The importance of finishing first

ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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Just a quickie here about the importance of finishing first.

I was playing a couple $16 turbos this morning; I won one and bubbled the other with a little too much aggression when I ran into Q♣Q♦with my 10♠5♠ :)o). After I finished them off, I was just skimming through my STT stats in PokerTracker, and it got me thinking about the importance of staying aggressive on the bubble (which in turn gives you a much better chance of finishing first rather than second or third).

Let's look at a couple examples for $10 10-seater STTs (which are very general and unrealistic just to illustrate my point). Each player has managed to get to the top four 50 times.

Payouts are as follows:

$50 for first place
$30 for second place
$20 for third place
$0 for fourth place

First we have a player who's stats suggest that he's pretty weak-tight on the bubble, but has still managed to squeek into third place 35 times, and bubbled 15 times:

1) 0
2) 0
3) 35
4) 15

Total prizes:

(0*$50)+(0*$30)+(35*$20)+(15*10) = $700

Looks good, but let's take a look at someone who's been much more aggressive on the bubble, and has built his stack every game to a point where he's a strong contender for 1st. Let's say he placed:

1) 25
2) 0
3) 0
4) 25

Total prizes:

(25*$50)+(0*$30)+(0*$20)+(25*0) = $1250

So even though player 2 bubbled 10 more games, and placed in 10 fewer games than player 1, he still managed to make %180 the prizes of player 1. Like I said, these are pretty unrealistic examples, and the actual difference between a weak-tight and an aggressive player's profits won't be as much, but it is still huge.

Aggressive bubble play is essential in having any contention for first place unless you're a cardrack who somehow manages to have a massive stack every time the bubble comes (in which case you would actually have more of a reason to push people around).

This also applies to MTTs and final tabling, but I'm way too lazy to do any crazy calc's on that.

-ChuckTs
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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lol...:eek:

Shoulda reread the damn thing with all you sickos here :/
 
jayneseo

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I feel I may have started an avalanche :)
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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I agree completely, titans. It's a waste of time to try to limp into the money IMO. Regarding your link, I think the 'best' SnGs to play would depend on your style. I personally have much more experience with STTs rather than 2+ table SnGs, which is why I do so much better in them.

Some people know how to build a huge stack for MTT SnGs, others know how to rip through players on the bubble of an STT. I think it's a matter of personal preference.

I just realized my examples are kind of poor...here's a little bit of a better illustration:

$50 for first place
$30 for second place
$20 for third place
$0 for fourth place

Player who plays for ITM finishes:

1) 0
2) 0
3) 50

Total prizes:

(0*$50)+(0*$30)+(50*$20) = $1000


Player who goes for the gusto:

To make the same amount in prizes w/first places only:

(X*50)+0+0 = $1000
50X = $1000
X = 20

So someone with an ROI of %100 but only 3rd place finishes would make the same profit as someone with an ROI of only %40 (only :p) and who would only finish in 1st.

kk that's kind of a shitty example, too. I think you guys get my point, though. Play to win!
 
JimboJim

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Just a little stat to help with your point. The other day I played 5 $10 SnG's. Finished 2nd in 2 and bubbled 3. Sounds like I still should be profiting but if I count the entry fee that Stars takes I'm down $1.

A couple days before that I played in 7 $10 SnG's. I place 1st in 2 and bubbled 5. I'm up $13 after the entry fees.
 
LuckyShark777

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Great post Chuck this really helped me open my eyes, now I will be even more agressive come bubble time!
 
Debi

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Good food for thought - could be the difference in winning and losing on a smaller scale. I am often happy just to get to the money and probably only break even in sng's at this point, maybe even slightly down.
 
Stefanicov

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It is all about winning i play 18s and only way to be profitable long term is a lot of hds up apperances. 3rd or 4th just dont cut it long term as real money is at the top:D
 
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