tilt have. As much as I've said I don't like the name-calling, it seems to me that when/if the other players produce written contracts outlining the terms of their compensation and all she has is a claim of a verbal promise - well - it won't end well for her.

 

[Makwa]

Sidebar -- whos the ex? John Juanda? Ferguson? Lederer? Hmmm.. I would guess Ferguson.

 

[ythelongface]

i too doubt she was promised 1% of the company, but as a strategy, its not a bad idea to do what she appears to be doing. say she was owed 2 million for example. she can claim it was 1% and start an internet campaign so to speak, full tilt doesnt wanna have this drag on and on, so they settle for something closer to reality than the 1% but enough to shut her up. of course its likely im completely wrong and will be made out to be so, but its a thought.

 

[kknutt17]

I hadn't heard anything about this, thank you for the news flash. . .she's such a pretty woman to be getting into this kind of drama. . .fact is unless something is written in a contract, you can not expect that anyone is going to follow through down the road. . .especially if it is going to cost them precious money.

 

[zachvac]

There's so little REAL information coming out about this - but one thing I'd like know is what kinds of written contracts the other Pros on Team Full Tilt have. As much as I've said I don't like the name-calling, it seems to me that when/if the other players produce written contracts outlining the terms of their compensation and all she has is a claim of a verbal promise - well - it won't end well for her.

Agreed.

 

[DertyJerz1014]

I love what Danny wrote about her, and i agree there is no way she was offered 1% of the company... i think shes like every other lawsuit happy people just tryin to make a quick buck...

 

[phatjose]

A couple of things about this strike me as very interesting. First, I find it hard to believe that Full Tilt would enter into any sort of agreement with a professional player of any kind without a written contract, signed in triplicate and notarized. You don't grow to be a $4 billion company making mistakes like she is alleging.

However, the very serious problem for Full Tilt is that if Clonie can come up with an objective, third party witness to the verbal contract, then they are on the hook for the 1% (although they would most likely settle out of court since it would be cheaper for both parties). It will also matter who the verbal contract was with. Meaning, a verbal contract with the CEO is going to matter, whereas a verbal contract made with some peon is going to get dismissed fairly rapidly.

Having very little actual information to go on however, I think we can assume that she has at least some proof to back up her claim since she went through with the lawsuit. There's also the possibility that Full Tilt countersues if(when) it turns out she has no hard evidence. Of course, my thoughts on the matter are based on US law, not international law, which may turn out to drastically alter the proceedings.

 

[Halibel]

Cycalona?... lulz... anyways, if she appears in court looking like a zombie from that picture, I'd have my money on her.

But all that other stuff justs looks like legal gibberish... boring.

 

[Sasskesse]

A verbal contract is not worth the paper it is written on.

If she doesn't have a written contract for 1% ownership, the best she can hope for is some settlement and she will be ostrasized by the pros.

If she does have 1%, then she should win and it should not be held against her by her collegues, although who knows.

But I think I would be interested in taking that bet with Daniel for 1K vs 1M. I think I would have +EV that she will win something. Daniel, where do I signup? Or is that verbal too?

 

[verticalmonk]

...

this comes as the initial shock but becomes more clear when daniel addresses it on his forum...she is just playing a big bluff on her way out the door...

 

[Sasskesse]

this comes as the initial shock but becomes more clear when daniel addresses it on his forum...she is just playing a big bluff on her way out the door...

If that's the case, then they should give her a few mills assuming she agrees on a televised bare butt spanking. Talk about TV ratings!

 

[young hova]

She should also sue her parents for naming her Cycalona.

lmao, word