BluffMeAllIn
4evrInmyheart RIP xoxo :(
Silver Level
hey fletch, i don't grind no 18+ tables but I would suggest you at least cut your # of tables in half if your moving up a limit just to allow yourself some extra thinking time as well as have a bit more focuse to get the feel for yourself of how different it is.
Obviously to play 18+ tables your stacking right? Not a fan of stacking myself so have only played a max of 12 tables at 2 no limit to this point and I'm sure in time I could add more but not sure if I would want to really with tiling (that might change, i run more stt's and mtt's than 12 sometimes without much issue, but those are not 6max). I'm sure overtime it will improve but find as it stands 9 tables sometimes takes all my time and attention with 6max cash.
Have you ever done any comparison of # of tables to actual winrate to see if perhaps you may have bypassed a sweetspot where you could be making more $$/hour due to the usual winrate/100 decrease as you add lots of tables?
Just thought would throw a few questions at ya haha, good luck on your move to 5nl and I would certainly as I said at least cut your tables count in half to start out and adjust from there as you get some volume in to see how you handle the differences.
Obviously to play 18+ tables your stacking right? Not a fan of stacking myself so have only played a max of 12 tables at 2 no limit to this point and I'm sure in time I could add more but not sure if I would want to really with tiling (that might change, i run more stt's and mtt's than 12 sometimes without much issue, but those are not 6max). I'm sure overtime it will improve but find as it stands 9 tables sometimes takes all my time and attention with 6max cash.
Have you ever done any comparison of # of tables to actual winrate to see if perhaps you may have bypassed a sweetspot where you could be making more $$/hour due to the usual winrate/100 decrease as you add lots of tables?
Just thought would throw a few questions at ya haha, good luck on your move to 5nl and I would certainly as I said at least cut your tables count in half to start out and adjust from there as you get some volume in to see how you handle the differences.
RodneyC86
Visionary
Silver Level
Ya know, I've been doing the same thing at 2NL since end of last month and so far chalked up 10-11 bb/100 over 45k hands playing 12 tables 6 max. I also have a bankroll good enough to take on 10NL but after my meltdown at 25NL and another devastation at 10 with a 30BI downwing, I felt something's probably wrong and decide to start from the groundup, maybe I'm a stalk of wheat that tipped over.
Planning to stick around until all my decisions are automatic, even vs regs. If there is one place regs that are easy to exploit, this is it... Easy to bluff out, easy to float, easily scared when OOP, and some are obviously disciples of blackrain but never adjust to regs.
Maybe moving up after around 200k hands. Then I will try exactly the same (with respect to exploiting)
at 5nl and see how it runs. Yeah some people might say there is nothing to learn from this but I disagree. 2NL is the best place to learn to deal with wtf tilt-inducing results and exercise in discipline to not play fancy when there is NO indication to do so.
Wax on, wax off.
Also, to people who bash on people who grind 2nl for a living. Don't. There are plenty of countries that has such weak currency that grinding a good win rate at 2nl mass multitasking actually makes more money than a standard job at a store. I know I'm making more grinding 2NL than if I worked as a cashier anywhere, and Malaysia is not exactly dirt poor country either. I'd imagine 2nl wins is huge for a big group of people out there.
fletchdad
Jammin................
Loyaler
Thanks for the comments and views.
Yea, I stack. I use the beta MT AHK that stars offers. I was given some scripts for the standard AHK program, but didnt quite get the hang of using them, but I want (need) to figure out what I am doing wrong. The AHK beta at stars is ok, but very buggy. Still, it is better than nothing Without any type of AHK, stacking loads of tables is a disaster.
I need to get into my HEM DB and do a LOT of research. ATM I am ONLY playing, and reviewing some hands that stick in my memory. It is funny, I dont have a lot of questions. When I look at the hands, the mistakes I made, well, its like it is in huge bold headline print. I am amused @myself for making mistakes in the heat of the moment that are so blatantly obvious upon later review.
When I move up - and I have done a sesh or 2 where I played some higher levels - I will probably start at 8-10 tables and add as I get used to the level. I have read that 5nl and 2nl are like twins, with one simply weighing more..lol. I dont know what the popular consensus about this is, but when I have a good sample of 5nl under the belt, I will weigh in with my thoughts.
Yea, I stack. I use the beta MT AHK that stars offers. I was given some scripts for the standard AHK program, but didnt quite get the hang of using them, but I want (need) to figure out what I am doing wrong. The AHK beta at stars is ok, but very buggy. Still, it is better than nothing Without any type of AHK, stacking loads of tables is a disaster.
I need to get into my HEM DB and do a LOT of research. ATM I am ONLY playing, and reviewing some hands that stick in my memory. It is funny, I dont have a lot of questions. When I look at the hands, the mistakes I made, well, its like it is in huge bold headline print. I am amused @myself for making mistakes in the heat of the moment that are so blatantly obvious upon later review.
When I move up - and I have done a sesh or 2 where I played some higher levels - I will probably start at 8-10 tables and add as I get used to the level. I have read that 5nl and 2nl are like twins, with one simply weighing more..lol. I dont know what the popular consensus about this is, but when I have a good sample of 5nl under the belt, I will weigh in with my thoughts.
Keith_MM
Legend
Silver Level
long term , i don't think you can mass multitable 6max and move up quickly. with FR its easier as you get more time er hand to make a decision and players ranges are tighter generally. As you move up in 6max auto piloting lots of tables is likely to get exploited , especially when you get to the light 3 and 4betting , bluff raising etc and you don't have time to remember how the action has gone up to that point , let alone think how to react.
micromachine
Legend
Silver Level
I agree. I was OK mass multi tabling 2nl and 5nl but when I tried it at 10nl I ran into trouble. Now I'm playing 4 tables of 6max and my win rate at 5nl is vastly improved, probably to the point where my hourly is the same or better than when I was playing 12 tables. Moreover, I play better and enjoy it a lot more.
Poker Orifice
FoolsTilt
Platinum Level
I just screenshot it. (shows hand #)
I also have wordpad opened & do a quick copy/paste HH.
idk with 20 tables though... with a dozen it is manageable
fletchdad
Jammin................
Loyaler
@Keith and machine, I hear ya. I guess its one reason why I set my $ amount at 500 (!!!, yea. lol I know) before I leave 2nl. My playing is BE the last 7-8k hands, probably due to a death in the family and poker is taking a backseat, and the playing I have done the last 5 days has been less than optimal. But I am over the 400$ mark and, really, it is just so new for me to be a consistent winner, that I dont want to give it up yet. Silly probably, and I have been warned about getting into habits that will be bad at higher stakes.
Soon I will hit 5nl, and I am also gonna take the same attitude as at 2nl (and continue this attitude for every stake I play, at least until I see a reason to act otherwise), meaning, I will not set a BR limit as my point of moving up, but rather I must be a consistent winner for a large-ish sample size before I move up. This also means that I will always be overrolled, but I am guessing that is good. I already notice at 2nl that a bad beat almost doesent matter. My roll can take it. I have guys who will stay in with any A, any draw, and if they hit they let you know. These players are so bad, their cards really are face up. And I value bet them as big as I want, they call to the river then fold or shove if they hit. There are a couple I play regular, and they really are this transparent. And while it is irritating, I can shrug it off with a chuckle, as it really is a variance that my BR can laugh off, if that makes sense.
I guess I also have to enjoy that type of player, since they will certainly be less abundant in higher stakes......
Soon I will hit 5nl, and I am also gonna take the same attitude as at 2nl (and continue this attitude for every stake I play, at least until I see a reason to act otherwise), meaning, I will not set a BR limit as my point of moving up, but rather I must be a consistent winner for a large-ish sample size before I move up. This also means that I will always be overrolled, but I am guessing that is good. I already notice at 2nl that a bad beat almost doesent matter. My roll can take it. I have guys who will stay in with any A, any draw, and if they hit they let you know. These players are so bad, their cards really are face up. And I value bet them as big as I want, they call to the river then fold or shove if they hit. There are a couple I play regular, and they really are this transparent. And while it is irritating, I can shrug it off with a chuckle, as it really is a variance that my BR can laugh off, if that makes sense.
I guess I also have to enjoy that type of player, since they will certainly be less abundant in higher stakes......
fletchdad
Jammin................
Loyaler
OK, have about 10-11k at 5nl. Aint going back, unless I have to.
Here is a graph shot, the spike at the end is all 5nl.... lol FOAH
Sure feels good, tho...
I will update more soon. I have marked some hands as well. I am playing 12 tables tops, and sometimes 8 max, it all depends. I have made a number of adjustments in my journey through 2nl, and am playing much different now then I was 100K hands ago.
Here is a graph shot, the spike at the end is all 5nl.... lol FOAH
Sure feels good, tho...
I will update more soon. I have marked some hands as well. I am playing 12 tables tops, and sometimes 8 max, it all depends. I have made a number of adjustments in my journey through 2nl, and am playing much different now then I was 100K hands ago.
Attachments
Aces2w1n
Legend
Silver Level
Nice man hopefully my 4nl graph will look like that after 100k hands... since I failed the above levels twice im gonna just stay where I'm winning hopefully and see if I can build a roll that way with pure patience *grinding* and move up when I have a lot more behind me and take a lot longer for me to start to panic.
Aces2w1n
Legend
Silver Level
Well done... I think I have you to blame though fletch. I got the idea off you not following standard BRM and just sticking at a level I can beat and watch my BRM climb.
Might even consider a 200 buyin BRM... 4nl I don't know I just had the 150-200 figure in my head after thinking of grinding the rest of the year at one level... I'm sick of stressing about losing my roll at the higher levels and hopefully my graph will look like yours I believe my 4nl is climbing just fine like urs...
Keep up the good work man keep posting and if u need anything don't hesitate to ask
Might even consider a 200 buyin BRM... 4nl I don't know I just had the 150-200 figure in my head after thinking of grinding the rest of the year at one level... I'm sick of stressing about losing my roll at the higher levels and hopefully my graph will look like yours I believe my 4nl is climbing just fine like urs
...Keep up the good work man keep posting and if u need anything don't hesitate to ask
B
bernotas22
Legend
Silver Level
yeah but if you can't beat the higher level as well your hourly might even go negative and I think having 200bi is good if you want to feel real comfortable and only move up when you truly feel you are ready
duggs
Killing me softly
Silver Level
200bi is absurd, 100bi is considered extremely conservative and outrageous for non professionals. You learn faster moving up stakes, and there is no reason someone beating 2nl can't reasonably beat 10nl for a similar rate.
micromachine
Legend
Silver Level
Agree, agree, agree
Disagree, 2nl != 10nl. If someone beating 2nl at 5bb/100 moved straight up to 10nl I very much doubt they would initially achieve the same win rate unless they went on a heater.
duggs
Killing me softly
Silver Level
Not instantly, but it shouldn't be super hard, in your case based on reading your analysis I think it's almost entirely a tilt thing
Aces2w1n
Legend
Silver Level
good post... it reminds me to not be too goal orientated tho sometimes it just feels like I'm going nowhere and hitting my head up against the wall.. But then I fall back to Sit n go's and lower stakes and realise how much I've advanced.
fletchdad
Jammin................
Loyaler
sad update......
I will just link to a post that, in spite of its irony, is unfortunately based on what really happened....
https://www.cardschat.com/forum/bad...ll-rigged-roads-lead-297777/post-2349601.html
Plus side is, I am still rolled for 5nl, (40BI) but may punish myself by playing the next 10K at 2nl. Wish I could do that after Indian food and 4 liters of beer......... I only know it was 25nl through my HEM history.....
I will just link to a post that, in spite of its irony, is unfortunately based on what really happened....
https://www.cardschat.com/forum/bad...ll-rigged-roads-lead-297777/post-2349601.html
Plus side is, I am still rolled for 5nl, (40BI) but may punish myself by playing the next 10K at 2nl. Wish I could do that after Indian food and 4 liters of beer......... I only know it was 25nl through my HEM history.....
