Legal US online poker?

[K_Kahne_Fan]

This was just a thought I had while in Vegas, what if there was a casino network in which you could purchase online $$ while you're in their casino, then you can play from home; would/could this be a way of allowing legal online gambling? I thought about this while I was @ the Nugget in Vegas. I thought it would be nice if I could "deposit" $xxx with them and then be able to use it on their web site. Then, if multiple casinos were to get together as a joint site, there could end up being quiet a few players. This could be done similar to how they offer gift cards right now, or it could be placed on the players cards most casinos use right now. As it is now, if you make a bet while @ the casino, they can mail you your winnings (correct me if I'm wrong), so I would imagine they could do the same with this. Or they could require withdraws in person, however, they probably wouldn't get as many players.

I titled this with poker, but it could be used on a site similar to bodog with the capability of sports bets, poker and casino.

 

[bazerk]

Iowa must be on your wavelength

http://www.casinoaffiliateprograms.com/news/iowa-s-plan-to-legalize-online-gambling.php

And it may be part of Harrah's long-term vision & business plan (dependent on what Congress does with The Bipartisan Tax Fairness and Simplification Act of 2010)

http://www.onlinecasinoreports.com/...4/26/harrahs-prepares-for-online-gambling.php

Implementing a casino network system, as suggested, is dependent on online gambling being allowed (not the other way around )...

 

[blackmax]

Sounds wonderful but i suppose they would find a way to kill that ideal also.We were just posting about this in another thread and 1 of the other members informed me thats it's about the revenue.Thats why the us is putting the squeeze on online gaming because they can't regulate it they way they want.They will try to dubble and triple the taxes on a casino that offers a home gambling program just to insure thier revenue...otherwise i would assume that casino's would have cashed in on that ideal years ago.

 

[xXSmuggla]

That is a great idea if the U.S would actually allow it. I agree with blackmax about how the US doesnt want online gambling because they cant regulate. They also can't tax it, meaning they cant get their greedy hands on it. If Harrahs tried to implement this, it would have to be only if the Bipartisan Tax Fairness and Simplification Act of 2010 changes. Until then, I guess im a criminal for playing online :thefinger

 

[matt0216]

Seems like a good idea. I would love if it if actually happened. WIth that being said It will probably never happen

 

[Vfranks]

They talk about that, but they were talking about State to State poker rooms..or at leats in Florida IIRC and then there will be no players, they say.. So everyone will still play FTP and STARS from the USA, exactly as it has been...unregulated, untaxed, all the while breaking the agreement of free trade or whatever, leaving the WTO mad, and Citizens will forever have payment processor issues....GET WITH THE REST OF THE WORLD PLEASE USA!
And when they ask my state...would you like to opt in(if it even gets that far)....The good ol' Commonwealth of Virginia will say, " WE OPT OUT,"(errr)....whispering to themselves....we make enough money charging people with possession of marijuana(under 1 gram mind you, even just an old baggy with residue in it gets you a 5 night trip to county, 1 year probation, which you have to pay to be on ,drug classes..which u have to pay for...random screens..also $$$...oh and you lose you license for 6month's(even if you got arrested walking down the street and don't have a license or own a car), which then cost's money to re-instate, or if ur one who doesn't have a license., than one day when u get one it will be suspended for the first 6months, than u can reinstate it and pay again...LOL..this is all first offense, second gets you double everything...)... send em to jail(which are owned by the same judge that put u there) ...I don't condone drug use, I am against it....but come on. really? Now they do the same thing for DUI's, which I totally agree is fair, cuz that's operating a motor vehicle while F'ed up, and they give Child Molesters and Murders less time than they do drug dealers in my state...why?..... but states like Colorado(where u get a simple ticket for possesion up to 1 ounce of marijuana(IIRC), which is then prepayable...u don't even have to go to court, and is a lesser offense than speding in a car..is more likely to see poker.(I think)
So I am starting to think I will never see LEGAL online poker, especially in my home state. Please someone tell me I am wrong, tell me I will play online legally?...because I haven't really read up on any of it for a while. AND I am no expert.

Sorry for rambling and if I broke any rules with my examples..a mod can delete my post I guess.

 

[GiantBuddha]

Regardless of what the DOJ may claim, there are no federal laws on the books making online poker illegal, ergo, it's legal unless you live in a state with a specific law to the contrary. I wrote an article on this last year: http://www.thearchjournal.com/home/2009/3/6/the-odds-on-online-poker.html

It's not comprehensive, but it covers most of the basics. That said, being legal and being legalized are not the same thing. I think it would be great to have expressly legalized and regulated online poker. Then there would be someone to hold the sites and players accountable. Right now, there are few to no repercussions for cheaters. OP's suggestion looks interesting at the very least. Whether or not it's viable, I have no idea.

 

[Vfranks]

Yeah I meant regulation of poker in the USA. As of now, what would you do If FTP or Stars just up and disappeared with all yo money?(not likely to happen, just an example) Is there anything a US citizen could do?

I started writing a paper for an English class, but then decided to change topics...I think I started a post I never got back to, where I was asking about it..oops

 

[dd_decker]

That is a great idea if the U.S would actually allow it. I agree with blackmax about how the US doesnt want online gambling because they cant regulate. They also can't tax it, meaning they cant get their greedy hands on it. If Harrahs tried to implement this, it would have to be only if the Bipartisan Tax Fairness and Simplification Act of 2010 changes. Until then, I guess im a criminal for playing online :thefinger

You are not a criminal. It's not illegal to play online poker. Under the current law, it is illegal for banks to fund it, and it is illegal for a site to offer online gambling, but it's not illegal to actually play.

 

[bigdog111]

legal or not I will continue to play as most will lets face it we've been skirting the law for some time now with this game we've come to love, The bad is that all for the sake of being legal we will be taxed till our eyeballs pop out and how many of us will try anything they can to avoid that? if I know poker players, they will find a way, so get ready folks, TAXMANS comming!!!

 

[PasoTex]

You are not a criminal. It's not illegal to play online poker. Under the current law, it is illegal for banks to fund it, and it is illegal for a site to offer online gambling, but it's not illegal to actually play.

That's not necessarily true. Whether it's legal or not depends on the law of the jurisdiction the player is in. Since gambling is legal in Nevada, players in that state are not breaking any laws. However, if playing poker in a raked game is illegal under the laws of another state, the other state could prosecute those players. It's unlikely that will happen, but it could.

 

[Vfranks]

You are correct PasoTex...but one of the arguments is that you are not gambling in that state if online...you are gambling on internet space located outta the USA...or are u? that's a debate all in itself I guess?

 

[PasoTex]

That's a reasonable argument to make, Vfranks, but as a lawyer I know that a state prosecutor would not look at it that way. The position he or she would take is that if a poker player is physically located in a state while playing online, that poker player would be subject to the laws of the state in which he is located, even if the poker game were being conducted in cyberspace by a card room like pokerstars that's not even physically located in the U.S.

 

[dj11]

That's a reasonable argument to make, Vfranks, but as a lawyer I know that a state prosecutor would not look at it that way. The position he or she would take is that if a poker player is physically located in a state while playing online, that poker player would be subject to the laws of the state in which he is located, even if the poker game were being conducted in cyberspace by a card room like PokerStars that's not even physically located in the U.S.

Now add in some conspiracy thinking and that state would more than likely have some ammo against the Service Provider. The ISP's know this and probably have some method for preventing many from ever even seeing the poker sites.

Somehow, the Indians (original N.Americans) have got into the biz. In California, they claim the complete and total right to run any new casino gaming (many existing sites were grandfathered in). I believe several other states suffer the same situation. It is unclear how this affects the eventual online gaming regulation.

A slight deviation from the original post is what is preventing any entrepenuar from opening deposit stores in bigger cities that take deposits only for the overseas online poker sites? It would be essentially a specific thing not unlike Moneygrams.

 

[dd_decker]

It doesnt matter to US poker addicts, but there are sites out there that are supposed to be totally legal, like NLOP and Spade Club. No cash games....Are these subscription sites actually legal in all States?

 

[PasoTex]

Spade Club has probably reviewed the legal issues carefully and concluded that it's subscription service is legal. I haven't researched the issue myself, but I can see that the legal issues for Spade Club are less problematic than for an online card room like PokerStars, FullTilt, Doyle's Room, etc., because those online card rooms are running games with a rake.

 

[Kasanova King]

It doesnt matter to us poker addicts, but there are sites out there that are supposed to be totally legal, like NLOP and Spade Club. No cash games....Are these subscription sites actually legal in all States?

Yes because they call themselves "clubs" and essentially award prizes similar to the way a sweepstakes does.

Spade Club has probably reviewed the legal issues carefully and concluded that it's subscription service is legal. I haven't researched the issue myself, but I can see that the legal issues for Spade Club are less problematic than for an online card room like PokerStars, FullTilt, Doyle's Room, etc., because those online card rooms are running games with a rake.

^^^^^Also this.

On another note, PasoTex, in your legal opinion, now that it is about 99% certain that UIGEA will NOT be extended after June 1, 2010 - how do you feel this will affect the current status of online poker in the U.S.?

After June 1, banks will be forced to abide by the UIGEA regulations and although UIGEA technically does not forbid online poker players depositing checks, it will prevent players from making deposits to online poker sites. Now I believe that after June 1 most banks will not, nor would they care to, make any distinction, therefore many of them could essentially forbid players from even depositing checks into their bank accounts.

Do you think it would be a good idea to start developing a good relationship now with a bank other than your main bank - basically have a poker only account?