Folded when they could have checked....??

[fletchdad]

I have encountered this a number of times. I guess it is just a sign of the FISH, but wtf? A number of times, players either on the BB or anywhere post flop and being checked to, as last player sometimes too, I have seen players folding when they could have seen another card. It is a concept I dont understand. I have occasionaly hit the fold button on mistake, but there is always a warning system asking if I am sure I want to fold and not check. Even if I know I am beat 100% I dont fold if I dont have to, so can anyone explain what this means (other than complete idiocy)?

 

[thepokerkid123]

I have encountered this a number of times. I guess it is just a sign of the FISH, but wtf? A number of times, players either on the BB or anywhere post flop and being checked to, as last player sometimes too, I have seen players folding when they could have seen another card. It is a concept I dont understand. I have occasionaly hit the fold button on mistake, but there is always a warning system asking if I am sure I want to fold and not check. Even if I know I am beat 100% I dont fold if I dont have to, so can anyone explain what this means ... complete idiocy)?

I figured I could save time on my response by just bolding bits of your post. Enjoy.

 

[swingro]

That is a sign of a beginner who just learned the rules of the game. He is not a player he just learned how to play the game and has not learned even the rank of hands.

 

[Effexor]

They didn't want to show their hand. Typically this happens with a failed bluff.

 

[IcyBlueAce]

They didn't want to show their hand. Typically this happens with a failed bluff.

This isn't the case he is talking about, reread the post.

I see this happen pretty often, a lot in live games too.

 

[DaveE]

I've seen that a few times too. Maybe some kind of self-discipline exercise "don't play any starting hands outside of this range ever, no matter what" kind of thing?

Or a poorly programmed bot, lol

 

[Grossberger]

I typically see this when a player calls a pretty sizable raise hoping to hit an absolute miracle such as holding 24 34 35 25 or hands like that when the flop comes 9 J Q they pretty much whiffed the flop and dont want to show the hand they called a raise with.

 

[Pascal-lf]

How do you typically see that when they've folded?

 

[Weregoat]

I limp with 3s4s, the flop comes AJT all hearts.

Bye hand. Unless I catch the perfect combination of two cards (3d3c or 4d4c) you could be up against a better hand anyway.

And then I check the flop, check the turn, get their, and now I end up putting more money into a pot where I'm only ahead of a hand that didn't flop a flush, a set, or a straight.

Easy enough to save the money now.

Some flops are just brutal for hands like that. Also, low PP, but I'd hold onto those for free for chances of making a set and hoping they evolve into a full house.

 

[fletchdad]

I limp with 3s4s, the flop comes AJT all hearts.

Bye hand. Unless I catch the perfect combination of two cards (3d3c or 4d4c) you could be up against a better hand anyway.

And then I check the flop, check the turn, get their, and now I end up putting more money into a pot where I'm only ahead of a hand that didn't flop a flush, a set, or a straight.

Easy enough to save the money now.

Some flops are just brutal for hands like that. Also, low PP, but I'd hold onto those for free for chances of making a set and hoping they evolve into a full house.

yea but checking instead of folding when possible should always be an option, should it not?
You know u r underdog so dont call any bets, hence no putting more money in the pot. And if, for example, the flop comes down 3hearts, and another one on river, someone will be betting 95% of the time anyway, so throw the hand away, it was free anyway, and if u do hit a set, then u still have the chance to bet against those players that are still checking when u KNOW they would bet if the were hearted in the pocket, for example. What I mean is, when u r checked to, folding is still an option even if u check. It sounds like u r saying "get out of harms way" but isnt that option always open?

Upon re-reading, you may have been responding to the post 2 above yours? In that case just ignore my senseless ramblings.......
Cents-less as well

 

[thepokerkid123]

I limp with 3s4s, the flop comes AJT all hearts.

1: Fold pre-flop.
2: If you do somehow get to the flop, check-fold.

Runner-runner trips, maybe just a random 3 or 4 will beat a Kx or Qx.
4 high doesn't have much value but it has some value which is better than none.

By staying in the hand you risk spewing chips by calling a bet when you catch a pair or bluffing in a bad spot. Whilst you should only be putting those extra chips in when it's proffitable, you could simply make a conscious decision not to put any more chips in and immediately show a proffit over folding.

 

[Weregoat]

1: Fold pre-flop.
Depending on my villain's stack(s), I don't always throw this hand away. I recently won a $700 pot with 24o because the other two in the hand were stacked deep and my hand was hidden. CO raises to $15 pre, SB calls, I call. Flop comes Q72, SB bets $25, I call, CO calls. Turn comes 4, SB bets $100, I raise all-in for the rest of my $300 stack, CO folds, SB calls, fails to improve his AQ (CO had AQ too.) Perhaps over the long run it's -EV to put $15 in with 24o PRE, and another $25 in with only bottom pair no kicker, but when I improve to two pair and my calling range isn't expected to have a 2 or a 4 in it, I get some value added by playing sneaky cards.
2: If you do somehow get to the flop, check-fold.
Agreed entirely. Depending on the flop I may as well just fold. For instance I have 76s the same flop comes out and I'm not hearts. Easy fold.
Runner-runner trips, maybe just a random 3 or 4 will beat a Kx or Qx.
4 high doesn't have much value but it has some value which is better than none.
Again, I sometimes play these hands (in cash games only) for their hidden value. If I whiff and can get away for cheap, that's fine. Against a deep stack I like to play a lot of hands and hope to outdraw them. When done with caution it can pay off.
By staying in the hand you risk spewing chips by calling a bet when you catch a pair or bluffing in a bad spot. Whilst you should only be putting those extra chips in when it's proffitable, you could simply make a conscious decision not to put any more chips in and immediately show a proffit over folding.

There we go. Defended a few of my decisions with some bold text.

Just because I have a wide range to call a raise against a deepstack doesn't mean I'll be calling with hands like Q3 or K5o.

 

[Poof]

I occassionally do this if I am in the BB and the flop comes and I know for a fact no matter what the turn or river are, it is not going to help.

 

[Goodwooter]

i do it in ring games from time to time...if i had an awful hand and i am the bb...gives me an opportunity to just fold giving me time to load a bowl or grab a beer!!!

cheers and gl
wooter

 

[fletchdad]

i do it in ring games from time to time...if i had an awful hand and i am the bb...gives me an opportunity to just fold giving me time to load a bowl or grab a beer!!!

cheers and gl
wooter

Well If u gotta have a reason, those are good ones.....

 

[Ice Wolf]

Ill do it typically on the river when Im in the BB and Ive got like 2 3 and theres a bunch of random junk on the board but I still have whats on the board.

 

[BM0529]

I never do it at all...and be very wary about doing this in live casino games as there are some places which will void the bad beat if somebody checks out of a hand...its basically just another dumb reason for them to not pay it out like someone having a rack on the table (where I play the rack has to be leaning on the rail halfway or the bad beat can be voided)

 

[Grossberger]

How do you typically see that when they've folded?

Didn't realize had to go into details. Well when a player mucks when they could have checked gets asked why did you fold you could have checked they usually say something like I couldn't have missed that flop any more than I did.

 

[PokerVic]

I occassionally do this if I am in the BB and the flop comes and I know for a fact no matter what the turn or river are, it is not going to help.

Bingo. I'll usually "fold when I could've checked" in early rounds of an MTT when I'm on the BB and see a flop with some trash. Since I'm usually multi-tabling, and I know I'm putting zero $ into the pot, I'll just fold to keep that window from popping up every street. This is especially necessary at very passive tables, where players are calling every bet, and slowplaying hands as weak as middle pair.

If people doing this bothers you, you're probably slow-playing too much. Just bet your hand, and we can all move on.

 

[swingro]

Bingo. I'll usually "fold when I could've checked" in early rounds of an MTT when I'm on the BB and see a flop with some trash. Since I'm usually multi-tabling, and I know I'm putting zero $ into the pot, I'll just fold to keep that window from popping up every street. This is especially necessary at very passive tables, where players are calling every bet, and slowplaying hands as weak as middle pair.

If people doing this bothers you, you're probably slow-playing too much. Just bet your hand, and we can all move on.

At microstakes they fold after the flop or turn cose they are stupid not cose thay are multitabling. I see this a lot. Players that raise 20 blinds with 44 and after they miss the flop raise 2 cents. Same players fold after the flop . Same players go all in with 8 10 cose they saw two other players go all in in front of them. Same players raise 5 blinds out of position with 78 suited and go all in if someone challenge them.

 

[Divebitch]

They didn't want to show their hand. Typically this happens with a failed bluff.

+1 However, there is no reason to fold after the flop. I'd only fold at the last chance to do so if no raise. Of course, there is no reason to fold an unraised pot if you're in the blinds, no matter how crappy the hand. Showing would only lend to tighten your image as a non-bluffer.

This isn't the case he is talking about, reread the post.

If I read Effexor correctly, he means a failed bluff on a previous round of betting. Not sure what you think he misread. I read it twice too, and his post makes sense to me. At any rate, this is especially common in stud, where there is an extra street of betting, and you don't see 5 cards after the 1st bet. Also, all the up cards will better tell you your chances to improve, even by 5th street. But in NLHE, the pre-& post-flop betting does all the talking, tells you everything you need to know.

 

[peacebrother]

better to fold than see any more cards that will just cost you money. I do this live more than on line. ck fold button is my friend lol

 

[fletchdad]

I will just never fold if I can check..... if I have 2s 7c and by the river AKQJTh, and all check to me - lol - (ok i bet here but I think I make my point)

 

[belerophon]

It's very rare for me but occasionally I'll know my opponent (I have a few that are now in the 4digit range of info on PT3). While I'll never say no to a free card if we are at the rvr and I know a bet is coming I may not give them the satisfaction of betting. Just hoping to get inside their head a little bit.

 

[Vfranks]

I have done this on accident at stars, even though the pop up asks if I am sure I have accadentally hit yes by accadent. I think for me it is because I play mostly at full tilt, where u do not have this option, so the few times I have played at stars I end up folding my BB by accident or at least almost folding it every time.

Maybe also the player doesn't want to get caught up with a hand he normally wouldn't play? I found out I was losing more from the blinds than I should be, and it was due to the fact when I flop 2 pair or more from the BB for free and end up stacking myself to TPTK hitting 2pair on turn/river and losing 100bb's with a hand I shouldn't be in the pot with anyway.
Also it could just be fish or newish players uncomfortable playing OOP so they just stay away from it?