Donk shove?

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Gorblimey

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$2-$5 NLH; full table. Hero open raises 10bbs utg with AK. Only the loose aggressive hijack calls. Flop is K33. Hero bets the pot and villain raises! Should this be a fold or call? What about a shove? I got it wrong and wanna learn why so I don't repeat the double blunder.
 
RustyRed83

RustyRed83

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Are you the hero?

Without really known how the villain has played in previous hands, which would probably help with my decision in this spot.

10BB raise is a bit over the top with AK. I dunno how much you have left behind. But you are potentitally leaving yourself pot committed, regardless, of the flop, with such a big raise. That is a good flop for AK, if villain is a loose player, then his raise is an instant call. I don't see any other play. Let me guess, he had A3? If so, he should never be called such a big pre-flop raise with that hand. But i don't think you could have got away from the hand.
 
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emzadii

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This is a situation when it becomes villain-dependent. In my experience, I've seen in-position villains call big preflop raises from UTG with KQ, QQ and nonsense hands like 3x. And I've seen in-position villains raise the flop with Kx, middle pocket pairs, and 3x (assuming rainbow flop). Knowing the villain is a big deal here. Hero notes that the villain in LAG, so the play is to call and let him keep betting. If he has the 3x, then such is life, but there are so few 3x combos versus so many Kx and pocket pairs combos to justify calling. And if hero notes that villain is loose-agg AND sticky, or a loose-agg AND a gambler, then re-raising/shoving is the play either on the flop or a safe turn. This has worked for me.

But if villain is the LAG type that never raises, or usually raises small but now raises huge, alarm bells should be ringing here and the play is to call and proceed with extreme caution with a hand that is now a bluff-catcher instead of a premium-made.

In a vacuum, though, if there isn't enough info on the villain, then it's still a call on the flop, and try to get to showdown cheaply.
 
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Gorblimey

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This is a situation when it becomes villain-dependent. In my experience, I've seen in-position villains call big preflop raises from UTG with KQ, QQ and nonsense hands like 3x. And I've seen in-position villains raise the flop with Kx, middle pocket pairs, and 3x (assuming rainbow flop). Knowing the villain is a big deal here. Hero notes that the villain in LAG, so the play is to call and let him keep betting. If he has the 3x, then such is life, but there are so few 3x combos versus so many Kx and pocket pairs combos to justify calling. And if hero notes that villain is loose-agg AND sticky, or a loose-agg AND a gambler, then re-raising/shoving is the play either on the flop or a safe turn. This has worked for me.

But if villain is the LAG type that never raises, or usually raises small but now raises huge, alarm bells should be ringing here and the play is to call and proceed with extreme caution with a hand that is now a bluff-catcher instead of a premium-made.

In a vacuum, though, if there isn't enough info on the villain, then it's still a call on the flop, and try to get to showdown cheaply.
This V was seen to be limping a rather large number of hands; upwards of 40% I'd imagine. The site doesn't permit HUDs. I was 400 bbs effective and V had me easily covered. V did not make a huge flop raise so it was harder to read but must admit my re-raise shove was based more on emotion as opposed to calm, cool calculation. But as pointed out, I was likely committed to seeing a showdown regardless. The V showed up with off-suited 3,5 handing me a very painful loss. Loads of fun playing with the looney tunes gallery! Smh
 
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Rmi

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The donk bet is a very bad move, who knows how to play does not use those strategies that are bad to discover the strength of the opponent's hand. Speaking of the opening to 10 BB, I don't see the point of such a thing. and as for the villain's 3bet before a folded board: all that K that is making that move is worse than yours, all the remaining middle pairs are being won, there would only be AA pair that may be playing like this.
 
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plusia

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for me this is rather a fold , most probably i am beat
 
rastapapolos

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For me it's a call. There isn't much that can threat your hand. If you raise or jam, villain could fold. So let it be aggressive.
If however there is a flush draw you can chase him out by jamming.
 
lukaszkrzi

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It depends on the read you have on the villain, as well as your own stack size and the dynamics of the hand.

If the villain is a very loose and aggressive player, it's possible that they are raising with a weaker hand like a pocket pair or a lower suited connector. In this case, a call might be a reasonable option.

However, if the villain is a more skilled player who is raising with a hand like KQ or a set, then it may be better to fold.

A shove would generally be a bad option in this situation, as it would commit a significant portion of your stack and give the villain good odds to call with a weaker hand.

It's important to remember that the flop does not change the strength of the AK hand and you can still be behind a lot of the time. Also, you should consider the position of the villain, the size of the raise, and the size of your stack before taking the decision.
 
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